Athalus Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 So, this has probably been discussed a bazillion times, but I thought I would put this question out their anyways and hope for some answers. I've been away from the game a bit and have a 13th company army and was just wondering how everyone is re-modding their team to fit with the new codex so they can still play them? I know some are just still using the old rules, but I was hoping to some lists of armies under the new rules that still has the flavour of 13th? Hopefully this will help me decide what I need to buy/re-kit to make my list competitive in the new year. I've seen ideas batted around of using no tanks, etc, and putting TWC in place of wulven, etc, and just want to see some lists and how people have found how effective they are. I've been scrolling previous posts and just haven't found a compilation of different approaches/strategies to army composition with the new rules. I'll keep looking, but hopefully people will post here too. Anyways, happy holidays and thanks for any help! C Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 So, this has probably been discussed a bazillion times, but I thought I would put this question out their anyways and hope for some answers. I've been away from the game a bit and have a 13th company army and was just wondering how everyone is re-modding their team to fit with the new codex so they can still play them? I know some are just still using the old rules, but I was hoping to some lists of armies under the new rules that still has the flavour of 13th? Hopefully this will help me decide what I need to buy/re-kit to make my list competitive in the new year. I've seen ideas batted around of using no tanks, etc, and putting TWC in place of wulven, etc, and just want to see some lists and how people have found how effective they are. I've been scrolling previous posts and just haven't found a compilation of different approaches/strategies to army composition with the new rules. I'll keep looking, but hopefully people will post here too. Anyways, happy holidays and thanks for any help! C Loading them in the circular drop pod. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214443 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 I use the chaos list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214448 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash113 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Grey Hunters can now take 2 special cc weapons so Grey Slayers are easy to fit into the current rules. There's an Apocalypse Datasheet for large (and potent) Wulfen units, anything smaller than that Thunderwolf Cavalry are a potent unit to make up for the loss of Wulfen, Fenresian Wolves, Wolf Guard and so forth. Just don't take any vehicles or jump packs. Some people use the old rules, some chaos, some house rules, but really it's not so hard to fit the 13th Company into the normal SW list and reserve Wulfen for Apocalypse. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214605 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firedrake28 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 It's easy enough to just model two or three Wulfen onto one Thunderwolf sized base and have them "count as" a Thunderwolf. Since Thunderwolves are Cavalry, they'll be able to move similarly to how the Wulfen did in the old 13th Company list (6" normal, D6" animal rage move which translates into a run move in 5th), but with a 12" charge which, at least to me simulates the ferocious Wulfen just fine. As far as an actual list goes, I'd try something like this: Wolf Lord in Terminator armor - Pair of Wolf Claws - Wolftooth Necklace - Saga of Majesty (just personal preference, any saga works with the 13th) Grey Hunters - 6 with bolters, pistols and close combat weapons - 1 with meltagun, pistol and close combat weapon - 1 with Wolf Standard, bolter, pistol and close combat weapon - 1 with Mark of the Wulfen, bolter, pistol and close combat weapon Drop Pod Grey Hunters - 6 with bolters, pistols and close combat weapons - 1 with meltagun, pistol and close combat weapon - 1 with Wolf Standard, bolter, pistol and close combat weapon - 1 with Mark of the Wulfen, bolter, pistol and close combat weapon Drop Pod Grey Hunters - 8 Grey Hunters with bolters, pistols and combat weapons - 2 Grey Hunters with plasma guns, pistols and combat weapons Wolf Guard - 2 in power armor with bolters and power fists (each attached to the first two Grey Hunter units) - 1 in Terminator armor with storm bolter, power weapon and cyclone missile launcher (joins either the third Grey Hunters or Long Fangs) - 2 in Terminator armor with storm bolters and power fists - 2 in Terminator armor with combi-meltas, single wolf claws and meltabombs (all Terminators bar the one with cyclone form a unit with the Lord in the Drop Pod) Drop Pod Wulfen (counts as Thunderwolf Cavalry) - 5 Thunderwolves with bolt pistols and close combat weapons Long Fangs - Pack leader with bolt pistol and close combat weapon - 5 Long Fangs with missile launchers and bolt pistols Total: 1,491/1,500 I know it's rough and there's lots of room for improvement, but hopefully it'll give anyone playing the 13th a platform to start on. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214618 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Repainting some of them into regular SW ^_^. Using Wulfen to represent models with MotW, using Fenrisian wolves to represent, err, Fenrisian wolves, bashing GW for their ignorance - one pal got his nicely converted Harlequin force kicked out in exactly the same manner, when the new Eldar Codex came out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214673 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athalus Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 Repainting some of them into regular SW ^_^. Using Wulfen to represent models with MotW, using Fenrisian wolves to represent, err, Fenrisian wolves, bashing GW for their ignorance - one pal got his nicely converted Harlequin force kicked out in exactly the same manner, when the new Eldar Codex came out. Haha, for sure. It's frustrating to say the least, but I am gonna do my best to stick with it. Sama - As for using chaos rules, I don't know if that's me, but I am sure its fun and maybe I'll try it out in a couple of casual games, thanks for the idea. Firedrake - awesome. Really helps me get an idea of what my force is going to look like. Before I was mostly grey slayers, with lots of wulven and wolves, with a pimped out lord with MoTW, and a teleporter to get in there (as well as long fangs). Now I am most likely going to go down the route of lots of grey slayers, as they are my best looking dudes, as well as lots of cavalry and long fangs. They'll be slow as molasses, but hopefully the THC and my wolves will create a distraction while the Grey Slayers (now grey hunters), get in there. No more teleport and free move at start is gonna hurt, but I play it cause I love it. Maybe I will use drop pods to supplement this, as Ramses suggested. As for my lord I am really leaning to using Canis, or putting a wolf lord with a belt of russ on a thunder wolf (to counter act that lack of invulnerable save). Also, for GH, should I be using 2 melta's in each squad since the 2nd is free? Also, I am thinking of putting one squad with meltas, the WG with combi melta/thunder hammer, and the other squad with plasma and their WG with combi plasma/power fist (for tank smashing goodness). As for the THC, I am thinking of emphasizing the anti tank stuff, such as Melta bombs, power fist, etc, cause that's always 13th company's bane (or it used to be with wulven). I really like the idea of putting my wulven models on cavalry bases, should look good and still give me that old school wulven flavour. Thanks, Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214689 Share on other sites More sharing options...
antique_nova Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 logan, or wolf lords and using GH spam with fenrisian wolf spam. that's what i think at the moment. they may still have their wulfen companions, or do they? thanks antique_nova Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2214858 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 I'm just trying to convert mine over to the current codex. I am in the process of putting 2 wulfen per 60mm base to represent TWC. However, I find with the lack of outflank for the army and no scout move, that foot slogging can be death. I play eldar and IG a lot and exposing troops to a fast army or one with lots of pie plates can just be brutal. I proxied some of my BA rhinos for my wolves last game and it worked out well because I was able to protect my units better to hold objectives. Next game I think I will try a foot slogging force though with at least 1 fen wolf pack to screen for some TWC. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2215027 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgers37 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 I am sorta doing a 13th company....... just because of the way i have painted so far, drybrushing.... :) but it will not be very fluffy unless i right my own fluff :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2215031 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athalus Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 I think what may be necessary is to have a rune priest to give cover. I am thinking of throwing one on a bike with a bike retinue to follow my THC/Canis into battle. This way they get in there and muck up things. Also, the bikes give you access to an attack bike with multi-melta, plasma guns, n melta bombs to mess up mechanized enemies. I know when I played 13th in years past, my bikes were often the difference against tanks, etc, and could also zip around and protect my LF if needed. Not to mention it gives u a MoTW on a bike, fun. Also, I think its ok to put scouts into the 13th, since we no longer have that extra start move. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2215075 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 My 13th Company 'Chaos' list, just so you get an idea.... I ended up using a Rune Priest with Lash to represent an 'offensive Gate' dragging units across the board. Wulfen as Possessed with MoSlaanesh so they have St & I 5 like Wulfen and the 5+ Inv is akin to the Feel No Pain. They are also both only armed with tooth and claw. Thought it would be nice to model a Wolf Priest as the Champion of the unit, despite him not having any of the Wolf Priest's rules. Storm Claws as Berzerkers and Grey Slayers as standard CSM. Nice and fluffy and fun to play. And to be honest I only want to run 13th Co. cos they look cool on the tabletop, not because I want to win games. Wolf Lord (Chaos Lord) Wolf Claws, Mark Of The Wulfen (Daemon Weapon) Combi Weapon Rune Priest (Chaos Sorceror) Force Weapon Cyber Raven (Mark of Slaanesh) Gate (Lash of Submission) Wulfen Pack and Wolf Priest (8 Possessed with Champion) Initiative 5 (Icon of Slaanesh) Storm Claw Pack (8 Berzerkers with Champion) Power Fist Personal Icon Storm Claw Pack (8 Berzerkers with Champion) Power Fist Personal Icon Grey Slayers Pack (8 Chaos Space Marines) Plasma Gun Icon of Chaos Glory Storm Claws Biker Pack (3 Chaos Space Marine Bikers) 2 Melta Guns Icon of Chaos Glory Storm Claws Biker Pack (3 Chaos Space Marine Bikers) 2 Melta Guns Icon of Chaos Glory Fenrisian Wolves (6 Lesser Summoned Daemons) Fenrisian Wolves (6 Lesser Summoned Daemons) 1500 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2215588 Share on other sites More sharing options...
