SM Idol or is it The Imperiums got Talent?

[mousetrap]

Hello to you all!

 

Thats right, I'm stuck for ideas so thought I'd let you all create the first 'Peoples Army'!

 

This may look a lot to read but please stick with it as I'd love your help.

 

I feel I ought to give you the back story...

 

When I was a nipper my best mate bought the original Space Crusade (Any of you remember that bad boy?) and my love for all things miniature was born. I've always loved painting and converting the models and after exhausting the models in the space crusade box I had to go and get some more to paint, and so it continued for a year or so.

 

I only ever really painted the models if I'm honest, other than space crusade and a little foray with space hulk I never managed to get my head around the wargaming? I did enter a 'bring your favourite model down for battle' at my local GW once but after he died before a dice had been rolled in anger my interest in playing the game dropped off. The painting always stayed with me.

 

Eventually different hobbies and past times became more prevalent and as a result my wargaming/modelling/painting stopped.

 

Until Now...

 

After an 18 year hiatus I was bought a load of modelling paints for Christmas (well about a dozen to be honest) and I decided to pick up the brushes again. I bought myself some terminators and a command squad (I decimated the command squad by trying to convert too much too soon!). I've been limited by the number of colours I had available and also I wanted to create my own legion using an as yet unused (nearly) colour scheme.

 

The only problem is, I have hit a wall and have no idea where to go from now?

 

Which is hopefully where you lovely people come in.

 

I've attached the colour scheme idea as well as a painted miniature. So here is what I need from you with the following Guidelines:

 

1.

I need a name.

 

Something that may help; I love Heraldry like the olde knights of old, I figure that if these boys are fighting a crusade for an emperor they'll really like heraldry, steeping themselves in history.

A couple I've been playing with are 'Warding Angels', 'Knights of Ursa', 'Hellenic Knights' & 'Lords of War'. I like the last 2, the 'hellenic knights' means 'greek knights' really but I like the Hell bit in it!

 

2.

I need an emblem.

I like what I have so far (Blue and Cream with a Red arrow and Yellow diagonal) but really need your help on how to make it look more 40k!

 

3.

I need Fluff.

 

I need so much fluff you could fill a pillow the size of your bed. At the minute I have low fluff (its more like dust than Fluff). From what I can tell, I'll need the fluff to shape things like Army lists, characters (i.e what they are strong at, fast attack, melee etc). It doesn't need to be in depth like mothers maiden names etc just enough to make an army! Having looked into it on the lexicanum site and it seems there were 2 first foundings lost at some point. I was going to be cocky and try and claim one but think that may upset the applecart somewhat (plus thinking up my own heraldry has been a nightmare, I did have an idea for an ancient greek inspired legion as the greek god names could be used for the units highlighting the units strength? too much? I think it may be easier for convertions and markings to use an existing Legion and be a second founding or something?

 

4.

I need conversion Ideas and special unit painting scheme Ideas.

I've bought some Dark angel veterans to make into my veterans (I think the capes lend themselves to the feel of the knights of old) so help there would be great.

 

5.

I need Tips for painting and modelling this army.

What works in a battle and what doesn't (I want them to be usable at some point!)

 

I appreciate this may be a big ask but as a proper geek I like things to have a back story and a bit of believability

 

So that's it (eventually you all sigh!) over to you, anything you think of even if its quite small

 

Colour Scheme:

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/9/92/Termie.jpg

 

Heraldry, I think the Zeus character may go?:

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/d/dc/Heraldry.jpg

 

The 1 Terminator I've Painted:

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/9/93/SM.jpg

 

Thanks

[Dosjetka]

*whistles* well...you're asking for A HECK OF A LOT!!! you have to do some yourself. no one is going to do it ALL for you. i will help but i have a few questions and things to point out first.

 

1) does the name have to contain the words "lords" or "knights" ?

 

2) emblem will come with name. so later on.

 

3) don't claim to be one of the original legions. it will be too much. you'll need to have tons of fluff (so it'll take a VERY long time and you need to know your 40k stuff VERY well...)

 

4) dark angels have robes, not capes. is that what you meant? if it is, then, yes, i think robes are very "knightly".

 

5) that's secondary right now IMO.

 

6) are you good at modelling?

 

7) do you want a unique army in both painted/modeled and fluff ways? (well fluff almost needs to be)

 

8) i don't think the whole robes and knight thing goes with greek stuff...plus you shouldn't base your whole chapter on one mythology and use very well known names. it's just being lazy...unless that's what you want (no offence meant).

 

so...a lot of work to do but i'm willing to help at least a bit (i have school and many other wh40k projects to handle, so i'll help you as much as i can.)

 

again, i may sound harsh but you have to be....and i don't mean to offence you in any way.

 

BBL

 

Edit: this discussion shouldn't really be here...ask a mod to put in Index Astartes part (i think it should go there, but you should still ask, just in case) or maybe even in Liber Astartes...dunno, just ask

[mousetrap]

Thanks for that! I feel I should have explained the Pop idol, imperium's got talent link a little better, basically I was hoping that the good people of this forum would offer ideas for the important historical info and continue to add stuff as they thought of it, sort of like writing your own book but with multiple authors? What I meant by people doing it for me was to add stuff to the thread they thought might help so post reads : Their homeworld is called "Annubis" if it was a good name we'd run with it and if not we'd keep searching! As I am a complete no brain when it comes to Space marine history and traits I will need people to do this for me as I have no idea where to start or finish!

 

I know its a lot for 1 person to come up with so I was hoping it would become a 'many hands make light work' kind of thing, more of a think tank...

 

On with my reply.

 

I don't think you're being harsh at all, this is why I started the thread as I'm a complete newbie (oldie/newbie hybrid!)

 

1) does the name have to contain the words "lords" or "knights" ?

 

 

Answer: No

 

2) emblem will come with name. so later on.

 

 

Answer: With regard to that, as its a second founding where are they decended from

 

 

3) don't claim to be one of the original legions. it will be too much. you'll need to have tons of fluff (so it'll take a VERY long time and you need to know your 40k stuff VERY well...)

