Space Wolves

[Grimtooth]

The Great Companies are indeed specialized to their Wolf Lord's character. A Wolf Lord that that has served in the very same company since he was a Blood Claw and has trained exclusively for what his company is renowned. Are you trying to say that if Egil Iron Wolf was to be slain that his replacement would go against the lifetime of training he has received since he was a Blood Claw in regard to armored assaults and turn the company into a foot slogging scouting company?

 

Transformation into a wulfen is only the final, worse case scenario of the Canis Helix. Up until then, you have a Space Marine with even more heightened senses, faster reflexes, and a genetically coded resistance to Chaos then a normal Space Marine. Even those with the Mark of the Wulfen still fight among the ranks. Seems more like a intelligent design versus something like the fluke of Magnus. Speaking of Magnus, he was delivered by Chaos as an infant to a planet full of outcast psykers who helped him develop his latent psychic powers and surpass them. He took it upon himself to use his eye to gaze into the warp thus opening up his full psychic powers.

 

Again, the Blood Angels Red Thirst and Black Rage are a result of their geneseed being harvested from Sanguinous after he was killed by Horus. These were not genetically implanted by the Emperor in his initial creation of the Blood Angel legion. Yes they are a narrative tool, but in no way are related to the statement by Abnett and my subsequent gathering of information to support said statement.

 

Angron had neural implants put it into his brain by his captors on his homeworld of Desh'ea to increase his aggressiveness to make him more deadly in gladiatorial combat. When reunited with his legion, he ordered that his techmarines duplicate the technology and that all have the same implants installed (this included Khârn). No genetic predisposition to aggressiveness, just technological. Also, this was condemned by the Emperor and yet Angron continued to do it in secret.

[SamaNagol]

From rumours of the new BA dex it would seem there is a schism amongst the BA and successors as to whether the red thirst is in fact a flaw in the gene seed or a gift from their primarch.

[Night Runner]

Hi Brother Ramses, I just want to say first that I have enjoyed this conversation with you. It is good to see someone who is into the fluff like you are. Well I don't agree with all you have said and I would still like to contest some points with you again.

 

The Great Companies are indeed specialized to their Wolf Lord's character. A Wolf Lord that that has served in the very same company since he was a Blood Claw and has trained exclusively for what his company is renowned. Are you trying to say that if Egil Iron Wolf was to be slain that his replacement would go against the lifetime of training he has received since he was a Blood Claw in regard to armored assaults and turn the company into a foot slogging scouting company?

All I'm saying is that you should not use words like 'exclusively' which bind you unreasonable to your concepts. All companies are trained in all types of warfare for all scenarios, they are not trained exclusively for anything but they do excel in certain fields of war. So yes I'm saying it is possible. And just to point out something I'm sure you know - Space Wolves do not have a Scout company so this was a bad example on your part.

 

Transformation into a wulfen is only the final, worse case scenario of the Canis Helix. Up until then, you have a Space Marine with even more heightened senses, faster reflexes, and a genetically coded resistance to Chaos then a normal Space Marine. Even those with the Mark of the Wulfen still fight among the ranks. Seems more like a intelligent design versus something like the fluke of Magnus. Speaking of Magnus, he was delivered by Chaos as an infant to a planet full of outcast psykers who helped him develop his latent psychic powers and surpass them. He took it upon himself to use his eye to gaze into the warp thus opening up his full psychic powers.

It is true that Canis Helix offers heightened senses but the reflexes are the same as any other SM Chapter (maybe except for the Salamanders during 4th edition at least). There are exceptions like Ragnar Blackmane, but he – like Haegr and Ranulf – are not to be taken as a standard case. When the curse is in full sway and physical changes set in, then yes reflexes do sharpen up. As regards ' a genetically coded resistance to Chaos then a normal Space Marine' this is also a long shot. The SW codex says on pg13 that there is little that can corrupt the Space Wolves because they are self contented in living there dream as warriors, so there is not much to tempt them with. But this is not a genetical resistance but a cultural one. There have been cases of corruption unfortunately.

 

W.r.t Magnus the IA says that his Legion was predisposed to psychic mutancy due to his genetical heritage, just like the Wolves were with the Canis Helix. No where does it say that his powers were a fluke. Mutancy is not necessarily reminiscent of accident if there is design. Remember the Primarchs were modeled with genetical material from the Emperor himself and he is the greatest of Human psykers.

 

Again, the Blood Angels Red Thirst and Black Rage are a result of their geneseed being harvested from Sanguinous after he was killed by Horus. These were not genetically implanted by the Emperor in his initial creation of the Blood Angel legion. Yes they are a narrative tool, but in no way are related to the statement by Abnett and my subsequent gathering of information to support said statement.

 

Angron had neural implants put it into his brain by his captors on his homeworld of Desh'ea to increase his aggressiveness to make him more deadly in gladiatorial combat. When reunited with his legion, he ordered that his techmarines duplicate the technology and that all have the same implants installed (this included Khârn). No genetic predisposition to aggressiveness, just technological. Also, this was condemned by the Emperor and yet Angron continued to do it in secret.

Leman with his Canis Helix is found on a planet with giant wolves, Magnus with psychic powers is found on a planet of psykers – the savage Angron is found where if not on a planet where gladiatorial combat is a sport and the examples go on. These are all narrative tools to accentuate their nature. Savagry was predisposed in Angron and his marines were suited to frontal assaults before Angron was reunited with his Legion. The IA tells that when he was found he had barely survived an attack by Eldar (probably) and his wounds were all to the front. Sure signs of his aggressive nature. So we have to agree that we disagree on this point.

 

Cheers and thanks for the interesting conversation.

[Grimtooth]

It is nice to chat with you Nightrunner. Kinda busy right now, but will post up this real quick.

 

While there is no actual 10th Co full of scouts in the Space Wolves, you do have Erik Morkai's Great Company that is comprised mostly of scouts and known for their stealth missions. So another Great Company that specializes in a certain type of warfare and is then built of units specialized to conduct that warfare.

 

Will be back later for the other stuff.

[WolfLordKejl]

I read through the posts and everyone has their own take on stories and such. (all fun and interesting to read). However..I too have to agree and defend Abnett a bit.

 

I think what Abnett was saying was: They aren't engineered better or bigger. He states they are cunning, ruthless, particularly dangerous. This all tends to show they have a particular fighting style and train of thought. They are relentless. They can and will hunt their prey down til it falls and can take no more.

 

They are barbaric and have no remorse for an enemy. Granted...all space marines are this way to a point. Perhaps just a bit more civilized in some respects.

 

Now..what I said wont change anyone's point of view..but..I had two pennies..ya know.

 

See you all on the field.

 

Wolf Lord Kejl