dizzy-xc Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Just wondering if I can attach either or and then both a WGBL and a WG to a scout squad and not lose any scout goodness. Does the WGBL have to take Hunter Saga to outflank with the scouts? If yes, I remember hearing a WG can outflank withh scouts, if so why cant a WGBL w/o having to take Hunter? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderpup Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 The Wolf Guard Pack Leader actually becomes part of the unit (Not an independant character) That's why he gets to outflank with the scouts. The Wolf Guard Battle Leader is an independant character and as such does not get the bonuses from the scout pack. Whether an IC with Saga of the hunter can OBEL with scouts is still up for debate. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearboy Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Pack leaders can use Behind enemy lines, Battle leaders will need Hunter and then can only do a regular outflank. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245608 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzy-xc Posted January 13, 2010 Author Share Posted January 13, 2010 OBEL ??? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderpup Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 OBEL = Behind Enemy Lines... the Wolf Scouts version of outflanking Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245612 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzy-xc Posted January 13, 2010 Author Share Posted January 13, 2010 thx guys! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245617 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglespuss Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 On that note, it gets a little complicated, as wolf scouts can't just 'outflank', it doesn't give this option. Wolfscouts Operate Behind Enemy Lines, and must use this option if utilising outflank, thats another reason why an independent character can't do this while attached to a scout squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245636 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natanael Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Poor wording in codex made them FAQ it, but poor wording in FAQ means it is still up for debate (IIRC). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245656 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 WGBL with Saga of the Hunter can outflank with a scout squad. He becomes part of the unit in reserves and when our scouts roll to outflank they use the OBEL chart instead of the normal one, so yes an attached IC with SotH can outflank via OBEL. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2245992 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzy-xc Posted January 13, 2010 Author Share Posted January 13, 2010 Wow, pretty confusing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246019 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WG Vrox Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Pack leaders can use Behind enemy lines, Battle leaders will need Hunter and then can only do a regular outflank. Please don't post answers as if your answer is final on a known debated issue. If you are going to respond, let the person who is asking the question know it is an issue in debate, then give your opinion. Other wise you confuse the young pups out there. Vrox. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246027 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Wolf Guard can 100% Outflank with Scouts, and may also use OBEL. This is in the new FAQ. The FAQ also said that any IC with Saga of the Hunter may Outflank with Scouts. It was not made clear however if they could use OBEL. Many have said that as OBEL is NOT a Universal Special Rule, the Scouts would continue to have that rule when joined by an IC. OBEL simply alters the roll made when using Outflanking. So by that logic, you could also use OBEL with an IC joining the unit. However this is a contentious issue. However taking a WG Pack Leader and OBELing with Scouts is 100% legal. And taking an IC with Saga of the Hunter and Outflanking with Scouts is also 100% legal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246039 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzy-xc Posted January 13, 2010 Author Share Posted January 13, 2010 Cool, thanks for clearing that up. Ummm, technically speaking, where is the OBEL line? Does it include the left and right side of the board adjacent to the enemy corner or measured 12" away from it? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246100 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Technically it's wherever You wish, providing You rolled 3+. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 If your on the right side its anywhere on the right hand board edge... left side, anywhere on the left hand board edge... right on the corner if you like, *shrugs*. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246187 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Also, funny thing is that the FAQ wording tend to suggest that scouts do have the regular outfland ability as well, in addition to OBEL. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246195 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Also, funny thing is that FAQ actually suggests that scouts have the regular outfland ability, in addition to OBEL. They do... if they couldnt outflank, they couldnt use OBEL. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246225 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Thanks - I did not know that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246229 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglespuss Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 well they do have 'outflank' in their list entry, but don't have the ability to only 'outflank' they have to operate behind enemy lines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246492 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ullr Direfang Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 REALLY?!?!?!?!?! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246494 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Rereading the BEL entry in the wolf dex, and the relevant FAQ questions, I can only conclude that a wolf scout unit with an IC (with Saga of hte Hunter) can OBEL. Scouts never use the normal Outflank chart, they use BEL chart. But its just a modification to outflanking, which is legal for the IC with SotH. People may argue against it, but I can't see a reason to not allow it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246505 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Yes, yes, 1000 times yes. They Outflank- period, end of story. When they outflank they use a special rule, called operate behind enemy lines or OBEL, that gives them a different chart to roll on and expands their options. OBEL doesnt grant outflank, it just modifies it. Scouts have both rules. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246509 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 i look at it this way, if the scouts can show a wolf guard how to infiltrate/obel/scout despite him having none of the normal rules and likely being drunk then hey would easily be able to show a hero of the chapter who happens to be a pretty acomplished hunter how to do the same. in other words, as it is a modification of the standard outflank rules i can see no reason thzt a character with outflank would not use the same chart as the unit he is with. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246532 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 It doesnt hurt that the rules say you roll for the unit *shrugs*. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246651 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 Rereading the BEL entry in the wolf dex, and the relevant FAQ questions, I can only conclude that a wolf scout unit with an IC (with Saga of hte Hunter) can OBEL. Scouts never use the normal Outflank chart, they use BEL chart. But its just a modification to outflanking, which is legal for the IC with SotH. People may argue against it, but I can't see a reason to not allow it. I used to think otherwise, but this is my new conclusion as well. They could have done a better job on this question in the FAQ and explicitly stated it, but I think that we've got enough to go on to justify the continued Behind Enemy Lines chart use for Outflanking Wolf Scouts with a Wolf Guard Leader and/or Independent Character with Saga of the Hunter. Which is pretty damned cool. My Scouts made a pretty good assault force already, and now they are going to be extremely effective: 10x Wolf Scouts with a Melta Gun, 2x Power Weapons, and 1x Mark of the Wulfen + Attached Wolf Guard Leader with Power Fist or Thunderhammer and Combi-Melta + Joined Wolf Priest with Saga of the Hunter and Melta Bombs With the Wolf Priests Oath (against Infantry, usually) and the rerolls to hit, that becomes a high-impact assault unit, despite the fact that most of them only have Scout Armor. I'm looking forward to using this one. V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189607-can-i-attach-a-wgbl-to-a-scout-squad-and-outflank/#findComment-2246681 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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