 

 

Answer: Okay, I thought that might be the case, but maybe if enough people chime in!!!

 

 

4) dark angels have robes, not capes. is that what you meant? if it is, then, yes, i think robes are very "knightly".

 

 

Answer: Sorry, I think calling them capes is like calling the Queen mate isn't it? Robes it is.

 

 

5) that's secondary right now IMO.

 

 

Answer: Okay

 

 

6) are you good at modelling?

 

 

Answer: I think so, I wouldn't want to blow my own trumpet, but there are few things I won't have a go at!

 

 

7) do you want a unique army in both painted/modeled and fluff ways? (well fluff almost needs to be)

 

 

Answer: By unique what do you mean?

 

 

8) i don't think the whole robes and knight thing goes with greek stuff...plus you shouldn't base your whole chapter on one mythology and use very well known names. it's just being lazy...unless that's what you want (no offence meant).

 

 

Answer: No Greeks then.

 

Don't worry too much, school first and all that! Any help is much appreciated though.

 

Ta

[KhorneHunter57x]

I need an emblem.

I like what I have so far (Blue and Cream with a Red arrow and Yellow diagonal) but really need your help on how to make it look more 40k!

Maybe replace the "seashells" with skulls?

 

As BB Ludovic put,

you're asking for A HECK OF A LOT!!!

One thing that might help you flesh out your chapter is the Guide to DIYing, stickied at the top of the + LIBER ASTARTES + sub-forum.

 

Hope I helped.

[Dosjetka]

Thanks for that! I feel I should have explained the Pop idol, imperium's got talent link a little better, basically I was hoping that the good people of this forum would offer ideas for the important historical info and continue to add stuff as they thought of it, sort of like writing your own book but with multiple authors? What I meant by people doing it for me was to add stuff to the thread they thought might help so post reads : Their homeworld is called "Annubis" if it was a good name we'd run with it and if not we'd keep searching! As I am a complete no brain when it comes to Space marine history and traits I will need people to do this for me as I have no idea where to start or finish!

 

ok well that's easily remedied (this is a space marine forum for gods sake!) if you want i can send you a few links about space marine and/or general 40k stuff you should know about...and you HAVE to get the space marine codex! that's an order (but you still have the choice, even though i strongly think you should as it will make your understanding of things and make other people's life easier ;) )

 

I know its a lot for 1 person to come up with so I was hoping it would become a 'many hands make light work' kind of thing, more of a think tank...

 

On with my reply.

 

I don't think you're being harsh at all, this is why I started the thread as I'm a complete newbie (oldie/newbie hybrid!)

 

good ;)

 

1) does the name have to contain the words "lords" or "knights" ?

 

 

Answer: No

 

ok good. gives a lot more choice.

 

 

2) emblem will come with name. so later on.

 

 

Answer: With regard to that, as its a second founding where are they decended from

 

 

I don't really get that...is that a question?

 

 

3) don't claim to be one of the original legions. it will be too much. you'll need to have tons of fluff (so it'll take a VERY long time and you need to know your 40k stuff VERY well...)

 

 

Answer: Okay, I thought that might be the case, but maybe if enough people chime in!!!

 

 

you should start small, then it may get bigger along the way. if you want to do another legion, IMO you should wait until this project is finished and then start another (i talk from experience :) )

 

 

4) dark angels have robes, not capes. is that what you meant? if it is, then, yes, i think robes are very "knightly".

 

 

Answer: Sorry, I think calling them capes is like calling the Queen mate isn't it? Robes it is.

 

 

well, if you don't want a "knightly" theme then just drop the robes. it's for you to see what you want.

 

 

5) that's secondary right now IMO.

 

 

Answer: Okay

 

 

6) are you good at modelling?

 

 

Answer: I think so, I wouldn't want to blow my own trumpet, but there are few things I won't have a go at!

 

 

like what (examples of what you do well or hate doing/don't know how to do. hope it's not too much to ask for ;) )

 

 

7) do you want a unique army in both painted/modeled and fluff ways? (well fluff almost needs to be)

 

 

Answer: By unique what do you mean?

 

 

well...i meant as in it doesn't copy it's parent legion/chapter or at least very little...oh and your colour scheme is already very unique, so no need to do anything about that :lol:

 

 

8) i don't think the whole robes and knight thing goes with greek stuff...plus you shouldn't base your whole chapter on one mythology and use very well known names. it's just being lazy...unless that's what you want (no offence meant).

 

 

Answer: No Greeks then.

 

Don't worry too much, school first and all that! Any help is much appreciated though.

 

Ta

 

 

As BB Ludovic put,

you're asking for A HECK OF A LOT!!!

One thing that might help you flesh out your chapter is the Guide to DIYing, stickied at the top of the + LIBER ASTARTES + sub-forum.

 

Hope I helped.

yup, good idea!

 

LINK

[mousetrap]

Get Codex, Check...

 

With regard to the founding question I explained badly, I meant if the legion is a second founding or later the logo will need to have an icon similar to the founding chapter it hails from or at least contain it in its logo (for example put a dark angel sword and wing in the top left of the Crest?)

 

I definitely want the knightly robes

 

I don't have any examples of my modelling to hand and haven't really done a lot with Space marines, I'll remedy that tonight and post pics (hopefully) tomorrow. Any suggestions / tests I should attempt when making a veteran later on?

 

Yes I will be converting and creating my heart out so unique it is, I think it will need to allude to its parent chapter but other than that its free and easy!

 

I'll have a look at the Guide to DIYing.

 

You've already been so helpful. thanks a lot.

[Dosjetka]

Get Codex, Check...

 

With regard to the founding question I explained badly, I meant if the legion is a second founding or later the logo will need to have an icon similar to the founding chapter it hails from or at least contain it in its logo (for example put a dark angel sword and wing in the top left of the Crest?)

 

well that's not an obligation but if you want it that way it can be that way. take BT's as an example, they come from the IF's yet no fist logo on their cross. see what i mean?

 

I definitely want the knightly robes

 

ok. i like them too :lol:

 

I don't have any examples of my modelling to hand and haven't really done a lot with Space marines, I'll remedy that tonight and post pics (hopefully) tomorrow. Any suggestions / tests I should attempt when making a veteran later on?

