Questions about playing against Eldar...

[ChainsawDR]

Questions about Eldar...

 

I come up against an Eldar player quite often, and his Wave Serpents can be a bugger to kill as on the damage chart, I have to roll two dice and he gets to pick which one he wants to count - I normally roll a 6 & a 1 and he obviously chooses the 1! They end up soaking up a ton of firepower before being wrecked or blown up (it's really frustrating - how often do you roll a 5/5, 5/6 or 6/6 together!!!)

 

I've just got myself the Eldar codex and I cant see this rule or wargear upgrade (I'm being blind) - if anyone knows what this is and what page it is in the codex, I'd appreciate it if you could let me know.

 

Also, he runs Eldrad Ulthran and runs around casting psychic powers from within his wave serpent. He normally casts fortune on himself (which covers him, his squad and Eldrads wave serpent), then doom on one of my squads, then Guide on a nearby Vyper squad - my question is this - as Wave Serpents dont have a fire point - can he cast Doom and Guide from within the Wave Serpent? Does he need LOS to the units to cast them on them?

 

I'm presuming he can but wanted to double check anyway as this setup is really, really hard to overcome (I've won 2 games to 0 against his Eldrad army with my wolves but it's been really difficult and I'm looking to make sure I've got my tactics and rules straight so I keep winning!). Again if you know the page numbers for this I'd appreciate it very much.

 

Thank you

 

ChainsawDR

[Rokafort Stonewolf]

Wave Serpents cannot have the holo-field upgrade that does what you describe. Either the tank was a Falcon or Fire Prism, or your opponent was cheaing and giving the transport upgrades it could not have. Falcons CAN carry troops, so it may be your mistake.

 

As for the powers, none of these powers require LOS, and can be cast from within the Wave Serpent.

 

If you want page #s, Eldar Vehicle Upgrades are on page 44. Farseer Powers are on page 28. Note that it specifically says they do not require line of sight unless specified otherwise.

 

Other than possibly putting holo-fields on a serpent, that's fair game.

[ChainsawDR]

Wave Serpents cannot have the holo-field upgrade that does what you describe. Either the tank was a Falcon or Fire Prism, or your opponent was cheaing and giving the transport upgrades it could not have. Falcons CAN carry troops, so it may be your mistake.

 

As for the powers, none of these powers require LOS, and can be cast from within the Wave Serpent.

 

If you want page #s, Eldar Vehicle Upgrades are on page 44. Farseer Powers are on page 28. Note that it specifically says they do not require line of sight unless specified otherwise.

 

Other than possibly putting holo-fields on a serpent, that's fair game.

 

Thank you very much indeed Rokafort, he did have both Wave Serpents and Fire Prisms (2 of each) so I think I was remembering wrong. His Wave Serpents automatically made my Lascannons Strength 8, and his Fire Prisms required two dice to be rolled on the damage chart.

 

I never thought he was cheating, I just wanted to read the rules so I could try and uncover a better way of beating them.

 

Thanks again Rokafort, you've been a great help.

 

ChainsawDR

[eyeslikethunder]

Melta weapons are what you need as they add +1 to the damage chart. Meaning a 4+ will be good enough. The best to have them on fast moving Troops like swift claws (meltagun, Meltabombs and a multimelta) or Landspeeders (double multimelta 70 pts). But it is also handy to spread them out among your other forces making it harder for your opponent to target them and remove their threat.

 

other units to consider are(but not so good)

Deep striking Dreadnoughts with MM

Deep striking Melta units (grey hunters, Long fangs w/ Logan combi melta Wolf guard

[wiplash]

hit them with arjac or meltabombs or thunderhammers or powerfists in close combat

even if it explodes it wounds on a 5+ and we get saves too

with holo field its not hitting it with powerful weapons but getting as many hits as possible on the rear armour

 

and energy field isnt so bad it just means you glance on a 4+ and pen on a 5+ again its best to get lots of hits on it

[whitewolfmxc]

well yesterday i had a game with eldar , what the enermy did was he ran eldred with a group of 10 rangers camped at the end of the table , then my drop pod drednought with heavy flamer and twin link heavy flamer arrived and killed 8 rangers and eldred failed leadership and ran off the table XD (remember heavy flamers wound elders at 2 + and they dont get saves since its AP4 , so unless thier aspect warriors its awesome)

 

as for hallowfeild , ask your oppent to chose between the pen hits results from a group of melta bomb wolf scouts , see how that works for him

[Grey Mage]

Questions about Eldar...

 

I come up against an Eldar player quite often, and his Wave Serpents can be a bugger to kill as on the damage chart, I have to roll two dice and he gets to pick which one he wants to count - I normally roll a 6 & a 1 and he obviously chooses the 1! They end up soaking up a ton of firepower before being wrecked or blown up (it's really frustrating - how often do you roll a 5/5, 5/6 or 6/6 together!!!)

 

I've just got myself the Eldar codex and I cant see this rule or wargear upgrade (I'm being blind) - if anyone knows what this is and what page it is in the codex, I'd appreciate it if you could let me know.

