xxvaderxx Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 I have a question, TWM is the obvious choice for a lord with this, but what about its weapons? SS+TH? SS+WC? SS+FB? WC+WC? I personally tend to like TS+WC better than the others. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217446 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Id say, ts is probly a "thunder shield" wich for most of us would be a "storm shield" or SS right? Anyways, Id say a Belt of Russ, a Frostblade, WTT, and WTN- putting him at 210pts, maybe a pack of meltabombs if you have the change. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217516 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Ragnar fears Power Fists. That's what his two wolves are for. :rolleyes: They love to eat PF wounds for Ragnar! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217650 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raulmichile Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Ragnar fears Power Fists. That's what his two wolves are for. :( They love to eat PF wounds for Ragnar! How is this? Ragnar is IC, nobody can eat his PF wounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217754 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 This is....true Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217756 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Fenrisian Wolves... what do they do with the IC they are purchased for if not count as a mini retinue, like Tau Drones? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217768 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 they take wounds from shooting but until its faq'd play safe and assume they don't take wounds in combat. they don't have the retinues rule, nor do they have a rule like bodyguards or acolytes in the IG/DH codex respectively. as they don't have retinue or specific rules to the contrary i think its safest to assume that they cannot stop the character being singled out in combat. they also provide several not too shabby close comabt attacks (at a high I if the army contains saga of the wolfkin) so they do have a purpose... also there aren't that many things that will still have a powerfist left in it after receiving a charge from ragnar and whatever unit he leads... one thing, he hasn't lost an survivabilty so why is everyone moaning about how vulnerable he is to power fists... hes the same as any other marine captain... as i say, play it safe. that way if it gets faq'd that you can use them as ablative wounds you win, if it doesn't your no losing anything or complaining about getting hit with the 'nerf bat'. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 I have one question for you- if they are not the same unit as the IC, then what unit are they a part of? Frankly, playing it safe would be to say if you have them then you cannot join another squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2217953 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 They are part of the same unit as the IC. But that doesn't stop you singling out the IC in combat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 They are part of the same unit as the IC. But that doesn't stop you singling out the IC in combat. Actually, it would. Hed no longer be able to join units- because units cant join other units. And Units cannot be ICs, so it would be a rule he couldnt use... as its not valid. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218028 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJumppanen Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 They are part of the same unit as the IC. But that doesn't stop you singling out the IC in combat. Actually, it would. Hed no longer be able to join units- because units cant join other units. And Units cannot be ICs, so it would be a rule he couldnt use... as its not valid. Those wolves are wargear and do not prevent him from joining other units. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218046 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athalus Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 I also thought the wolves were just wargear, else I gotta change some build around. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218060 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 They are part of the same unit as the IC. But that doesn't stop you singling out the IC in combat. Actually, it would. Hed no longer be able to join units- because units cant join other units. And Units cannot be ICs, so it would be a rule he couldnt use... as its not valid. Those wolves are wargear and do not prevent him from joining other units. Prove it. They are models, they are selected as part of his choice and thus form a unit with him. Since an IC cannot be part of two units at the same time, he cannot join any units if he has FWs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218068 Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitewolfmxc Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Also remember the Wolves rule say that the wolves can not be more than 2 inches of the character that bought the wolves , it sounds like the old retinue rule Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218083 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 it may sound like it but it doesn't actually state it. play it however you want, but theres no way in hell im gonna say that my WL with a wolf can palm off wounds onto it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218226 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Stink, why would you purchase wargear not to use it? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218314 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Hey Decoy, whitewolf, good to see you back. @ Stinkenheim- really, the "safe side" would be to say that he cant join units once he takes wolves. Because they must form a unit, as its multiple models that dont all have the IC rule- wargear or not. I think really though the most reasonable way to go about it is to say they follow the same rules as tau gundrones for wounds, joining/leaving, etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJumppanen Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 They are part of the same unit as the IC. But that doesn't stop you singling out the IC in combat. Actually, it would. Hed no longer be able to join units- because units cant join other units. And Units cannot be ICs, so it would be a rule he couldnt use... as its not valid. Those wolves are wargear and do not prevent him from joining other units. Prove it. "Wargear - Do Fenrisian Wolves taken as wargear make the character count as part of a unit for the purposes of joining other units/assigning shooting damage * As wargear they do not prevent a character from joining another unit or count as joining a unit for a Lone Wolf. For majority toughness and wound allocation however they are still treated as separate models within the unit. If considered in the same light as Tau Drones then they will form a unit which can join other units." http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=179925 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218374 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Good to be back, GM, though I never really left. Just didn't feel overly compelled to post in the majority of the threads. You know us 13th. Only come when there's a fight to be had. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 as wargear they shouldn't prevent him from joining a unit, but without rules to support your statement (like bodyguards/acolytes have in their respective codex) i think it is unfair t assume they can be allocated wounds. as for why take wargear if it can't be used, i do take two wolves for my lord, they help with dishing out a couple of attacks before my terminators strike (the curse of thunderhammerS) and against my usual opponent (orks) it hels to reduce the number coming back at me. they are also nice if i get shot up by high ap weaponry as i usually sacrifice them to help save my more expensive terminators from death. they do have their uses, i just personally feel it is pushing to assume they can e used as ablative wounds when everything else that is treated that way makes specific mention of it. these don't, they have no 'retinue' rule, no rule about being used to soak up wounds in combat, the only mention they have in the codex is about taking two spaces in a transport. you want me to prove where it says they can't be used to take wounds, well sow m where it says they can, because an often used arguement on these forums is if it doesn' say you can then you can't. i apologise if my post comes across as hostile, agressive or sarcastic that isn't my intention, but don't begin to give special rules to things which don't have them. houserule it that way in your own games by all means but without there being more evidence to support that stance im not playing it that way. if it gets faq'd differently bonus to me and kudos to those who guessed right, but until then im not using them as ablative wounds in combat. is it really that big an issue? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218416 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz1858 Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 I would have to agree with stinkenheim. They dont come with any Retinue rules, nor others of the same type. I cant think of any BRB rule that would change him from being an IC. I would say they are treated as wargear albeit on seperate bases of there own. I can see the reasoning behind treating them like a retinue. However to do so would mean he wouldnt be able to join another unit (due to losing IC status) and to be honest they just havent been given the rule. In C:DH and C:WH they do have the rule so if you were to go to a tourney they would get the rule and you wouldnt. Until as Stinkenheim points out its FAQ'd or if it isnt then they are wargear. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218421 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 It says they are wargear. That's the only statement that event pertains remotely to the status. So I would say they are wargear that has it's own base and must remain within coherency, but does not remove the IC status of the model and as such he may still join a unit. Otherwise 10pts for an ablative Get Out Of Instant Death free card is WAY too cheap. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormshrug Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Wait, I'm a bit confused. Are people suggesting that they can't be assigned wounds at all, or just that they don't "hide" the character they're accompanying during close combat? I assume they can still be assigned wounds from shooting attacks at the 'squad,' as a normal unit, right? -Stormshrug Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Yes, they count as members of the squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218679 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 yeah, some of us are saying that you can put wounds received from shooting onto them, just not wounds targetted on the IC in combat. others are arguing differently, and saying that they can take wounds directed against the IC in combat, thus taking power fit attacks etc to prevent instant death. it depends on which side of the line you stand as to what you decide to do with them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/187294-attacks-from-saga-of-the-warrior-born/page/3/#findComment-2218703 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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