 

hmmm...well you may want to start low and then build it up bit by bit. maybe start with a normal Marine and then do other things. but then again that's my opinion and it's your choice.

 

Yes I will be converting and creating my heart out so unique it is, I think it will need to allude to its parent chapter but other than that its free and easy!

 

ok so you want it to be like the parent chapter (common combat doctrines, emblem, etc...)

 

I'll have a look at the Guide to DIYing.

 

You've already been so helpful. thanks a lot.

 

you're welcome. i do have a lot to do but i'm just being lazy and helping you which is surprisingly easier :)

 

 

Edit: i'll get thinking on a bit of fluff for you and post it as soon as i've finished writing it.

[mousetrap]

Get Codex, Check...

 

With regard to the founding question I explained badly, I meant if the legion is a second founding or later the logo will need to have an icon similar to the founding chapter it hails from or at least contain it in its logo (for example put a dark angel sword and wing in the top left of the Crest?)

 

well that's not an obligation but if you want it that way it can be that way. take BT's as an example, they come from the IF's yet no fist logo on their cross. see what i mean?

 

I do and I like it, I'm a graphic designer by trade so should be able to knock something up!

 

I definitely want the knightly robes

 

ok. i like them too :lol:

 

I don't have any examples of my modelling to hand and haven't really done a lot with Space marines, I'll remedy that tonight and post pics (hopefully) tomorrow. Any suggestions / tests I should attempt when making a veteran later on?

 

hmmm...well you may want to start low and then build it up bit by bit. maybe start with a normal Marine and then do other things. but then again that's my opinion and it's your choice.

 

Never! I'm going in full blast, Tonight a Veteran tomorrow I'll probably be in tears after ruining a model!

 

Yes I will be converting and creating my heart out so unique it is, I think it will need to allude to its parent chapter but other than that its free and easy!

 

ok so you want it to be like the parent chapter (common combat doctrines, emblem, etc...)

 

I believe so

 

I'll have a look at the Guide to DIYing.

 

You've already been so helpful. thanks a lot.

 

you're welcome. i do have a lot to do but i'm just being lazy and helping you which is surprisingly easier :)

 

Well I'd suggest you get on with what you have to do if its important, this thread will be here when you finish. I'm not trying to get rid of you as you're help so far has been inspiring but I don't wan't to keep you away from your work!

[Dosjetka]

Get Codex, Check...

 

With regard to the founding question I explained badly, I meant if the legion is a second founding or later the logo will need to have an icon similar to the founding chapter it hails from or at least contain it in its logo (for example put a dark angel sword and wing in the top left of the Crest?)

 

well that's not an obligation but if you want it that way it can be that way. take BT's as an example, they come from the IF's yet no fist logo on their cross. see what i mean?

 

I do and I like it, I'm a graphic designer by trade so should be able to knock something up!

 

I definitely want the knightly robes

 

ok. i like them too ;)

 

I don't have any examples of my modelling to hand and haven't really done a lot with Space marines, I'll remedy that tonight and post pics (hopefully) tomorrow. Any suggestions / tests I should attempt when making a veteran later on?

 

hmmm...well you may want to start low and then build it up bit by bit. maybe start with a normal Marine and then do other things. but then again that's my opinion and it's your choice.

 

Never! I'm going in full blast, Tonight a Veteran tomorrow I'll probably be in tears after ruining a model!

 

Yes I will be converting and creating my heart out so unique it is, I think it will need to allude to its parent chapter but other than that its free and easy!

 

ok so you want it to be like the parent chapter (common combat doctrines, emblem, etc...)

 

I believe so

 

I'll have a look at the Guide to DIYing.

 

You've already been so helpful. thanks a lot.

 

you're welcome. i do have a lot to do but i'm just being lazy and helping you which is surprisingly easier :)

 

Well I'd suggest you get on with what you have to do if its important, this thread will be here when you finish. I'm not trying to get rid of you as you're help so far has been inspiring but I don't wan't to keep you away from your work!

:lol: my work is getting done right now! don't you worry about me. when i get excited about something i dive into it like a ork would into a puddle of muck! (though i'm not an ork ;) )

 

ok, well we'll see tomorow if you've ruined it or not ;) good luck with the veteran in any case!

btw do you want those links to fluff or not?

 

glad to help ya'

 

BBL

[Ace Debonair]

Well, one of the things we do here is not simply make up the stories for awesome, all-powerful marines.

We help make chapter backstories that fit into the accepted views of the 40k universe.

 

So, from a story point of view, I'd drop the whole "second founding that until now you didn't know about" angle.

You lose precisely nothing from being third or even fourth founding if you want an old, old chapter.

 

As highlighted by the others, ancient greeks and knights don't blend too easily, so going easy on the greek element will help there.

 

From what I have gathered, these are the core ideals you want for your chapter:

 

* From an early founding.

* Much veneration of the chapter they came from.

* Heavily into honour and heraldry.

 

Ok, not a bad start. But it's hardly a complete depiction of the chapter, agreed? So here come a few vital questions.

Have you got any personal favourites amongst the existing chapters?

I ask this because your knightly chapter could place a lot of value into veneration of ancestors and those who came before them, which would explain copying their parent chapter's emblem. If you so choose, this could also give them a strong link to dreadnoughts.

Have you got any favourite types of units? (Ordinary marines, terminators, tanks, assault marines, bikes... anything at all?)

 

Oh, and the painted-up Terminator looks really cool, by the way. :lol:

[Dosjetka]

good! i'm not alone in this! you've made some very good points there Ace, as usual!

 

yes, that model is really nice (as metionned before...i think) :lol:

[mousetrap]

Right,

 

Firstly Mr Battle Brother Ludovic, yes please to the links to the Fluff.

 

Secondly Mr Ace Debonair, thanks for coming on board and thanks for the queries.

