Alpha Legion

[LordGates]

I just think it was a pointless twist thrown in there for just that purpose, a twist. It added no extra depth to the story for me, and in all honesty, it took away from it. I actually will only read Legion again because I am writing my own story, and want to see how they were established in that book to get a better idea on how to establish them for myself. Otherwise, I would never have picked up the book again.

Now, I can easily see another HH Alpha Legion book coming out by Abnett that will have some weird, dark twist about how the Alpha Legion were meant to be a tool of chaos and discord, and the dark gods split the psychic might and personality of the one Primarch into two for that very reason. And then I will eat my words. But as is? I just think it takes away from the AL and their fluff.

[Brother Aristeo]

Omegon, perhaps the most underdeveloped plot device ever created. I was honestly more interested in Omegon because of Effrit Stealth Squad and his infiltrator armour than him being a twin. I can't say I hate it though. I thought it was pretty cool, it just didn't make any sense. Why in the world would the source of the Alpha Legion's secrecy lie in its Primarch's secret twin?

[LordGates]

I guess. I still dislike the idea, but I like your reasoning.

Incidentally, I like your avatar. Tool makes me :D

You cannot judge my avatar, because I change it around at random. I change it based off of what banner I think looks most awesome at the time ha. I have not played a game with the new chaos codex, and probably wont for quite some time. But, I love chaos in all of its myriad of forms, so I keep up with this forum and I own the new book. I do have an army I assembling too, I just have not been active for a bit, game wise.

 

 

But yeah, the whole point to this thread was to get people's take on the Alpha Legion. They are my favorite chaos legion, and I want to see more justice done to them, hence my story. I need some good books on guerrilla warfare and infiltration techniques though. And I need to learn a bit about hypnotic triggers and etc. But all in all, it should be entertaining.

[Brother Aristeo]

Your banners are pretty cool. I like the World Eaters, in fact I'm making a small warband to add to my Alpha Legion army. Tool is awesome (of course), but I chose that avatar because I couldn't find an Alpha Legion avatar that I liked and this one seemed to fit for some reason.

 

Well, it seems as if your interests in the Alpha Legion are well founded. They are somewhat underappreciated, so it's nice that you want to give them the attention they deserve. Your project sounds ambitious, but at least you want to do some proper research first. Keep us posted on this. Hydra Dominatus.

[Walter Payton]

I like Candleshoes's ideas, personally:

 

I'll throw up a post I did a few years ago telling my side of the story, replying to the intelligence of the Alpha Legion. *Spoiler*.

 

“It became clear to us that the oldest and youngest sons were the most significant of all. Horus for what he will do, and you for what you will undo.”

 

 

Legion lied to you all.

 

Legion hid what it truly was, what it truly meant to tell you right in front of your hooded eyes, and yet all of you accepted what you read, accepted the lie you were meant to read I might add. The truth was just that, simple, plain, and hidden so perfectly in what you read, when you finish reading this, you’ll scratch your head and think “…. hmm… this makes sense….”.

 

Confused yet? Let me explain simply now.

 

It is often looked at that within the novel Legion, there are only 2 truth holders, that is to say, 2 bodies in which the audience can look to for unquestioned honesty without fault. 2 bodies that in a book of Lies and Deceit, are the only way for us to gauge what is real and what is not. These bodies are Dinas Chayne, and the Cabal itself. Chayne is ruled by unchangeable values where to lie is as alien as being able to sprout wings. To him, lies are a waste of time and have no value whatsoever for good or for ill. He is essentially un-corruptable. The Cabal, the actual council (not Grammaticus) is truthful in the sense that lying to humans, is a step towards giving them the benefit of equality on a galactic level… and since the Cabal despises the simplicity of man, they must be dealt with in a brutal, honest fashion. Lies are meant to deceive equals, and they certainly wouldn’t even speak to men unless it was to say something of worth. Plus, Abnett himself has on several occasions made it known to readers that these 2 character groups were the bearers of truth in his novel, it really isn’t rocket science for us to put 2 and 2 together.

