Just a little funny rule bending

[Max_Dammit]

So you'd like to put a strength 10 unit on the table?

 

Take a WG, he's S4

give him a frostblade, making him S5

Now give him a power fist and his powerfists atacks have double S, making him S10

 

Now go in the rule book and destroy this thought ASAP :)

[Toasterfree]

you only get the s5 from a frost blade when you use it. its not a passive addidtion. if it was that would be awesome. alas if this were the case it would only be s9 since your PF modifies base str, again when you use it

[VorpalDoom]

RAW this works yes, as purchasing a frost blade grants +1 s, not just when using the frost blade.

However, clearly not intended, and I'm sure anyone who plays against you would scoff at the idea.

 

 

You can achieve S10 with any model on a thunderwolf mount, and I've done with great success with a single model as a FA choice w/ SS/TH... amazing really, and entirely devastating.

 

Doing so is legit, within the intended rules, and much more awesome than a guy with a fist and an axe.

[Toasterfree]

RAW this works yes, as purchasing a frost blade grants +1 s, not just when using the frost blade.

However, clearly not intended, and I'm sure anyone who plays against you would scoff at the idea.

 

 

You can achieve S10 with any model on a thunderwolf mount, and I've done with great success with a single model as a FA choice w/ SS/TH... amazing really, and entirely devastating.

 

Doing so is legit, within the intended rules, and much more awesome than a guy with a fist and an axe.

...weapons that add +1 to user's strength.

you have to use it to get the bonus RAW.

[nurglespuss]

How do you get strength 10 on a thunderwolf? are you really (Really?!) telling me its what the rules intend, that the rider and mount both grip the hammer at the same time, and swing it together to get the bonus?

 

Try that around here, and I think it would be you that would be scoffed at :) its a shame that FAQ's are necessary to get rid of this sillyness and that players can't be sensible enough to sort it for themselves!

[Toasterfree]

How do you get strength 10 on a thunderwolf? are you really (Really?!) telling me its what the rules intend, that the rider and mount both grip the hammer at the same time, and swing it together to get the bonus?

 

Try that around here, and I think it would be you that would be scoffed at :) its a shame that FAQ's are necessary to get rid of this sillyness and that players can't be sensible enough to sort it for themselves!

TWC and TWM lord are s5, add thunderhammer or PF and whammo s10

[Prototype]

No matter how you look at it, I'm sure GW intended the +1S to only happen if you use the Frost Blade....

[Toasterfree]

No matter how you look at it, I'm sure GW intended the +1S to only happen if you use the Frost Blade....

yes, and if you also look at old dex (please someone quote me here) it was the same way

[Max_Dammit]

you have to use it to get the bonus RAW.

 

It doesnt say that in the SW book

It says ads +1 to S, not +1 to all attacks made by frostblade

The fist does say all attacks made by powerfist are double strength

 

But like i sayed its just a bit of fun and id NEVER use it

[Toasterfree]

...weapons that add +1 to user's strength.

you have to use it to get the bonus RAW.

it does say you have to use it. if you are not a USER how are you getting a benefit from something just sitting there. if you are a USER then your getting the benefit.

[Grey Mage]

So you'd like to put a strength 10 unit on the table?

 

Take a WG, he's S4

give him a frostblade, making him S5

Now give him a power fist and his powerfists atacks have double S, making him S10

 

Now go in the rule book and destroy this thought ASAP :)

Close combat weapons like that dont stack- pg 42 says you have to choose one to use. And on top of it you cant gain a +1 attack bonus, ever.

 

And to forstall the inane comment some people have said about wether or not you can just get the bonus for having the equipment, think again- pg 42, top left hand side says under the heading Special Close Combat Weapons

 

...and confer bonuses, and sometimes penalties, to the models using them.

 

You must be "using" the weapon in order to gaint he bonus.

 

Good try though max!

[Max_Dammit]

Like i sayd, destroy it ASAP :)

[Grey Mage]

Kill it, kill it with fire? :).

 

I do the same thing all the time.

[Marek Grimfang]

Use it next time you play against Dark Angels.

[Vassakov]

As has quite correctly been stated, a Frostblade only works when you choose to use it. It is not a passive upgrade.

 

TWC however, is. The more pressing issue is if it is a Bike T upgrade, or a Juggernought style upgrade (ie a permament stat increase.)

[DV8]

How do you get strength 10 on a thunderwolf? are you really (Really?!) telling me its what the rules intend, that the rider and mount both grip the hammer at the same time, and swing it together to get the bonus?

 

Try that around here, and I think it would be you that would be scoffed at :tu: its a shame that FAQ's are necessary to get rid of this sillyness and that players can't be sensible enough to sort it for themselves!