 

I think you're right, there may be a tendency to try and make a new chapter the mega-awesomist chapter ever by giving them incredible powers etc but thats not what I'm after. You hit the nail on the head with it needing to be accepted. Second Founding is out of the question but a very old chapter steeped in venerability is what I'm after, so which founding should I go with?

 

The only reason I went with the greek idea was a lot of the current chapters use runic or latin text to express themselves and i wanted something different and ancient greek/coptic seemed as good a place as any? The only problem I had with it was whats the likelihood of an ancient language and script being used 38 thousand yearrs from now (which gets me onto another gripe, if Man has survived that long, mastered interplanetary travel, powered armour, plasma guns and the like, how come the windows on the tanks (rhinos) look like something from the 1920's? surely they'd have whatever the new infrared sight is in the futuer on board. Note to self when making a rhiino think of something cool for the windows!) Back to the point, what do you reckon to the idea of a new hyroglyphic system? i.e I create my own hyroglyphs? or does latin show real loyalty to the emperor? I think that if I'm going for the whole Knight/Venerable/steeped in History then the chapter is defo going to need to be a mega loyal and proud Emperor-phile

 

so:

 

"From what I have gathered, these are the core ideals you want for your chapter:

 

* From an early founding.

* Much veneration of the chapter they came from.

* Heavily into honour and heraldry."

 

Yes Please

 

regarding the personal favourites amongst the existing chapters?

 

I used to play as blood angels in space crusade and I do like the story about their flawed gene seed, thats prettty cool (but shows too much weakness at the same time?) I like the heraldry of the Black templars's and the warrior monk look of the Dark Angel's, I like the look of the daemonhunters but fear that'd be opening a can of worms no one want s to hear about! I did read something about commander or captain cortez of the crimson fists, I liked it but it seemed a little far fetched. Space wolf models are just coooool but think there must be a 101 new foundings from them and I want to be a little more unique.

 

I like the dreadnought idea.

 

If I do use a logo from the founders I'd put it in the top left instead of the bloke throwing the spear!

 

Regarding the units, I like terminators, veterans, the ones with the jet packs, bikes, rhino's, land cruisers, those flying things look good, I'm not overly bothered by bikes or devastators? I did read an army list someone posted saying they were interested in fast/deep strike ability, I think that means fast moving which I like the idea of (without bikes if possible) but do the Vets and terms stop that, can I be a hybrid?

 

Thanks for the props on the Terminator, I was pretty happy with it, especially as it was my first attempt in 18 years!

[Ace Debonair]

Make your own language by all means.

 

They are going to be stationed somewhere off in the galaxy, after all, and there's bound to be a lot of languages about. Heck, Earth alone has a few, doesn't it?

To shamelessly plug for a moment, my Stonebound have their own language, although it's not the only one they speak.

 

Third founding or later is good.

Don't use space wolf geneseed, since it's basically stuffed beyond repair.

Blood Angels' strengths make up for their weaknesses, don't you think? :lol:

But any of them are good. Geneseed hardly makes the chapter unique, in any case.

 

I'm not too clued up on how the armies work, but story-wise it sounds like you'd be best off with a good ol' fashioned balanced codex force.

Being able to do everything to space-marine level means you can do everything pretty well anyway. :D

[mousetrap]

I'll have a go at my own language but if it gets too difficult I'll revert to the easy latin!

 

with regard to their homeworld is there any tips you'd give me to pick a homeworld, any benefits or costs for choosing a specific region? nearer the warp makes you better vs chaos?

 

Okay Third founding or later is good. I'll go for 3rd founding, play close to the original chapters for extra history (which means more homework).

Space wolfs sound like loosers! but they look good unfortunately this time pretty won't cut it!

"Blood Angels' strengths make up for their weaknesses, don't you think?" I've no idea? I only know that they have a weakness (something to do with their death company? I'll look it up)

 

I'm equally as clueless about the force I should use so hopefully an expert can have a read and help out!

 

Thanks a lot so far fro your help.

[ChaplainMathreyn]

Give your Homeworld a culture... A people, with their own customs, language, etc. Then, tie bits and pieces of that planetary culture in with your Chapter to make it much more interesting.

 

You need to cull your Brother Marines from the best-of-the-best, and preferably before the age of 15, so think pretty violent people or pretty hostile terrain/fauna.

 

Being "closer" to something (An Ork empire, an Eldar Craftworld's route, the Eye of Constant-Fear, etc.) means that, yes, you'd generally adopt better than average skills at fighting that particular xenos. Many Space Marine Chapters have been created to contain large amounts of hostile space, too, so there is abit of a precedent for it.

 

However, being near the Eye, or any area that is under constant attack from Warp Storms, and the Warp, means a higher risk of corruption in your Marines... Once Brother Steve grows that tentacle from his left arm, you know it's time to change homeworlds... Or turn traitor and kill/maim/slaughter.

 

Blood Angels' strengths make up for their weaknesses, don't you think?

 

Clearly, what Ace is referring to is his dream to one day be like Dante, going crazy and leading a suicidal charge into a host of Orks... Or maybe I'm wrong. :mellow: Or maybe that is my dream. I forget.

 

... In all seriousness, though, he is referring to the Black Rage (Marines that "snap" and go googily crazy, trying to massacre everything within arms distance... And the Red Thirst, a desire to consume the blood of both friend and foe, alike. The Death Company is a "last stop shop" for intense sufferers of the Black Rage and the Red Thirst, so to speak, so they can die an honorable death in combat...)

 

Just look up the Ultramarines structure for a 'Codex Chapter'... The are pretty firmly set (Given their Primarch wrote the darn book.) The Space Wolfs organization is, needless to say, 'Non-Codex'.

 

Also, although choosing geneseed doesn't "make" your Chapter, note the lack of certain organs with some sets (Like the Imperial Fists and Raven Guard sets), and note that Your geneseed isn't as pure (It is constantly diluted as it's passed down), so feel free to mess around with an organ or implant to make things fun.

[The Normish]

I like the color scheme, and recommend that you have a look at the articles around the DIY section for help.

 

As for a name, I think something with "Knights" in it seems fitting.

[Dosjetka]

1) hm...when are the pics of your veteran coming? ;)

 

i'll write a more constructive comment later on, no time right now!