 

Also, he runs Eldrad Ulthran and runs around casting psychic powers from within his wave serpent. He normally casts fortune on himself (which covers him, his squad and Eldrads wave serpent), then doom on one of my squads, then Guide on a nearby Vyper squad - my question is this - as Wave Serpents dont have a fire point - can he cast Doom and Guide from within the Wave Serpent? Does he need LOS to the units to cast them on them?

 

I'm presuming he can but wanted to double check anyway as this setup is really, really hard to overcome (I've won 2 games to 0 against his Eldrad army with my wolves but it's been really difficult and I'm looking to make sure I've got my tactics and rules straight so I keep winning!). Again if you know the page numbers for this I'd appreciate it very much.

 

Thank you

 

ChainsawDR

As mentioned- no holofields on Waveserpents, just str 8 tops and 1d6 for armor penetration- except in close combat. Your dreadnaught and chainfists are unaffected in CC.

 

It wont cover the waveserpent AND the squad- they are still seperate units, so its one or the other. You dont however need line of sight for fortune, guide, or doom. Mindwar and Eldritch storm do, as they are "shooting" powers.

 

Best things to take against Eldar for SWs?

 

1) Long Fangs with Missile Launchers- great for killing all those AV 12 tanks.

2) Whirlwinds- Wounding on a 2+ and negating almost all eldar armor saves? Yes please!

3) Twin autocannon dreadnaughts- actually better than missile for popping tanks, but not as good against wraithlords/gaurd.

4) Landspeeders- typhoons or MM/HF are just murderous, and take away the eldars speed advantage to an extent.

5) Rune Priests- While their "runes of warding" do make it dangerous for rune priests the power "Tempests Wrath" is an absolute godsend for anyone who faces alot of skimmers, jetbikes, and jump infantry- the fast units that make eldar scary to so many players. Negating powers cast within 24" is also amazing.

 

If youd like more information, I have a WIP tactica for killing eldar here:

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=165294

[Spacefrisian]

If its possible try hitting the Waveserpent on the rear. The field doesn't cover the rear.

[Wolfrave]

On another Note as well, he cannot cast 3 psychic powers in one turn, the eldar codex at best lets him cast two, and never the same two (unless you have a certain HQ upgrade, but "shhhhh" i don't play an eldar player every day and have to teach them the codex) Anyhow, Continueing the line of thought, My longfangs NEVER fail to pop them, but the best way is of course CC, Holofields do not work against them, and Holofields do not "let them choose" which dice, the upgrade actually just makes you roll two dice whenever you roll on the vehicle damage chart, and apply the lowest (i belive from ranged attacks Only) And Falcons and Fire Prisms are the only who can take this upgrade, and tbh its a rather Costy upgrade. Now, as For shooting psychic powers from the vehicle, since most the powers he is useing as allready stated previously, do not require Line of sight, then yeah, but they are fairly short range, i belive only on units within 6" or so, i don't have an eldar codex handy atm, but i do remember them being fairly short.

 

 

So yeah, i find that you can put alot of shots with things on them, to put them down, Like heavy bolters or the like on rear armour, or you can drop a Dready or Ven Dready behind it with a DP (the Dready and Ven Dready having of course Assualt Cannons for that extra rendy goodness i love so much) and if they don't manage to shoot it to death, if the eldar keeps the vehicles close you can assualt it in following turns.

 

Scouts with Melta's and a whatnot work to. Depends on placement

 

But i always kill them off with Long fangs

 

 

Anyhow, sorry to babble so much.

[Spacefrisian]

@ Wolfrave: Eldrad can use 3 powers and he may use one power twice, but hey you said it yourself you dont know much about Eldar.

[wiplash]

@ Wolfrave: Eldrad can use 3 powers and he may use one power twice, but hey you said it yourself you dont know much about Eldar.

and only two can be in the same turn

 

 

killing eldrad is pretty easy hes amazing but is only saved in CC with his invulnerable save, yes he wounds on a 2+ no armour save but he only has 1 standard attack +1 for 2CCW so he can kill 2 at most ;)

[Grey Mage]

@ Wolfrave: Eldrad can use 3 powers and he may use one power twice, but hey you said it yourself you dont know much about Eldar.

and only two can be in the same turn

Im not sure what you mean by this. So I will clarify for all involved.

 

Eldrad gets all five eldar psychic powers.

He can use three psychic powers each turn.

He can use one of those powers twice in a single turn. He may not use a power thrice.

[wiplash]

@ Wolfrave: Eldrad can use 3 powers and he may use one power twice, but hey you said it yourself you dont know much about Eldar.

and only two can be in the same turn

Im not sure what you mean by this. So I will clarify for all involved.

 

Eldrad gets all five eldar psychic powers.

He can use three psychic powers each turn.

He can use one of those powers twice in a single turn. He may not use a power thrice.

 

sorry i meant phase

i thought that was right anyway

he can use 3 psychic powers per turn but only 2 may be the same or in one phase? seeing as usually you can only use one attack in the shooting phase etc in the BBB

i may be wrong but that was my interpretation

[Grey Mage]

Well you can fortune, guide, and doom all during the movement phase or shooting phase... but you can only use 1 shooting power, though the ability to use a second one may override that. Ive not done it, but I can see the argument *codex>core book*.