Destroyer weapon question

[KhorneHunter57x]

Hey all, a question came up recently in my gaming group, and we failed to resolve it. I used searchy, but failed to find an answer. If one is out there, please enlighten me.

 

Anyway, Destroyer weapons have become more and more popular in our group, and we had a debate about a certain aspect of the rules. Here is the part of the Destroyer rule that is causing the argument:

This hit can still be downgraded to a glancing hit by rules that have that effect (smoke launchers, fast moving skimmers etc), with the exception of cover, which cannot obscure the vehicle as the destroyer weapon just blasts its way right through.

and later in the Destroyer rules it states

no cover saves are allowed, as described above...

 

So the question is: Do units that have an artifically-generated Vehicle Obscured cover save (from Tau Disruption Pods, Ork Kustom Force Fields, Imperial Smoke Launchers, etc.) still recieve this save against S: D weapons?

 

For: The rules for S: D weapons state that the only Vehicle Obscured that S: D ignores is from cover, and the others still have affect.

 

Against: Vehicle Obscured grants a cover save, and because the Destroyer rules explicitly state that no cover saves may be taken from S: D weapons.

 

Also Against: The Destroyer rules state that the shot can be downgraded to a glancing hit. Because 5th edition Vehicle Obscured does not grant a reduction to glancing, the section in the Destroyer rules that says "artificial" Obscuring works (from Smoke Launchers, etc.) has no effect, because the rules have been changed.

 

What is you input?

 

(and yes, we realise that Black Templar smoke launchers still work)

[Ashe Darke]

Obscured either via smoke or 50% hidden confers a cover save. D weapons allows no cover saves. Simple. You cannot hide a vehicle from a D weapon except LoS and even that is direct. It can still scatter onto it. They are the death of tanks.

[Frosty the Pyro]

pretty simple. Do smoke launchers, disruption pods, etc provide a cover save? yes

Do destroyer weapons ignore cover saves? yes

 

For smoke to be uefull against st D you need an old codex.

[KhorneHunter57x]

Thanks. The majority in our group thought this way, but I just wanted your input.

[Grey Mage]

So, not to threadjack to much but on a related issue- what about eldar waveserpents and their forcefields? Does the Strength D cap out at str 8?

[Ashe Darke]

Nope because you don't roll to penetrate, you just penetrate. I think anyway, this is how I'd look at it as there is no S+d6 mechanic for them. Who says D is above 8 or even in the numerical spectrum? You still need to roll twice and pick the lowest where appropriate though.

 

D weapon vs Monolith is what I find funny.

 

EDIT: Just looked at the book and it said 'If a weapon has a D instead of a strength value...' implying that it's not a strength value and can't be modified by the Eldar fields.

[KhorneHunter57x]

Nope because you don't roll to penetrate, you just penetrate. I think anyway, this is how I'd look at it as there is no S+d6 mechanic for them. Who says D is above 8 or even in the numerical spectrum? You still need to roll twice and pick the lowest where appropriate though.

 

*snip*

 

EDIT: Just looked at the book and it said 'If a weapon has a D instead of a strength value...' implying that it's not a strength value and can't be modified by the Eldar fields.

True. Destroyer weapons don't have a Strength value; S D is just an easy way to say a S - weapon has the Destroyer special rule (and I prefer it, because most S - weapons tend to be pretty weedy compared to D weapons) and even if the Eldar fields reduced D to 8, the weapon would still have the Destroyer special rule saying that it doesn't matter. It's like using a 4th-ed Wraithcannon.

 

D weapon vs Monolith is what I find funny.

Your metal won't be alive after this! *sound of Volcano Cannon powering up*