Thunderpup Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Just making sure i understand things propperly. Just as an example, let's say a pack of Grey Hunters is falling back. (Russ forbid, right?) They can NOT regroup if; enemies are within 6 inches and/or they are not in unit coherency. They CAN regroup without a test if; even if the unit is under 50% no enemies are within 6 inches and/or they are within coherancy. right? also. if this poor pack is assaulted while falling back, do they auto regroup or do they have to take the leadership test? (I'm thinking regroup, but i wanted to check) Normally a regrouping unit gets a 3 inch move and can shoot, counting as moving. - Do our space wolves get to sit still and shoot as if they hadn't moved? - Can our space wolves make a full normal movement? - or do they get the 3 inches but count as not moving? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Just making sure i understand things propperly. Just as an example, let's say a pack of Grey Hunters is falling back. (Russ forbid, right?) They can NOT regroup if; enemies are within 6 inches and/or they are not in unit coherency. Correct They CAN regroup without a test if; even if the unit is under 50% no enemies are within 6 inches and/or they are within coherancy. Correct, but drop the /or, there can be no enemy within 6" AND the unit must be in coherancy right? also. if this poor pack is assaulted while falling back, do they auto regroup or do they have to take the leadership test? (I'm thinking regroup, but i wanted to check) Regroups automatically Normally a regrouping unit gets a 3 inch move and can shoot, counting as moving. - Do our space wolves get to sit still and shoot as if they hadn't moved? - Can our space wolves make a full normal movement? - or do they get the 3 inches but count as not moving? I can't comment on the last bit as i've not read C:SW yet... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209370 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 They would automatically pass the test to regroup, and be once again "stuck in". Remember- you can continue firing even while running away, so dont let anyone walk you off the board without making them pay for it. Yes, we get to count as having not moved after we regroup. Yes, we can make a full normal movement. Negatory. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209371 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderpup Posted December 8, 2009 Author Share Posted December 8, 2009 Thanks brother wolves! Have an ale! <cheers> Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209374 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Remember- you can continue firing even while running away, so dont let anyone walk you off the board without making them pay for it. Where is this in the rules, im not disputing it, i've just not been able to find the page reference for it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209377 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Remember- you can continue firing even while running away, so dont let anyone walk you off the board without making them pay for it. Where is this in the rules, im not disputing it, i've just not been able to find the page reference for it. Top left of pg. 46, under "Firing while falling back". You of course count as moving, but are otherwise free to fire as you would normally. It also states you auto-pass pinning tests and cannot choose to go to ground. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209379 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 Thanks, i've probally read that section a dozen times looking for that rules :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209397 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coverfire Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 A Question about being out of coherency while falling back... When do you get the chance to move back into coherency? or don't you? leaving your squad to fall back off the board Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209607 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 whe you move the fall back distance you should be able to get the unit into coherency. only becomes a problem if there are tings to avoid in which case some models may need to move a different way to the rest. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209809 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobman Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 They would automatically pass the test to regroup, and be once again "stuck in". Remember- you can continue firing even while running away, so dont let anyone walk you off the board without making them pay for it. Yes, we get to count as having not moved after we regroup. Yes, we can make a full normal movement. Negatory. Why would you not get the 3" move first? (I know this has been argued before but to be truthful I kinda respect your opinion on stuff Grey Mage). Does it not say anyone who passes regroup test get this move - SM auto pass the test not ignore it. Then ATSKNF kicks in where normally there would be no other move allowed ATSKNF states the unit can operate without restriction. Bobman out Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209819 Share on other sites More sharing options...
legless_al Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 Yes but you cant make two different types of move in one movement phase, the 3" and a normal 6" move counts as two movements. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209890 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobman Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 Are you sure you can't make two moves? Is regroup technically in the movement phase anyway? Regroup is done at beginning of turn I think, thereby not being movement phase and such. I'd have to look up the wording to be sure, but I always took it as regroup is a different action to movement. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2209933 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 They would automatically pass the test to regroup, and be once again "stuck in". Remember- you can continue firing even while running away, so dont let anyone walk you off the board without making them pay for it. Yes, we get to count as having not moved after we regroup. Yes, we can make a full normal movement. Negatory. Why would you not get the 3" move first? (I know this has been argued before but to be truthful I kinda respect your opinion on stuff Grey Mage). Does it not say anyone who passes regroup test get this move - SM auto pass the test not ignore it. Then ATSKNF kicks in where normally there would be no other move allowed ATSKNF states the unit can operate without restriction. Bobman out While actually RAW would support you making a 3" regroup move and then moving on.... I think the better argument, and the more reasonable interpretation is that "moving normally" precludes the 3" regroup move- thus I will move my little men six inches, not 9. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210354 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 While we are on the subject, I've got a related Fall Back move question: When a unit is making a Fall Back move, if there is something directly between the broken unit and the "friendly" table edge, for example Impassable Terrain, or a Vehicle, or an Enemy Unit, as long as the unit does not have to ever move toward the "enemy" table edge (as the rulebook says: to doubleback), the unit can move laterally (left and right) to go around the intervening obstacle, and continue its move toward my table edge, when possible. This is my interpretation of the wording, and the diagram used to describe the fall back move, but it has been disputed. Thoughts? V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210389 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 You can move diagonally and even laterally to avoid impassable terrain, I see nothing in the rules that says you cant. You just have to get them as close to your own board edge as possible- so in most cases diagonally would be the proper way to go about it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210392 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coverfire Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 Can you get "trapped" by your own units? Assuming ATSKNF doesn't save us from being trapped Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210418 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderpup Posted December 9, 2009 Author Share Posted December 9, 2009 Are you sure you can't make two moves? Is regroup technically in the movement phase anyway? Regroup is done at beginning of turn I think, thereby not being movement phase and such. I'd have to look up the wording to be sure, but I always took it as regroup is a different action to movement. The 2nd paragraph of the REGROUPING section (BRB pg46) states the test is taken IN the movement phase, so i don't believe it's something done seperately. Reading the 4th paragraph, about the 3 inch move, leads me to believe that that is a restriction on movement, not an addition on movement. So... I'll be sticking to 6 inches of movement after regrouping. ;) Bad enough the All Father and Russ had to see me retreat in the first place. :P P.S. Thanks for the clarification on "Trapped" units. that's always seemed a little vague to me. <Cheers> Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210510 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Can you get "trapped" by your own units? Assuming ATSKNF doesn't save us from being trapped In my opinion, the way my group plays it, is that if you cant run away you are caught, and if your caught then ATSKNF kicks in and you take no retreat wounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210621 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobman Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Good work y'all. I had the 3" extra thing pulled on me and when I challenged him he got the book out and explained stuff so I believed him. Been doing it ever since. I'll have to have a reread me thinks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2210916 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lumdin Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 extremely dumb question but what is ATSKNF? and where do we get these actions - Yes, we get to count as having not moved after we regroup. Yes, we can make a full normal movement. sorry but still learning game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2211508 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lumdin Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 And They Shall Know No Fear My bad, ugh. Okay but doesnt all marines get this ability. I so need some beer. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2211516 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 And They Shall Know No Fear My bad, ugh. Okay but doesnt all marines get this ability. I so need some beer. Yes, all marines get these, atleast all LOYAL marines do- chaos marines are another story. Also, tau, tyranids etc dont get it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/186810-atsknf/#findComment-2211606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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