 

2) looking good all this stuff!

 

3)

Regarding the units, I like terminators, veterans, the ones with the jet packs, bikes, rhino's, land cruisers, those flying things look good, I'm not overly bothered by bikes or devastators? I did read an army list someone posted saying they were interested in fast/deep strike ability, I think that means fast moving which I like the idea of (without bikes if possible) but do the Vets and terms stop that, can I be a hybrid?

yes you can do that by putting all foot-slogging units into transports, taking land speeders, using jump packs by the bucket load, using units with the deep strike rule (not fast-moving but it can pack up a good punch if you use it with precision and strength ;) , but then it's always good to have bikes as they have many uses and you can use them as troops if you have a bike captain. the only problem with a fast moving force is you can't really have dreadnoughts as they are slow and are only there for support so they may not be that usefull in a fast-moving army.

yes you can do hybrid, in any case. you just have to know how to use things properly. ill come up with a few army lists and post them ASAP.

 

4)

(...) or does latin show real loyalty to the emperor? I think that if I'm going for the whole Knight/Venerable/steeped in History then the chapter is defo going to need to be a mega loyal and proud Emperor-phile

hmmm...no you can invent your own language but all higher up memebers (maybe even all, i'm not sure. does anyone know?) need to know how to speak high gothic (latin) to be able to communicate with other imperial organisations/chapters.

 

5) i'm getting more and more excited about this thing. i can really feel that it's coming together ! :D

 

6) here are a few links. i'll add more as i go along:

 

Lexicanum - Imperium

Lexicanum - Space Marines

Lexicanum - List of Space Marine Chapters (so that you can see which ones you like and not take the same name as one that already exists and created by GW)

Lexicanum - Geneseed

Lexicanum - Codex Astartes

Lexicanum - Adeptus Astartes Homeworld

Lexicanum - Founding (Space Marine)

Lexicanum - Space Marine Dreadnought

Lexicanum - Black Templars

Lexicanum - Space Marine Legions

 

7) you can still use BT rules but not use that range of mini's (ie: use DA robes, etc...). so i would suggest you get the BT codex for a bit of historical reference, heraldry ideas, etc...

 

 

 

ok folks! that's all for now...i'll post again when i have time to read the answers (probably tomorrow sometime).

 

For the Emperor!

 

BBL

[mousetrap]

Good Afternoon everyone,

 

Right replies;

 

ChaplainMathreyn

 

Loving the build from the bottom advice with regard to the customs etc which will give me the heralsry I'm after, I suppose depending on which planet I choose it will dictate what culture I develop. I like the idea of the violent planet/civilisation but If i'm going for the whole knights in shining armour aspect I want them to have a bit of decorum rather than be wandering about maiming, beating etc. But then again I don't want them to be gentlmen throwing their petticoats over puddles so the invading orks don't get their feet wet!!

 

I'll knock the idea of living near to another xenos idea on the head as their doesn't seem to be much point in it. Living near the warp sounds like fun, how many tentacles do you need to be certified as 'in trouble'?

 

I like the Black rage and red thirst but question the detrimental effect it has on the marines, I wanted them to be an uber skilled tactical force with little room for anything but perfection so I'm not sure about the flaw at the minute, it does add story, but detracts from my marines ability in the eyes of others? Hmmm.

 

Whats the difference between being non Codex and Codex?

 

I Will pick a geneseed from one of the founding chapters in due course!

 

Battle Brother Ludovic

 

1) Veteran is on the table. I don't know if you've ever come into contact with the Dark angels veteran pack? Well their robes are solid, I mean solid which means they look like they are 3ft thick at some points so I spest the best part of 2 hours last night hollowing out a robe to make it look more realistic, chipping away plastic without hacking the model in 2 is stressful, not to mention the fact you flick pieces of sharp plastic in to your eye at least 3 times!

 

3)

QUOTE

I want a dreadnought, I don't like the bike models for reasons I mentioned yesterday (if its 38k years in the future how come we still have motorised bikes? The flying things and the rhinos are fairly believable but the bikes, give it a rest, i half expect one of the marines to Mod himself up start wearing drainpipe jeans and a parker coat and ride into battle on a Vespa).

 

I look forward to your army list.

 

4)

I think I'll go for Latin and my own language for reasons listed below!!!

 

Thanks for the links! I'll read through them tonight.

 

7) So you want me to buy another codex?! Do you work for Games Workshop or something!? If the BT's Codex is fairly similar to the normal codex I may get it instead but if its vastly different I think I'll get the normal codex and build off from the main guidelines

 

Anyway to encompass and bring in a couple of points and decisions I've made, what do you reckon to this idea?

 

I found a planet called Chiros in the segmentum pacificus (are we allowed to make this their homeworld? pacificus sounds like pacify/peaceful, not sure a batlle hungry war machine could hail from their?). It is covered in forests (which lends itself to my colour scheme) and its main export is luxury furs (good for robes?) and medical elixars (shows an advanced civilisation exists which could gives rise to my lord and ladies!). If I make it so there are 2 distinct sets of civilisations (both human) one who live in the more gentile developed life of the cities (speak the latin stuff) and another tribal civilisation who prefer to live feral in the woods (giving rise to a more blood thirsty ragers, speaking their own language? so marines in the army have to be able to speak both to follow orders or pass on information?).

 

Both sets of civilization give recruits to be used as marines but have very specific roles within the army. The Civilised recruits have lived a life without wanting anything, they've spent there whole lives preparing for battle through hours and years of technique training (a bit like the spartans but with a little more culture outside the fighting. These recruits are calm, collected and perfectly skilled which means they are probably best suited for the more technical squads; jump packs? Snipers? any other suggestions) The others are just natural killers, no technique, brawn and muscle are their overiding skills, although this doesn't mean they aren't clever, maybe just a little sneakier? (So I was thinking they'd be best at hand to hand comabt or guerilla warfare tactics?).

 

I don't know if this is unique or whether it is very similar to an army already out there? If it is very similar I want to knock that Idea on the head as I want this army to be unique and like nothing seen before (a big ask I know, especially as there are so many good back stories out there so when I so totally unique I actually mean it should be 'unique within reason'. I fear this may be very similar to the Space wolves?).

