MuGGzy Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 ok, not having the codex on hand please be patient of I make any major mistakes in thought process. My intent is to field a DH force with as many GKs as poss. But reading about their strengths and weaknesses I was thinking about using as many assasins and Death Cults as I could field legally. My intent would be for these killers to strike at things like dev/havok squads or other generally troublesome units that might otherwise be popping my LRs or dropping templates on my GK squads. Anyone have any input on this idea/tactic or use them like this? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
number6 Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Honestly, almost the only assassin worth considering anymore is the Callidus assassin. A Word In Your Ear is still quite valuable, and Polymorphine ensures that you can get at least one surprise round with her before she dies. The Eversor is really quite killy, but unless you sic him on small targets, it's still extremely likely he'll die after he hits his target. In fact, all of the assassins are relatively poor combatants. They were designed back in 3rd edition 40K, and with 5th edition 40K assaults being what they are (as in totally different!) ... well, they just don't survive. Yet they're still exceedingly expensive. AND 5th edition 40K uses True Line of Sight. Which means most terrain on your average 40K table won't block LoS to your assassins. This makes them easy pickings for the enemy. Especially easy if you're playing a low-model-count army like the DH. This makes Death Cultists particularly useless, as they are both the flimsiest of the assassins as well as the weakest combatants. I used the Callidus and the Eversor and multiple DCAs in many of my lists back in 4th edition 40K. But since the advent of 5th edition ... only the Callidus still gets any play, though much more limited than in the past. To be perfectly blunt, none of the assassins are really worth their points cost anymore. And the DH army is already quite hamstrung in its ability to field well-rounded, generally competitive armies. Diluting that even further with gimped assassins is not something you should consider. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2246283 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Fox Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 I'm a big supporter of DCA's, but I play a Witch Hunters army. This telling difference is as a whole, there aren't a lot of power weapon or melee units in the army save Assassins, Arcos, specific Inquisitor builds, or Penitent Engines. Sure Seraphim are handy in a fight, but they're better in a shoot out :devil: Grey Knights as a whole are a lot better in a scrap than most of the Sister's units. That being said, I've enjoyed my DCA's when I've used them in the modern edition, but that's because my base troops are IST's or Battle Sisters. The high initiative and power weapon attacks of the DCA's helps my army a lot, but if I personally were a Daemon Hunters player, I'd probably go for more termies to be honest for the same points cost. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2246315 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 The Eversor is really quite killy, but unless you sic him on small targets, it's still extremely likely he'll die after he hits his target. To be fair, he'll probably die before reaching any Targets. With the change to Area Terrain blocking LoS it's a lot harder to infiltrate him 12" away from his target, to allow him the first turn charge. And without it (and the inabilit to ride in *any* Transport all Assassins suffer from) he'll get shot. He's too jucy a Target to not get hit by a S8 ID weapon. The Assassins are all lack luster. Expensive, unable to Score/Contest, can't Assault into Terrain, no Trasport options, Special rules watered down. As Number6 mentions, the Cally remains the best of the bunch, but AWIYE comes with a very heafty price tag... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2246587 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garath Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 I am relatively new to DH,but they are my 5th army (after D.Eldar,Tyranidy,Space wolves,Orks) so here are my toughts- from THEIR point of view: ... Callidus.... Yes,she was designed for 3rd ed. Combat was a LOT different then. It was all about model placement and mass. Now it's about armour and inv saves. Word in your ear can really spoil a day... Say you see a devastator squad ,or a shooty unit of some kind. YOU get to move them 6"-so you get them all nicely packed toghether in BTB. Then on turn one you reveal her and fry their brains with her flamer...which gets funny as nobody gets any armour saves and then proceed to assault.That should cause enough damage for the points. And lets not forget that to take her one needs and inquisitor of some kind- say we take the cheaper option and give him a retinue with one gun servitor carrying a plasma cannon. :D Imagine striking that squad with no cover ,hitting ++++ loads of people under the template. And an Inquisitor gets to buy himself a Land raider...which will probably transport grey knights. There are other uses for her too.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2247008 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntgcleaner Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 The Callidus is by far my favorite, though as everyone knows, she dies almost all of the time after her first turn. Unfortunately, I have to correct Garath when saying "on turn one you reveal her". If you "reveal" her as her deep striking and not infiltrating (which would mean everyone knows where she is already), you can only start her out on turn two, and that's if you roll well. Which means that unit you moved 6" somewhere has a chance to reposition. The fun thing with aWiYE is to put jet packs or the sort into dangerous terrain, or if you have turn 1, turn their tank around and place it somewhere your Lascannons can hit their rear armor! That last example is one of my favorites when I play against Tau, if you're playing table edges and you are able to deploy well, Turn his hammerhead around for that nice rear armor shot from your LR's, hopefuly with 2-4 TL lascannon shots up the butt, you can easily (AT LEAST) get weapon destroyed. Bye-Bye rail gun! Then on Turn two, DS next to their Broadsides! Try to take those damn drones out with the Neural shredder then shred the suit up to pieces. Now your tanks can walk all over them! (Depending on what they bring of course!) --Also, you can buy a LR without needing an Inq, put 10 GK's in it and have some fun! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2247562 Share on other sites More sharing options...
a-nesuto Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 if you have turn 1, turn their tank around and place it somewhere your Lascannons can hit their rear armor! that would be great if it worked like that but, the opponent chooses the facing position for the Callidus word in your ear ability. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2247790 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 Unless it's the Apoc Datasheet. ;) And an Inquisitor gets to buy himself a Land raider...which will probably transport grey knights. Unfortunately, our Dedicated Transports remain Dedicated. And the Inquisitors LR has mystical Machine God Force Feilds over its access points that bar any Grey Knights (or Stormtroopers for that matter) from entering... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2247939 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntgcleaner Posted January 14, 2010 Share Posted January 14, 2010 aaah yeah, Thank you for the correction. I just read the 'dex and indeed it states "the owning player may choose the facing". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2247942 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justicar Valius Posted January 16, 2010 Share Posted January 16, 2010 No assasin is quite worth their points these day but boy is it fun to see stompas get smashed in their rear armour turn 1! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/189638-assasins-and-death-cults/#findComment-2250044 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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