 

Thunder Wolf Cavalry are S5 base (their profile is S5, not S4(5)). Unless amended, wielding Thunderhammers makes them S10, and they still benefit from Rending (redundant, but whatever).

 

Thunder Wolf Mounts is a different matter entirely.

 

 

DV8

[Toasterfree]

How do you get strength 10 on a thunderwolf? are you really (Really?!) telling me its what the rules intend, that the rider and mount both grip the hammer at the same time, and swing it together to get the bonus?

 

Try that around here, and I think it would be you that would be scoffed at :) its a shame that FAQ's are necessary to get rid of this sillyness and that players can't be sensible enough to sort it for themselves!

 

Thunder Wolf Cavalry are S5 base (their profile is S5, not S4(5)). Unless amended, wielding Thunderhammers makes them S10, and they still benefit from Rending (redundant, but whatever).

 

Thunder Wolf Mounts is a different matter entirely.

 

 

DV8

where in the description does a TWM say that it adds to the characteristic? it doesnt. it says TO PROFILE if its adding to profile that means it takes effect before anything, because you are modifying a base. you are changing what he is. TWM work in no way like FC does where you add the +1 str AFTER weapon effects. it goes BEFORE weapon effects. so a lord on a TWM is a TRUE s5 t5 a5

 

How do you get strength 10 on a thunderwolf? are you really (Really?!) telling me its what the rules intend, that the rider and mount both grip the hammer at the same time, and swing it together to get the bonus?

 

Try that around here, and I think it would be you that would be scoffed at :) its a shame that FAQ's are necessary to get rid of this sillyness and that players can't be sensible enough to sort it for themselves!

the only reason that FAQs are necessary is because people cannot read

[nurglespuss]

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear... I've said the sensible thing, I'll just sit back and wait for the inevitable FAQ that'll make you feel daft :)

[Toasterfree]

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear... I've said the sensible thing, I'll just sit back and wait for the inevitable FAQ that'll make you feel daft :)

why would it do that, when you modify the profile you change s4 to s5. thinking otherwise is daft

[DV8]

where in the description does a TWM say that it adds to the characteristic? it doesnt. it says TO PROFILE if its adding to profile that means it takes effect before anything, because you are modifying a base. you are changing what he is. TWM work in no way like FC does where you add the +1 str AFTER weapon effects. it goes BEFORE weapon effects. so a lord on a TWM is a TRUE s5 t5 a5

 

Like I said, it's a different matter entirely from Thunder Wolf Cavalry.

 

Unfortunately this is I believe one of the few instances where a specific mount or piece of wargear has added to the profile, instead of a simple addition to the characteristic (Chaos mounts I believe do, or at one point did the same). And Games Workshop has made no clarification on the differentiation between adding to a profile, and adding to a characteristic, so your argument that "adding to the profile takes place before anything" is without merit unless you can quote the rule or precedence for it.

 

I'm inclined to agree with you, and I do believe that Thunder Wolf Mounts adjust the character's stats to S5, T5 A5, and not simply S4(5) T4(5) A4(5). However you run into the problem that you're interpreting "adds...to his profile", and you will run into people who will argue otherwise. And neither side can say for certain, 100%, without equivocation, argument, doubt or uncertainty, that either side is correct (or incorrect, whatever).

 

 

DV8

[Gentlemanloser]

Page 7 of the Rulebook. <_<

 

The TWM gives an add. A PF/TH doubles it.

 

There's no need to worry about base stats, add to profiles, etc (As *every* bit of wargear giving a plus to a stat adds to someones profile....)

 

The Wargear gives an addition, which comes after a multiplcation.

 

So S9 PF/TH. :teehee:

[Veldrik]

I'm thinking (when the models come out) of popping in a unit of thunderwolf calvalry now - S5 base with power fists would be fun to put on the table - would go nicely with my 3 lone wolves ;)

 

Elites

lone wolf

lone wolf

lone wolf

Fast Atack

1x Thunderwolf cavalry (1 with power fist)

1x Thunderwolf cavalry (1 with power fist)

1x Thunderwolf cavalry (1 with power fist)

 

at 75 pts a unit, thats alot of S10 rending attacks ;) (although, its a kill point per unit unless there is redundancy added)

 

BTW - on a similar note, I was thinking about

Thunderwolf cavalry (Mark of Wolfen and 2x Storm Shields).

Would make a fun model to make/paint, and lets face it he doesn't need a weapon :) second shield might not do much, but hey, I don't think the little space wolf would mind that much.

[Gentlemanloser]

I'd stear clear of a MotW on TWC. For an increase in cost, you're trading Rending on a Potenail Secial Close Combat weapon and 4 attacks, for d6+1 (so an average of 4...) and you lose Rending on Special Close Combat Weapons.

 

It's like buying Storm Bolters for Sternguard.