 

I'm not sure if chapters need to have a flaw but 1 that could arise from this would be an element of infighting due to the class divide but I don't know? I'm not sure I'd want a problem with deliberate friendly fire? Going mad and killing a colleague like the blood angels seems okay but just doing it because he's richer than you would give out the wrong impression!! Who'd want to fight alongside those badboys!?

 

I think that just about covers where I'm upto at the moment, I'll keep saying it, thanks for your help so far and Its great to see it growing already.

 

Yesterday We had nothing and now well I have nothing concrete but at least I have a direction!

 

Cheers

 

Al

[Argon]

Good Afternoon everyone

 

Hi :D ! How ya doin? I'm fine, myself.

 

I like the idea of the violent planet/civilisation but If i'm going for the whole knights in shining armour aspect I want them to have a bit of decorum rather than be wandering about maiming, beating etc. But then again I don't want them to be gentlmen throwing their petticoats over puddles so the invading orks don't get their feet wet!!

 

As a rule, Space Marines and beat don't go together. Unless they're Slanneshi, of course.

 

 

 

Whats the difference between being non Codex and Codex?

The Ultramarines and all of their sucessors are Codex chapters. The Dark Angels, with the Raven- and Deathwings, are semi-codex. The Black Templars and Space Wolves are non Codex. Get the picture?

 

 

flick pieces of sharp plastic in to your eye at least 3 times!

 

Ow. Ow ow ow. Ow ow ow ow. PAIN! :)

 

I want a dreadnought, I don't like the bike models for reasons I mentioned yesterday (if its 38k years in the future how come we still have motorised bikes? The flying things and the rhinos are fairly believable but the bikes, give it a rest, i half expect one of the marines to Mod himself up start wearing drainpipe jeans and a parker coat and ride into battle on a Vespa).

 

They had flying bikes before the Heresy, actually. But then they forgot how to make them.

Then again, this is the setting where one of our most effective infantry killers is only made on the handful of worlds that still have the STC template and in the thousands of years they've had to perfect it they haven't figured out how to make it not explode. :)

 

 

 

I found a planet called Chiros in the segmentum pacificus (are we allowed to make this their homeworld? pacificus sounds like pacify/peaceful, not sure a batlle hungry war machine could hail from their?).... If I make it so there are 2 distinct sets of civilisations (both human) one who live in the more gentile developed life of the cities (speak the latin stuff) and another tribal civilisation who prefer to live feral in the woods (giving rise to a more blood thirsty ragers, speaking their own language? so marines in the army have to be able to speak both to follow orders or pass on information?)

 

Don't forget where the Macharian Crusade took place. Also, the fluff I can dig up on Chiros says that it's an Agri-world and that the population is involved in the production of "rejuvenating elixirs, fine furs and rare narcotics created from its natural flora and fauna."

 

 

As for the "2 peoples on 1 world", I had a similar idea for my DIY Chapter. One (rather large) half of the main continent was a temperate place that was like a Feudal World, with a bunch of kingdoms that were at war with each other more often than not. The other half was a barren desert that was more like a Feral world than anything else, with nomadic tribes that fought each other for what resources they could find. If you can make it work, go for it. I kinda abandoned it because I was focusing on the Feudal half more than the other.

 

The language idea? That's why they made High Gothic :P . Although a Chapter of tri-lingual Marines would be kinda cool.

 

 

Also, I had an idea for the names of your Marines: Use the names of King Arthur's knights. No, not the ones like Lancelot, Bedevere, and Galahad. I'm talking about the other knights like Griflet, Sagramore, and Bors. Here's a full list

[Ace Debonair]

If there's already official stuff on a planet, it might be less trouble just to make up a name for one.

 

That way you can do your own thing with the planet and it's people.

 

Nobody would look down on your marines for being Blood Angels, inside or outside of the 40K universe. Only the Blood Angels (and their successors) know everything about the curse - it's not widespread knowledge. Most other Imperials don't even know the Black Rage exists. ;)

 

If you do take that route, it could make a very interesting story. You've got marines who are doing everything they can to be noble, heroic, and generally examplary, and then eventually they become battle-crazed killing machines which the rest of the chapter keep on a very tight leash and out of the sight of the rest of the Imperium. As a side note, you could give the Death Company (all those afflicted with the Black Rage) different coloured robes from the rest of the chapter. :D

 

Segmentum Pacificus is a good enough place for a homeworld. Down there, however, you'll mostly be fighting Orks, just so you're aware.

And woe betide the Ork that steps on the coats of your marines. :P Gentlemen or no, those bolters aren't just for show...

 

Trilingual marines is a very novel idea. My Stonebound chapter have their own language, but a chapter with two languages unique to themselves could be pretty cool.

[Dosjetka]

Good Afternoon everyone,

 

Right replies;

 

ChaplainMathreyn

 

Loving the build from the bottom advice with regard to the customs etc which will give me the heralsry I'm after, I suppose depending on which planet I choose it will dictate what culture I develop. I like the idea of the violent planet/civilisation but If i'm going for the whole knights in shining armour aspect I want them to have a bit of decorum rather than be wandering about maiming, beating etc. But then again I don't want them to be gentlmen throwing their petticoats over puddles so the invading orks don't get their feet wet!!

 

I'll knock the idea of living near to another xenos idea on the head as their doesn't seem to be much point in it. Living near the warp sounds like fun, how many tentacles do you need to be certified as 'in trouble'?

 

I like the Black rage and red thirst but question the detrimental effect it has on the marines, I wanted them to be an uber skilled tactical force with little room for anything but perfection so I'm not sure about the flaw at the minute, it does add story, but detracts from my marines ability in the eyes of others? Hmmm.

 

Whats the difference between being non Codex and Codex?

 

I Will pick a geneseed from one of the founding chapters in due course!