 

Now, take the information overload that is Legion into your head, and see it from the eyes of those 2 sources alone.

 

You’ll find this: Dinas Chayne openly states that the Alpha Legion lie with every breath they speak to the human compliance force (and implies anyone outside the legion itself) and he is the only one to independently identify and discover Grammaticus, something nobody could do.

 

The Cabal give us the most important information. Understand that if you accept that the cabal is a truth holder, YOU MUST believe everything they say, not just the bits and pieces that make sense to you. You don’t get to pick and choose.

 

They give us the idea of an impending civil war that will allow chaos to enter real space and devour humanity. They also tell us that they have tried “recruiting” or talking to other legions over centuries (but due to flaws in the other legions, none could be successful in the undertaking) before Legion even takes place. Understand that a detail like this means that their outcome is truthful, but the players and the path are changeable. They tell you this, which means, when they offer the 2 outcomes of the Horus Heresy, and ask the Alpha Legion to choose their place, there is choice involved. The choice to make the path of the events your own, but end up in the one of the outcomes, it doesn’t have to be cut and dried.

 

The choice was:

 

1) Horus wins, in his self loathing he immolates man and extinguishes it as a vessel for chaos. The galaxy is allowed to live due to humanity’s sacrifice.

 

2) The Emperor wins, is placed within the golden throne and bring Horus down with him, stagnation occurs and the worlds are torn by war for thousands of years, allowing chaos to slowly triumph

 

The acuity followed this, and the future played out for them, they lived a lifetime in an instant.

 

You ALL think Alpharius/Omegon chose option 1, SOULY based on the principal that the Alpha Legion fought on Horus’ side. You are wrong.

 

The Primarchs never answered out loud.

 

The Primarchs chose the 2nd option. They chose against the prolonged life of the Xenos of the galaxy and chose the continual struggle against evil, even in the face of certain defeat. You Heard Me. The Alpha Legion chose the 2nd option. This is why.

 

What future does warhammer pan out to? Where did the Alpha Legion’s loyalty really lie? What makes up their very being? Control, loyalty to their own, intelligence, and above all, cunning.

 

Legion takes place 2 years before the Heresy, when The Emperor Himself still led the crusade. They are given this choice just after the triumph at Ullanor. The Alpha legion prepare to set up the biggest Con that the galaxy has ever known, the Death of Horus. It is something that only they have the ability, patience, inner loyalty, and scope to achieve.

 

“It became clear to us that the oldest and youngest sons were the most significant of all. Horus for what he will do, and you for what you will undo.”

 

When the Cabal mentions this, it isn’t to be taken lightly. It is here that the Primarchs decide to Kill Horus. Or rather, to bring about the death of Horus. They knew that fighting on the side of the emperor, among his battle lines in pitched conflict with the Traitors would yield only death. If they fought for Horus, against their own brothers, only then could they secure the loyalty of the Warmaster, to be put in a position to do him the most harm, to take advantage in the hour of need when all hope was lost, and at the most opportune time.

 

They fought for the emperor, they would provide the emperor with the chance to lay Horus low and to end the conflict once and for all, even if it meant putting on a new face and sacrificing much to yield the greatest result. Such challenges and controlled deceit could only be handled by one legion.

 

To fight for the emperor, they fought for Horus, they turned on their brothers, and they bided their time. They waited, they planned, and they preformed well.

 

If any of you cannon guys out there know, to read all the editions rule books, army books, and fluff articles… is a lot to handle… and surprisingly enough, the articles tend to differ on the specifics, especially when seen from different accounts, both loyalist and traitor. Here is where you become a historian in a way, and decide for yourself the best course of interpretation on controversial material. To say that everything that was written about the Siege of Terra is presented in the same voice, demeanour, and outlook is foolish. It is a myth, there to be interpreted by us. This is my interpretation on over 2 decades worth of material.

