Ramming? Why does it even exist?

[thade]

Land Raider (front armor 14) vs the weakest possible armor (10). It moves 12" (+4), is a tank (+1), and has 4 more armor (+4) for a total Str 9 hit.

 

Completely. Useless.

 

If it's Open Topped, you get a +1, right? So that's *something*. If you're on a road (when does that happen?) you could move 18", getting a Strength 11 hit. Even then, why would you bother, unless you had no weapons left and no use for a behemoth transport?

 

I suppose while the damage is completely meaningless (in almost all cases I can imagine), it does allow you to break the "models cannot be placed within 1" of enemy models" rule, which could prevent a tank from moving maybe, or block enemy infantry from passing, or embarking/disembarking.

 

Has anyone ever used Ramming with any effect? I wonder what?

[Brother_Kluft]

I lost best general at a small tourney once due to ramming.

 

Eldar skimmer shoots off 24 inches to ram my iron clad. Death or glory? Hells yes with a seismic hammer and auto hitting. (str 10 ap 1 auto hit vs armour 12)

 

Rolled a 1 on my pen roll for a total of 11. EPIC fail.

 

Skimmer gets a str 10 hit on back armour (thats what happens when walkers fail death or glory) and blows up my ironclad.

 

Even though I lost best general, I can still appreciate how awesome that was. (the fact that I won best overall didnt hurt either ;) )

[KhorneHunter57x]

Land Raider (front armor 14) vs the weakest possible armor (10). It moves 12" (+4), is a tank (+1), and has 4 more armor (+4) for a total Str 9 hit.

 

Completely. Useless.

 

If it's Open Topped, you get a +1, right? So that's *something*. If you're on a road (when does that happen?) you could move 18", getting a Strength 11 hit. Even then, why would you bother, unless you had no weapons left and no use for a behemoth transport?

 

I suppose while the damage is completely meaningless (in almost all cases I can imagine), it does allow you to break the "models cannot be placed within 1" of enemy models" rule, which could prevent a tank from moving maybe, or block enemy infantry from passing, or embarking/disembarking.

 

Has anyone ever used Ramming with any effect? I wonder what?

 

It is useful in certain conditions (Shaken, All Weapons Destroyed), and consider that even if you are moving 12" with said Land Raider, the target must be at least a AV 13 Tank (or AV 14 non-tank) to hurt you.

 

I love ramming with my Land Raiders. It totally fits with the fluff and nothing is funner than smashing aside light vehicles that happen to shake your Rolling Slab 'o Death.

 

The funnest time I had with it was against a friend's Black Templars. He had positioned his Rhino sideways in front of his Land Raider Crusader. I rammed it (my LRC was shaken) and squished the Rhino between his LRC and mine. It was wrecked and it is one of my best 40k memories.

[I AM THE AWESOME]

Let me introduce you to this vehicle over here. It's called a Battlewagon.

[jokester120]

yeah i dont see much use to ramming in the game hardly dose anything

 

Let me introduce you to this vehicle over here. It's called a Battlewagon.

even the battlewagon fails on a lucky roll

[Giga]

Land Raider (front armor 14) vs the weakest possible armor (10). It moves 12" (+4), is a tank (+1), and has 4 more armor (+4) for a total Str 9 hit.

 

Completely. Useless.

A lot of the time, a land raider without lascannons (if they've been blown off - it happens) is better off ramming stuff then sitting there and firing its heavy bolter. Str9 hit is nothing to ignore. :D

 

Anyway, ramming is made for rhinos!

 

Rhino 12 inch move is +4 str, then +1 str from armor, +1 str from being a tank, up to a str6 hit. That's the strongest single hit the rhino can do (short of hunter killer missiles) and using it I have immobilized and blown up other rhinos and chimeras multiple time (chimeras have side armor 10, means a rhino glances them on 4+!). Also, it's a really fun thing to do, and in many situations it's the only thing you can do with your rhino (apart from just sitting there and doing nothing).

 

A predator can do the same thing, only with a str8 hit, which is also pretty marvelous and quite useful if the opponent has gotten into your deployment zone and has shaken your predator. Blood angels are especially good at this, as their shaken baal predators can reach higher speeds then any other predators and really lay down the hurt with those rammings, hitting as hard as str10.

 

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

[Koremu]

I've blown up War Walkers with Rhino ramming. Sure, it doesn't work on anything with a serious armour value, but it does work on light stuff quite well. And what else were you going to do with an empty Rhino?