 

Battle Brother Ludovic

 

1) Veteran is on the table. I don't know if you've ever come into contact with the Dark angels veteran pack? Well their robes are solid, I mean solid which means they look like they are 3ft thick at some points so I spest the best part of 2 hours last night hollowing out a robe to make it look more realistic, chipping away plastic without hacking the model in 2 is stressful, not to mention the fact you flick pieces of sharp plastic in to your eye at least 3 times!

 

ow... :cuss

 

3)

QUOTE

I want a dreadnought, I don't like the bike models for reasons I mentioned yesterday (if its 38k years in the future how come we still have motorised bikes? The flying things and the rhinos are fairly believable but the bikes, give it a rest, i half expect one of the marines to Mod himself up start wearing drainpipe jeans and a parker coat and ride into battle on a Vespa).

 

I look forward to your army list.

 

yes, i do too :D ;) i'll do it as soon as i can. so there will be a couple of drafts first, which i'll post here, you'll all comment, and then i'll correct and publish the final! sounds ok?

 

4)

I think I'll go for Latin and my own language for reasons listed below!!!

 

Thanks for the links! I'll read through them tonight.

 

you're welcome! ;)

 

7) So you want me to buy another codex?! Do you work for Games Workshop or something!? If the BT's Codex is fairly similar to the normal codex I may get it instead but if its vastly different I think I'll get the normal codex and build off from the main guidelines

 

Anyway to encompass and bring in a couple of points and decisions I've made, what do you reckon to this idea?

 

I found a planet called Chiros in the segmentum pacificus (are we allowed to make this their homeworld? pacificus sounds like pacify/peaceful, not sure a batlle hungry war machine could hail from their?). It is covered in forests (which lends itself to my colour scheme) and its main export is luxury furs (good for robes?) and medical elixars (shows an advanced civilisation exists which could gives rise to my lord and ladies!). If I make it so there are 2 distinct sets of civilisations (both human) one who live in the more gentile developed life of the cities (speak the latin stuff) and another tribal civilisation who prefer to live feral in the woods (giving rise to a more blood thirsty ragers, speaking their own language? so marines in the army have to be able to speak both to follow orders or pass on information?).

 

Both sets of civilization give recruits to be used as marines but have very specific roles within the army. The Civilised recruits have lived a life without wanting anything, they've spent there whole lives preparing for battle through hours and years of technique training (a bit like the spartans but with a little more culture outside the fighting. These recruits are calm, collected and perfectly skilled which means they are probably best suited for the more technical squads; jump packs? Snipers? any other suggestions) The others are just natural killers, no technique, brawn and muscle are their overiding skills, although this doesn't mean they aren't clever, maybe just a little sneakier? (So I was thinking they'd be best at hand to hand comabt or guerilla warfare tactics?).

 

I don't know if this is unique or whether it is very similar to an army already out there? If it is very similar I want to knock that Idea on the head as I want this army to be unique and like nothing seen before (a big ask I know, especially as there are so many good back stories out there so when I so totally unique I actually mean it should be 'unique within reason'. I fear this may be very similar to the Space wolves?).

 

I'm not sure if chapters need to have a flaw but 1 that could arise from this would be an element of infighting due to the class divide but I don't know? I'm not sure I'd want a problem with deliberate friendly fire? Going mad and killing a colleague like the blood angels seems okay but just doing it because he's richer than you would give out the wrong impression!! Who'd want to fight alongside those badboys!?

 

I think that just about covers where I'm upto at the moment, I'll keep saying it, thanks for your help so far and Its great to see it growing already.

 

Yesterday We had nothing and now well I have nothing concrete but at least I have a direction!

 

Cheers

 

Al

[bloodred0114]

hey, keep this up sound good... just a little thing... the army type your talking abut sounds more like the white scars than a blood angels army... just a thought, when you come up with a chapter name let me know, I am good a writing fluff for chapters and this sounds like one I could realy get into. will keep watch on this thred,

 

later.

[mousetrap]

Right, thanks for your input so far and i have some developments to report.

 

But first replies:

 

Argon

 

Not Slanesh so no beating then.

 

Does the Codex basically refer to how far they are from the Ultramarine Codex? I'm a little confused about this so if anyone could clarify this for me it would be appreciated.

 

The plastic in the eye has stopped! and I'm on to the more advanced part of the modelling.

 

Flying bikes sound more 38k years in the future, its unforgiveable to forget how to make them though.

 

 

What is the Macharian Crusade? I take it this is fairly seminal in the universe and something my new chapter couldn't rewrite then. Its a shame as I liked Chiros the story worked so well with it. But if the crusade occured way later than the possibility of the chapter being a third founding I'll find somewhere else and make up similar traits.

 

So the chapters new homeworld is from: Joura, Valedor or Quisto'rol (I've given 3 options as I don't know if any of these have history, I've done a brief check but my reference catalogue is small).

 

The Planet will be Heavily Forested as before, as well as having the feral and sophisticated communities and 3 languages. I don't know whether to stick to my current remit, or alter it a little and make the planet a scientific experiment where the feral community are the test subjects and the sophisticated civilisation do the testing on them? In order to protect themselves and their experiments they had to have a space marine force. The genetic tests they do on the feral subjects are non invasive but yield stronger troops that fall foul of the old saying the 'candle that burns twice as brightly burn for half as long'. It would give scope for a flaw to be developed?

 

What do you reckon? stick with the first or change it to the revised idea?

 

I like the names, however i was thinking of using the names of the people who helped out on this thread (meaningful contribution only, no 'this looks great, use my name') as the characters (so long as their names aren't unusable like mine, I don't think Mousetrap the terrible' really works. So have a think about which marine you want to be!!!

 

Ace Deboniar

Taken your advice on the planet.

 

As with the flaw, I like it, noble warriors with a terrible secret, I just hope it doesn't seem contrived.

 

I Like fighting Orks but the new planets I've offered are in the Segmentum Ultima and Pacificus Don't know what they'll be fighting there?

 

Defo going for the tri-linguist chapter.

 

Ludovic

Looking forward to the army list but please don't go out of your way to do something for me, not that I don't want it, what I mean is, if you enjoy doing them and have time I can't wait but I understand if you have more pressing things to deal with first.

