Levitas Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 So for many of us we have labored over conversions and injected true character into our plastic legends. But for others its a simple case of yesterdays greens.blues/reds becoming "counts as". We know that there is the Space Goats...but at least he is modelling up new minis. The worst I have seen are emperors children, who now "count as" - complete with leopard skin. The answer is clearly to smite them with the true sons of russ. But what is the worst offender you have seen? There should be some sort of reward every time a true Space Wolf beats a 'counts as'. Maybe i'll paint a huge standard of 2 wolves battling and add trophies to it every time i beat one. Or add them to a rhino and call it the 'band wagon'. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veldrik Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I would say that: Dark Angels Orcs Squats would be the top three offenders. I'd say that count as armies shouldn't be allowed in anything except in games with mates, and even then only if the player can't afford the wysiwyg minis. That's one of the places that the tourney rules of 100% GW minis, with the close colours and 3 colour min, and depicting the correct model type comes in. Especially since GW is only releasing (already has) ONE thunderwolf model, and he costs $69AUS rrp, that if I can't use a count as (or a different companies minature) in a tournament, no one else I play against (unless related) can either. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180763 Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdeptusDavidus Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Well, you've convinved me to scrap my DIY Chapter using the Space Wolf codex. I shall instead build an army of Nordic-themed Eldar, and use the Space Wolf codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180789 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispy Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I say as long as they are marines, let them have their fun. The Dark Angels do annoy me just a little. Wolf Wing, bleah. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Well, you've convinved me to scrap my DIY Chapter using the Space Wolf codex. I shall instead build an army of Nordic-themed Eldar, and use the Space Wolf codex. Wait a second... so did you want the notes on how I made my army, or were you going to just take a shot in the dark? :). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180804 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ominous Anonymous Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Space Lions/Lions Rampant using High Elf War Lions as Thunderwolf Cav. Oh, wait, that's my WIP army. :) EDIT: Seriously though, if you're getting upset about people using fluffy rules for unfluffy counterparts I hope you make a thread every time your Raven Guard beat some guy's counts-as Shrike and his Ultramarines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180817 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1TH0R3 Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Do you guys really hate Count-as that much, Now i feel kinda bad ^_^ Oh and ultra marines would be the worst Ive seen :blink: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180916 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freman Bloodglaive Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I don't mind, I'll play anyone, even those pesky Blood Angels. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2180946 Share on other sites More sharing options...
juggernot Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I would have to disagree with the no counts as at tournaments. Though I do think that it is cheesy to take an established chapter i.e Dark Angels and use the SW codex but still call them Dark Angels, I have no problem with counts as so long as the models are WYSIWYG. Things like color should have no bearing on playing a particular army. I am doing a DIY Space wolf chapter, because the fluff for wolves and their rules are the closest to representing the theme I am going for. I don't like the space wolf colors though and would much rather paint them differently. As for converted thunderwolves, I have no problem with those either so long as they are reasonably represented. It would suck to have them in the codex and have to either buy 5+ Canis models or not run them at all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181004 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 This is just bitterness for all the years we had to make dew with the old dex, or get bashed for using the SM dex with trades. For me most of these will move on to the next dex or stay as a SW like chapter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181012 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levitas Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 There is a difference here, one that I am fine with and one that can get annoying. I think the 'counts as' is a great creative venue, for when you want to do some great conversions and like an armies theme but not their fluff say. In this instance i would point to the Space Goats. I am more than fine with this. As am I with an ultramarines force that uses Shrike, but has built around that with both conversions and fluff. The ultramarines assault company for instance, which would have more jump packs and Shrikes build would be a better fit maybe. The other side is the force that has just spent months using the chaos codex, only to suddenly turn up using the space wolf rules. With not a hint of wolfy-ness about them and still clearly painted in recognizable colors (say plague marines, world eaters etc). There is a difference, one acceptable and one just flag swapping. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181089 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispy Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Ultramarines is definitely up there in terms of "What?LOL!" from a fluff perspective. I guess Codex Astartes isn't that great, is it? I'm mature enough to enjoy the irony. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181090 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Volker Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I don't mind "counts as" armies, I just shake my head sadly when they try to tenuously come up with terrible fluff which doesn't fit in with the rest of the game background. If you're going to have an army of female marines or other such horrors, just be content with the fact that your playing a game with little men, don't try to justify it by coming up with fluff which doesn't fit with the established background. I'll only assume my proud Son's of Russ are using the holo-training room for laughs again if you do. Its the trying too hard that wounds me. (Sorry, this refers to a guy I played who had female marines, and didn't like me laughing about his rubbish fluff, then complained during the game because I would always have my Bloodclaws advancing even when it was tactical suicide) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181158 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaosPhoenix Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I don't mind any. I've got Dark Angels, Space Wolves, Chaos Marines, Tau, Daemons, IG... - you get the picture. Play like you want, don't cheat and have fun. Thats what matters. If this another case of insulted fluff-pride, don't play against those armies. If it's still unnerving you, think about your hobby - other people seem to have fun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglespuss Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 If you're going to have an army of female marines or other such horrors, just be content with the fact that your playing a game with little men Ah yes! quite so! theres room in the fluff for most everything, but somethings just don't exist. So what if they don't though? its fine as you said, your free to use them just don't even try a jot of justification!! its deluded and completely untennable! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181188 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ominous Anonymous Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 The other side is the force that has just spent months using the chaos codex, only to suddenly turn up using the space wolf rules. With not a hint of wolfy-ness about them and still clearly painted in recognizable colors (say plague marines, world eaters etc). Who cares as long as WYSWYG is enforced? Death Guard would be an interesting case if only because Plague Marines are one of the better troop choices already, but stuff like Pre-Heresy Thousand Sons or modern World Eaters with Juggernauts or even a Dark Angels Deathwing list only comes down to paint scheme without stretching the fluff too much. You do not own this codex. Compared to what I've seen on Sons of Corax to see this opinion come from you is a bit disappointing. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 If you're going to have an army of female marines or other such horrors, just be content with the fact that your playing a game with little men, don't try to justify it by coming up with fluff which doesn't fit with the established background. not female sm . an ad mecha pretorian guard that is hvy cybered/gene modified and at the same time the FW they happen to come from has/had a matriarchat form of rule [think cyber eshers] , so the force does happen to have females in it. But stuff like that aside . Isnt it good that people think about using SW rules ? Isnt it nice to have a book that has many builds and a lot of viable options. Would you rather have something like chaos dex with 2 builds[mecha and LR rush] and all legions having identical game play? or an abomination of codex like the DA got ? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181271 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rokafort Stonewolf Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I've played against an Ultramarines 1st Company army using Loganwing rules. It was madness...he actually has a 5-man unit of jump packing "wolf guard" as his vets. It's honestly a very fluffy army. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181305 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hfran Morkai Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I've played against an Ultramarines 1st Company army using Loganwing rules. It was madness...he actually has a 5-man unit of jump packing "wolf guard" as his vets. It's honestly a very fluffy army. Dear Lord... you're telling me they've done it? I wasn't expecting that. To be honest I like the love we get, perhaps it'll remind GW not to leave us on the side for nine more years. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181312 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Bloodskull Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Personally, the only thing that matters to me is the reason why they would use our codex. If they think the sw codex better represents their army, or if like the ultramarine player they want to have a 1st company army, i would have no problems with that. the people i frown upon are those who use our codex because its suposedly better, you know, the power gamers etc. Sven Bloodskull Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181325 Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneSniperSG Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Do you guys really hate Count-as that much, Now i feel kinda bad :P Oh and ultra marines would be the worst Ive seen :blink: Best to ignore their stupidity. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181435 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Fang Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 To test out an army your thinking of playing, 'counts as' is fine but if your going to stick with it you should make an effort to to get some models or do some conversions, (budget willing ofc). The larger a game gets the more of a pain 'counts as' becomes. The worst, (or possibly best, if your in a dark humor mood) I've seen is Thousand sons 'counting as'. . . I was forced to verbally slap him. Long Fang Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181441 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marek Grimfang Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 AS long as the army feels like its reflective of the SW Codex, why not. No worse than using the SM Codex for a wolf related army list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181445 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I dont see the problem with using a power armoured space marine armed with a boltgun to represent a power armoured space marine armed with a boltgun. So what if his armour is green, red or blue instead of grey, providing you can tell which unit hes in and wargear is wysiwyg then its completly legal. Personally I have a large number of ultramarines and dark angels currently making up the ranks of my imperial fists army... until I get around to striping and repainting them at least. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181477 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zsoulless Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Hot Pink Wolves...?.. Sure!! Why not?!! It seems Asinine to even Nitpick things like that IMO.. A Dedicated Converted model That "counts As" either, so and so or whatyamacallit ..? Please, Yes!! Any Day!! Yes!! Do I Mind UltraMarine Blue Shrike? Nope!! Not at all.. Take some Pride in your army and convert every single Figure.. I would rather play against that then a Primer army any Day of the Week.. Do I think Play testing, such as bringing your Tau "counts as" Orks to the Table or your Tissue Box "counts as" Landraiders, should stay at home only to be used against your Friends.. Sorry But Yes... That just doesn't belong on the Game Table.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/184510-worst-counts-as-space-wolves-out-there/#findComment-2181510 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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