[Dezartfox]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

[Giga]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

Damn, you're right.

 

So I inadvertedly cheated in that one game. Bah. ;)

 

Though isn't it true that some skimmers (like eldar or tau tanks?) can ram after turbo-boosting? Or am I wrong there too?

[thade]

OMG!!!!! Of course!!!! I'm such a noob. I TOTALLY FORGOT YOU ROLL ARMOR PENETRATION WHEN RAMMING! (Caps on purpose; I really am yelling - in my brain. Because, I am in fact a noob.)

 

Wow, in that case, Str 9 is awesome. I'm going to be ramming all the time. =D

 

Right. I'm glad we had this talk.

 

p.s. Sorry about the yelling.

 

Though isn't it true that some skimmers (like eldar or tau tanks?) can ram after turbo-boosting? Or am I wrong there too?

 

It is true. Those skimmers for which it is true also have the "Tank" specifier under their Unit Type. =)

[Koremu]

I don't think the Tau have Fast Skimmer Tanks, do they?

[Starblayde]

Why does it exist? Because for years 40k payers have had tanks in close proximity to each other and thought "I want to ram it, but the rules don't let me. 'Bah!', I say!".

 

Otherwise, though, rolling an unlucky 1 in a crucial situation makes ramming pointless? Well in that case, so is Terminator armor, Artificer armour and a BS of 6 when you miss. ;)

[Brother_Kluft]

Just for reference Tau do not have any fast skimmer tanks. The multitracker upgrade lets them SHOOT as if they are fast vehicles, but thats it.

[thade]

Just for reference Tau do not have any fast skimmer tanks. The multitracker upgrade lets them SHOOT as if they are fast vehicles, but thats it.

 

Learn something new every day. =)

 

...

 

Can you fire weapons when you ram? I guess typically you couldn't (as you'd be moving over 6" for speed), except with PotMS. But is there a rule that says otherwise? If you do move under 6", just to get into base contact for some reason?

[Adeptus Titanicus]

You could use PotMS to fire a weapon after Ramming, but other than that its very rare to be able to do so. You have to move the full distance, always. I have watched as my Scorpion (with the Pulsars blown off), using Star Engines, rammed into a squadron of 3 Leman Russes, popped the first, popped the second, popped the third! It basically earn't its points back for the third time!

cam

[Kronk]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Landspeeders can't tank shock, because tank shock requires a tank.

 

However, I thought ALL vehicles can ram. Tanks simply get a +1. There might be a limitation against walkers, though. I'll check that tonight.

[Koremu]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Landspeeders can't tank shock, because tank shock requires a tank.

 

However, I thought ALL vehicles can ram. Tanks simply get a +1. There might be a limitation against walkers, though. I'll check that tonight.

Ramming is a specialised form of Tank Shock. The +1 for being a Tank therefore always applies to the Rammer, but might not apply to the victim.

[gdeathlegion]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Landspeeders can't tank shock, because tank shock requires a tank.

 

However, I thought ALL vehicles can ram. Tanks simply get a +1. There might be a limitation against walkers, though. I'll check that tonight.

Ramming is a specialised form of Tank Shock. The +1 for being a Tank therefore always applies to the Rammer, but might not apply to the victim.

 

 

This is not true, Kronk is correct. All vehicles can ram, but there is no point with a landspeeder the strength of the hit would be too low to really do damage at all, the speeder would probably just destroy itself....hehehe

 

If the vehicle is descibed as a tank in it's codex entry then it receives an auto +1 to the strength of the ram attack, just because it is so sturdily built.

[Grey Mage]

Land Raider (front armor 14) vs the weakest possible armor (10). It moves 12" (+4), is a tank (+1), and has 4 more armor (+4) for a total Str 9 hit.

 

Completely. Useless.

 

If it's Open Topped, you get a +1, right? So that's *something*. If you're on a road (when does that happen?) you could move 18", getting a Strength 11 hit. Even then, why would you bother, unless you had no weapons left and no use for a behemoth transport?

 

I suppose while the damage is completely meaningless (in almost all cases I can imagine), it does allow you to break the "models cannot be placed within 1" of enemy models" rule, which could prevent a tank from moving maybe, or block enemy infantry from passing, or embarking/disembarking.

 

Has anyone ever used Ramming with any effect? I wonder what?