 

I still haven't managed to read the BT codex but I will do at some point.

 

Bloodred0114

Thanks for the tip on the White Scars, I'll have alook into them. the name is coming but I think I need a little more back story first.

 

As for my modelling, The Veteran is robed and has a powerfist ready. I did take some pictures but don't have the lead to upload them at the minute, going to get on with him and then post some more hopefully.

 

I do have a question, I was going to give him a power fist and a two handed chain axe/lance (im modelling it at the minute with 2 chain swords on either end of a pole (each facing the opposite direction) is this going to be a problem for rules or doesn't it matter as he looks so darn cool I really don't care!)

 

As per usual thanks for the help and I look forward to your replies.

 

Al

[Argon]

Does the Codex basically refer to how far they are from the Ultramarine Codex? I'm a little confused about this so if anyone could clarify this for me it would be appreciated.

 

In game terms, yes. "Codex" basically means that they follow the Ultramarines Codex. Keep in mind that non-codex Chapters like the Black Templars and Space Wolves are the minority.

 

Flying bikes sound more 38k years in the future, its unforgiveable to forget how to make them though.

Hey, this is the universe where one planet in a system is a Feral world stuck in the Bronze age and the next world over is a Hive World where they're shooting each other with lasers :) .

 

What is the Macharian Crusade? I take it this is fairly seminal in the universe and something my new chapter couldn't rewrite then. Its a shame as I liked Chiros the story worked so well with it. But if the crusade occured way later than the possibility of the chapter being a third founding I'll find somewhere else and make up similar traits.

 

I really only mentioned the Macharian Crusade because it's the reason most of the Segmentum Pacificus is under Imperial control. It's really more of an Imperial Guard thing, but it's still somewhat important and basically set in stone. If you want more info on it go here.

 

So the chapters new homeworld is from: Joura, Valedor or Quisto'rol (I've given 3 options as I don't know if any of these have history, I've done a brief check but my reference catalogue is small).

 

As far as I can tell, Quisto'rol is in the Ultima Segmentum, sitting next to the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath. At least, that's what all the sources I can find say. I don't know if anyone is officially using that particular warp rift, but that's not a problem. There's some potental here. Perhaps your Chapter watches the rift and makes sure nothing bad gets out?

 

Valedor seems to be a source of recruits for the Dark Angels, so it's basically not available.

 

There isn't a world called "Joura", but there is a "Jouran". They're the source of the Jouran Dragoon Imperial Guard regiments. As such, they're basically also not available.

 

 

The Planet will be Heavily Forested as before, as well as having the feral and sophisticated communities and 3 languages. I don't know whether to stick to my current remit, or alter it a little and make the planet a scientific experiment where the feral community are the test subjects and the sophisticated civilisation do the testing on them? In order to protect themselves and their experiments they had to have a space marine force. The genetic tests they do on the feral subjects are non invasive but yield stronger troops that fall foul of the old saying the 'candle that burns twice as brightly burn for half as long'. It would give scope for a flaw to be developed?

 

I think I see what you're going for here, but I'm not sure. How does that saying apply to the troops that result from the test? Why does this one planet get it's own personal Chapter? There's only 1,000 Chapters in the Imperium and over 1 million worlds. I don't see why this one planet wouldn't get a Guard regiment or something instead. Personally, I'd suggest sticking to the first idea.

 

I like the names, however i was thinking of using the names of the people who helped out on this thread (meaningful contribution only, no 'this looks great, use my name') as the characters (so long as their names aren't unusable like mine, I don't think Mousetrap the terrible' really works. So have a think about which marine you want to be!!!

 

Ummmm.....OK. That's fine with me. It'll only fill up about one squad's worth of names though. I still think you should use my idea for the names ;) .

 

I still haven't managed to download the BT codex but I have the link and definitely will do.

Um, download :D? As in torrents? That's kinda against the law and more than enough reason for Games Workshop to bring the lawyerhammer on you. It's best to just go get the actual book and pay a one time fee than go through all the joys of a civil case and end up paying hundreds of thousands of dollars or euros or whatever your local currency might be. Not to mention possible prison time .

 

.

I do have a question, I was going to give him a power fist and a two handed chain axe/lance (im modelling it at the minute with 2 chain swords on either end of a pole (each facing the opposite direction) is this going to be a problem for rules or doesn't it matter as he looks so darn cool I really don't care!)l

 

I'm pretty sure it's illegal under the rules, but if you don't care, I don't see a problem here.

[mousetrap]

Right, i finally get thr codex thing, but don't know which side to fall? what would you suggest?

though.

 

 

Regarding the macharian crusade, I checked the dates and it happened a lon time after the second founding which makes me think that using Chiros for a 3rd founding chapter is impossible so Quisto'rol it is.

 

I like the idea of the Chapter watching over the rift and making sure nothing bad gets out, it is in keeping with the noble knight stuff as from what i gather about this warp you need to be mentally tough to not trade in your bolter for a nice big hornacle!

 

I was using the following link to look for a planet. http://www.joachim-adomeit.de/wh40k/spacemap/map.html

 

Joura is is listed on it but only as an imperial world, nothing else?

 

QUOTE

"I think I see what you're going for here, but I'm not sure. How does that saying apply to the troops that result from the test? Why does this one planet get it's own personal Chapter? There's only 1,000 Chapters in the Imperium and over 1 million worlds. I don't see why this one planet wouldn't get a Guard regiment or something instead. Personally, I'd suggest sticking to the first idea."

 

Well if I made the planet a known blood angel recruitment world (is that possible?) or if thats not plausible a world where young blood angel recruits are taken and experimented on to try and remove their genetic flaw? They've still not managed it, infact its been accelerated. What do you reckon to that revision? or is it better to stick to idea 1?

 

Regarding the names I meant as the main chapter characters, the squads are a different kettle of fish.

 

Will buy BT codex today! The local currency is pound sterling actually!

 

Haven't made him a double ended chain sword lance, i've put a single power sword on a rod which basically extends the reach? so it could be used as a normal power sword in game I imagine. You'll see what i mean later!

 

Thanks again.

 

Al