Midgard Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 As I am currently looking to start a Chaos Undivided force, it seems to me that with Chaos, it may make sense to build it around HQ character with special abilities. Although I am yet to get the Codex, I have a basic idea of what each of the characters does, but am not quite yet decided on which character, if any, I should built it around. I have asked about the Chaos Legion force to choose here earlier, and think that I am mostly decided on that (see below), but if HQ suggestions do point at a different force from my initial choice, I would be quite willing to reconsider. I am not looking for an uber-beardy-cheesy-power-gaming list, but would like it to remain at least somewhat competitive - not necessarily tournament quality, but for the list to remain fun on the tabletop, and for it to work with storyline campaigns. Right now, I am thinking Alpha Legion, although the Black Legion and the Iron Warriors remain secondary possibilities; Night Lords are another army I like, but I think they would play too similar to my Raven Guard due to reliance on many of the same tactics. Although I like the Thousand Sons fluff, I don't want to have a single-god army, so they are clearly out; the Word Bearers are yet another possibility. I would like to maintain a balance between shooty and CC army, and while I realize it will not be the most powerful Chaos force out there by any means, it should still be reasonably fun to play. I do want to avoid the Plague Marines - I am just not a Nurgle fan, and for my Troops choices, I would much rather stick with traditional Chaos Space Marines; I feel it is more "fluffy" for what I am trying to do, and I would like to keep at least some adherence to fluff. So, which HQ characters would you suggest, and why? I could naturally have a "counts-as" Abaddon, or even a "counts-as" Ahriman (after all, AL was known to use sorcerers, if DOW is any indication - providing it is considered canon to at least some extent), but would I be better served by a "nameless" Chaos Lord/Sorcerer, especially in keeping with a theme of an Alpha Legion army? Of course, if I were to have a change of heart and decide to play the Black Legion, Abaddon is pretty much a given, but what would I do in an Iron Warriors scenario? What kind of an HQ character would fit with the Word Bearers army? As always, any input is highly appreciated! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnar Lodbrok Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 I personally find CSM Characters to be too much of a point sink except Khârn. You will get more out of a DP or Chaos Lord then you usually will out of a character especially regarding price. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2173801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Vader Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Fabius Bile, three Chaos Dreadnoughts and a bunch of Bile's altered marines in Rhinos. I have no idea how competitive it will be (probably not), but it will be fluffy, absolutely bonkers and very random and chaotic. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2173866 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 I've found either a lord with a daemon weapon or Huron in "count-as" form to work just fine like this. Huron especially provides punch to a 9 man CSM squad in a rhino as a replacement aspiring champ. I've also seen a Bile force to be effective and fun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2173903 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Void Stalkers Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 I agree with Huron Blackheart. With a heavyflamer, power weapon, power fist and warptime, he can takel almost anything. He is 170 points. I always run him in a squad with a flamer and powerfist weilding aspiring Champion, to date i belive he has killed a fire prism, a farseer, 2 dark reapers (including an Exarch) and bout 8 guardians. All in within 2 turns. He is a good deal IMO just my thoughts! tootaloo Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2173938 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 it may make sense to build it around HQ character with special abilities. Actually most good csm armies are really built (mostly) around troops ( boring, over done, dual lash spam being the exception). HQ is almost there in a supporting roll...that's the way I see it anyway. I agree w/ the others that blackheart is the only special I would consider solid, but his lack of flight makes me not use him. Khârn might be good for a goof, but I wouldn't build an army around him. Abby is awesome but very expensive and needs a LR. None of the others are really worth considering (except for fluff reasons). Most people just build their own lord, sorc, or DP (wings always). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2174045 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midgard Posted November 4, 2009 Author Share Posted November 4, 2009 Good points all, thank you for your input! By the way, I have failed to mention that at this point I am looking at roughly 1,000 point force build, which can be later expanded, and I would like to keep it more "fluffy" than competitive - from this perspective, if I am to do an Alpha Legion force, "counts-as" Huron might be the fluffiest choice HQ, unless I build it around my own Chaos Lord or Sorcerer. Would you think it is a reasonable choice in terms of point cost, abilities, and utility on the tabletop? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2174865 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Void Stalkers Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 hrm.... The most I can do is this: Huron- power weapon, power fist, warptime, heavy flamer, familiar, and a personal icon all for 170 regular chaos lord 90pts- power weapon 15 pts, power fist 25 pts, (only one or the other) personal icon 5 pts the lord can not take a heavy flamer or warptime, if he could.... the final points cost would be roughly 185 pts or so. the sorcerer can take warptime and a familiar, but no power fist, no power weapon, no heavy flamer. demon prince can take warptime, his strength is higher, can take wings, for about 155 to 160 and no one can take armor saves against his attacks. but is a very large target. if your HQ eats up too much points in your list..... I would go with the sorcerer. but in terms of points .... I think Huron is a good buy Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2175112 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Please do not list individual point values on the forum. Point totals are fine though. Don't forget the Sorcerer Lords have a Force blade which does in fact count as a power weapon with a bonus. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2175359 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Void Stalkers Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 ooo, sorry about tht! Fail, I forgot about the Force weapon being a power one as well. Hrm.. with that in mind you might want to just go with the sorcerer for 1000 pt games, then break out Huron for anything bigger. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2175374 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Yeah, for 1k games I just use sorc- wings, doombolt = 130pts Decient in hth, usefull shooty pwr, mobile, and "free" PW. But best off all he's cheap, leaving the most pts for troops. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/183882-chaos-undivided-builds/#findComment-2175396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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