Eldar Waveserpent- moves 36" in a single turn +12, is tank, +1, Armor 12 +2= technically a strength 15 hit. Heck, drop the extra 12" from star engines *as some disagree with this method* and you still have a strength 11 hit.

 

Tell me its not worth it to be able to ram that into the side armor of a warhound titan. Or that once its guns shot off you wouldnt take a strength 10 *maxedout* against an opponents landraider.

[DarkGuard]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Landspeeders can't tank shock, because tank shock requires a tank.

 

However, I thought ALL vehicles can ram. Tanks simply get a +1. There might be a limitation against walkers, though. I'll check that tonight.

Ramming is a specialised form of Tank Shock. The +1 for being a Tank therefore always applies to the Rammer, but might not apply to the victim.

 

 

This is not true, Kronk is correct. All vehicles can ram, but there is no point with a landspeeder the strength of the hit would be too low to really do damage at all, the speeder would probably just destroy itself....hehehe

 

If the vehicle is descibed as a tank in it's codex entry then it receives an auto +1 to the strength of the ram attack, just because it is so sturdily built.

 

Ramming is a special type of tank shock move... the tank must always move at the highest speed... ramming tank...

 

 

Tanks follow the normal rules for vehicles, with the additions and exceptions below.

 

Then it precedes to talk about the Tank Shock rules.

 

Ramming comes after Tank Shock rules, under the subsection of Tanks. When explaining a Ramming action the word tank is used, not vehicle.

 

Koremu is correct, Ramming is a specialised Tank Shock move that can only be performed by tanks, as only they have the mass to do so. The whole +1 to strength of ramming tank will apply to the ramming tank, but could apply to the vehicle it's ramming if it is a tank, as it is more resistant, or not apply if it is something like a Fast Skimmer, which is not a tank. A Landspeeder (and DE Raiders) are Fast Skimmers, not Tanks, therefore they cannot perform a Tank Shock or a Ramming action (which is essentially a Tank Shock on a vehicle).

[DarkGuard]

Land Raider (front armor 14) vs the weakest possible armor (10). It moves 12" (+4), is a tank (+1), and has 4 more armor (+4) for a total Str 9 hit.

 

Completely. Useless.

 

If it's Open Topped, you get a +1, right? So that's *something*. If you're on a road (when does that happen?) you could move 18", getting a Strength 11 hit. Even then, why would you bother, unless you had no weapons left and no use for a behemoth transport?

 

I suppose while the damage is completely meaningless (in almost all cases I can imagine), it does allow you to break the "models cannot be placed within 1" of enemy models" rule, which could prevent a tank from moving maybe, or block enemy infantry from passing, or embarking/disembarking.

 

Has anyone ever used Ramming with any effect? I wonder what?

Eldar Waveserpent- moves 36" in a single turn +12, is tank, +1, Armor 12 +2= technically a strength 15 hit. Heck, drop the extra 12" from star engines *as some disagree with this method* and you still have a strength 11 hit.

 

Tell me its not worth it to be able to ram that into the side armor of a warhound titan. Or that once its guns shot off you wouldnt take a strength 10 *maxedout* against an opponents landraider.

 

By 36" in one turn are you referring to Star Engines. I thought that the extra movement was only used in the Shooting phase, while Ramming takes place in the Movement phase. So the max distance a Wave Serpent can move for Ramming is 24" (flat out). Forgive me if I'm wrong.

 

Also, you can't get a stat above 10, Main Rulebook, page 6, near the bottom of the first column.

[Veldrik]

If all else fails, suicide rammings with turbo-boosting land speeders are always fun. Especially if they've gotten their multimeltas blown off (which often happens to my speeders).

Landspeeders can't ram, they're not a tank.

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Landspeeders can't tank shock, because tank shock requires a tank.

 

However, I thought ALL vehicles can ram. Tanks simply get a +1. There might be a limitation against walkers, though. I'll check that tonight.

Ramming is a specialised form of Tank Shock. The +1 for being a Tank therefore always applies to the Rammer, but might not apply to the victim.

 

 

This is not true, Kronk is correct. All vehicles can ram, but there is no point with a landspeeder the strength of the hit would be too low to really do damage at all, the speeder would probably just destroy itself....hehehe

 

If the vehicle is descibed as a tank in it's codex entry then it receives an auto +1 to the strength of the ram attack, just because it is so sturdily built.

 

Ramming is a special type of tank shock move... the tank must always move at the highest speed... ramming tank...