antique_nova Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 erm. just a thought. what do you think is acceptable and unacceptable in a 13th company list? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2215957 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglespuss Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 well, I can't see them having much 'support'; tanks, dreadnoughts, longfangs, landspeeders, ironpriests etc. But I can see them using, thunderwolves, fenrisian wolves, grey hunters (slayers), a 'few' blood claws (not going to have many), wolf scouts, wolf guard, swift claws, and as many marks of the wulfen as you can get. However, it all depends what '13th company' army your going to do; in the 'new' fluff a 13th company could just have been lost in the warp, presumed dead etc. and may well be a pretty much 'normal' space wolves army. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216015 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 A lost company is not the same as THE 13th Company. You can do either I guess. And that has always been the fluff, going back to the 2nd Ed Codex. The 13th stone was representative of all Space Wolves lost or who had left the fold. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216028 Share on other sites More sharing options...
antique_nova Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 in the codex it states that the 13th have no BC at all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216057 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglespuss Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 A lost company is not the same as THE 13th Company Was not, but is now ;) in the codex it states that the 13th have no BC at all Yeah I know, but, if you want to field it using the space wolves codex, then I think a 'few' bloodclasw/swift claws is fine, just call them something else. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216067 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Rather then use BC's, just use a wolf guard pack to represent them since they are more veteran like. The rune priest idea with the 5+ cover save is nice, unfortunately the new IG have orders that ignore cover saves and it has just brutalized me, especially since they have veteran squads now with AP 3 guns. *mutters* Long fangs are in the 13th Company so maybe going with 3 full packs would help against armour and the bikes also fit well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216105 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglespuss Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 No really sure that 13th company would utilise long fangs... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216156 Share on other sites More sharing options...
antique_nova Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 they wouldn't also IG don't ignore cover saves. they make you re-roll successfull cover saves. Also, would you say njal is viable for a 13th company? does his tempest rules help the wolves do you think? thanks antique_nova Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216162 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 it has just brutalized me, especially since they have veteran squads now with AP 3 guns. They are Stormtroopers actually, being under Elites section. No really sure that 13th company would utilise long fangs... Well, they were the only antitank option in the old list - apart from teleporting meltagun slayers or crazy melta/pf bikers. Actually, using a power fist to nuke a tank is quite wolfy approach to solve the problem... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216168 Share on other sites More sharing options...
antique_nova Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 also storm troops have S3 guns and cannot first rank fire and second rank fire the unit with hellguns, because they are not lasguns. they are HOTSHOT lasguns. the order says lasguns, normal lasguns, not varients otherwise it would have said. thanks antique_nova Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216171 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 also storm troops have S3 guns and cannot first rank fire and second rank fire the unit with hellguns, because they are not lasguns. they are HOTSHOT lasguns. the order says lasguns, normal lasguns, not varients otherwise it would have said.thanks antique_nova That could cause some debates actually, but luckily, the range of hot shot lasguns ir 18", while in the First-Second rank order description clearly says "up to 24" ". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216184 Share on other sites More sharing options...
antique_nova Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 all debates end with the RAW rules. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216195 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Hands up who owns the 2nd Edition codex, which is the first mention of the 13th company? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187193-new-13th-company-lists/#findComment-2216210 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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