 

 

Tanks follow the normal rules for vehicles, with the additions and exceptions below.

 

Then it precedes to talk about the Tank Shock rules.

 

Ramming comes after Tank Shock rules, under the subsection of Tanks. When explaining a Ramming action the word tank is used, not vehicle.

 

Koremu is correct, Ramming is a specialised Tank Shock move that can only be performed by tanks, as only they have the mass to do so. The whole +1 to strength of ramming tank will apply to the ramming tank, but could apply to the vehicle it's ramming if it is a tank, as it is more resistant, or not apply if it is something like a Fast Skimmer, which is not a tank. A Landspeeder (and DE Raiders) are Fast Skimmers, not Tanks, therefore they cannot perform a Tank Shock or a Ramming action (which is essentially a Tank Shock on a vehicle).

 

I also agree, reading the rule book now (boss is away).

 

On a side note, stick an iron priest inside a tank, for the +D3 movement

 

hmm, I wonder if the +D3 for "containing the character" is literal - if so it is cumulative.... +3D3"

maybe stick it in with a unit of say 5 WG with a banner for the reroll too.

I think both of those would be bending the rules a fair bit through :)

[Grey Mage]

Land Raider (front armor 14) vs the weakest possible armor (10). It moves 12" (+4), is a tank (+1), and has 4 more armor (+4) for a total Str 9 hit.

 

Completely. Useless.

 

If it's Open Topped, you get a +1, right? So that's *something*. If you're on a road (when does that happen?) you could move 18", getting a Strength 11 hit. Even then, why would you bother, unless you had no weapons left and no use for a behemoth transport?

 

I suppose while the damage is completely meaningless (in almost all cases I can imagine), it does allow you to break the "models cannot be placed within 1" of enemy models" rule, which could prevent a tank from moving maybe, or block enemy infantry from passing, or embarking/disembarking.

 

Has anyone ever used Ramming with any effect? I wonder what?

Eldar Waveserpent- moves 36" in a single turn +12, is tank, +1, Armor 12 +2= technically a strength 15 hit. Heck, drop the extra 12" from star engines *as some disagree with this method* and you still have a strength 11 hit.

 

Tell me its not worth it to be able to ram that into the side armor of a warhound titan. Or that once its guns shot off you wouldnt take a strength 10 *maxedout* against an opponents landraider.

 

By 36" in one turn are you referring to Star Engines. I thought that the extra movement was only used in the Shooting phase, while Ramming takes place in the Movement phase. So the max distance a Wave Serpent can move for Ramming is 24" (flat out). Forgive me if I'm wrong.

 

Also, you can't get a stat above 10, Main Rulebook, page 6, near the bottom of the first column.

1) I noted that it was str 10 was maxed out, the other number was just showing math.

2) Its open to interpretation. Tank Shock is found in the movement section, but theres nothing that says it has to be done in the movement phase. Pg. 68-69. Adepticons FAQ said that they would not allow star engines to be included in the total movement, but they arent official GW.

 

And yes, you have to be a tank to Ram- Because its a special kind of tank shock, wich *as seen under the heading TANKS on page 68* can only preformed by tanks that are mobile. Sorry!

 

Edit: Sorry again! You cant get more than one Iron Priest in a vehicle- theyre not independant characters.

[Frosty the Pyro]

Looking at the rule book tank shock (which ramming is) does not require the movement phase, only movement (so movement in the shooting phase is legit). However movement is not conjoined between phases. Thus if you can move your tank in the shooting phase, it could tank shock in the shooting phase, and then tank shock a second time in the movement phase, but you could not add distance moved in the shooting phase to the tank shock value in the movement phase.

 

TLDR: if you can move in both movement and shooting phases, you can do two seperate tank shocks, but not one super tank shock.

[Grey Mage]

Looking at the rule book tank shock (which ramming is) does not require the movement phase, only movement (so movement in the shooting phase is legit). However movement is not conjoined between phases. Thus if you can move your tank in the shooting phase, it could tank shock in the shooting phase, and then tank shock a second time in the movement phase, but you could not add distance moved in the shooting phase to the tank shock value in the movement phase.

 

TLDR: if you can move in both movement and shooting phases, you can do two seperate tank shocks, but not one super tank shock.

Negative frosty, and I bring you a quote:

 

* Speed. Each full 3" moved that turn by the rammer before impact:

 

The movement phase is during the same turn as the shooting phase.... and thus would be included.