 

Their moment came during the worst point of the Siege of Terra. With broken walls, and enclosing Traitors, the siege was in its last hour. We know that Horus’ ship lowered its shields. This is a fact, but as to why it was lowered is up to incredible debate. Some say he did it out of an emotional purpose, as a last chance, as a mock, you may look at it in any way, for this is one of the pivotal moments in the Heresy that is openly up to us to wonder about. To me, Horus doesn’t seem to show any remorse, regret or emotion until the moment he is about to strike down the Emperor. This is the first time, and because of that, it wasn’t him who lowered his shields… it was the Alpha Legion. They are responsible for betraying Horus, lowering his shield, and giving Man, the Imperium, and the Emperor the only way to Victory. They gave up Horus.

 

The only ones who could get close enough to the Warmaster, through personal means, or by agents, by operatives working the Con since before the Heresy even started. They planned it all. They had will, the means, the motive and the TIME to do something that you may say would be impossible. They waited YEARS for that moment, and they would have done nothing to screw it up.

 

They chose Option 2, they chose the Emperor, they chose to fight for the Utopian ideal still, and did it knowing that it would one day die out, but it was them that were in control of how it was to come about, and they would go down fighting. “The Alpha Legion is perfectly placed to control and direct it.”

 

And so it was, they chose loyalty by sacrifice, and gave humanity new life, even for a short while.

 

As for their own loyalties after the death of Horus and their complete inability to come back to the Imperium as protectors (Not by want to regain their old lives, but to uphold their great deed. “The greatest trick the Devil ever played was to make man believe he didn’t exist.”) no one will ever know what their true intentions are now.

 

As for Utopian ideals, yes, the Alpha Legion never believed in the ability to achieve an end goal they knew was impossible, but that doesn’t mean they couldn’t have still fought and struggled against it (much as they do when the book tells their story). It is all they could do, and it is what they were made to do. Pech and Thias tell you this. The choice I have surmised also follows this mindset, as they make their decision to uphold the Emperor’s work by continuing the un winnable fight against chaos. Their choice alone gives them control, and they never had anything against fighting for what the Emperor stood for, even if they thought it was un-achievable. They knew the bigger picture, and their choice reflected it, even if you don’t seem to agree with their sense of victory, as it was an internal victory as well as a death sentence.

 

“It was now at the very moment of his triumph that Horus made his one and only mistake. No one can say for sure why he did it, but Horus lowered the defence shields on his barge as this last cataclysmic battle begun. It was surmised that without the shields he was able to better witness the forthcoming destruction of the Emperor and His Imperium.”

 

In the pages you will see that Horus was more than capable of killing the Emperor and Final defenders without ever stepping foot on earth. He knew his gamble had succeeded not failed, because they were about to kill the only being in the Galaxy that Man could rally behind. The seige was to be won and broken in the hours this had happened, with more time than the hounding Loyalist reinforcements could make it there to matter.

 

Why did he do it full knowing the implications? Knowing he had victory in his grasp? There in lies the very likely chance that it wasn’t his choice, and that something outside his realm of control happened to turn off his shields in Horus’ hour of victory.

 

With full knowledge of what was going to happen, the Alpha legion was more than capable of setting up a network of spies, agents, and operatives within Horus’ fleet ever before Horus had his visions. The bulk of the Alpha Legion was elsewhere, but it is more than plausible to have dozens of operatives within the crew of Horus’ own ship, let alone their own representatives from their Marines, acting as liasons between the main Traitor force. The possibilities are endless, as again, they had the TIME to plant and insert and set up whatever they needed to succeed. Logistically it is sound.

 

 

They fought and chose to fight for the emperor. One of the 2 choices made by the cabal. Every prediction that followed, the death of Horus, the end of the physical emperor, the stagnation of the imperium, and the years of warfare all have come true. It makes perfect sense,.

 

This means 2 things (to mirror yours)

1) the cabal was right about their visions, as the choice and outcome match what is given.

2) the cabal told the truth

 

As for what you put stock in, the author told you that the givers of the acuity aren’t lying, and the result of the acuity is our current 40K universe.

 

There is no third choice, it is all in front of your eyes.

[Hellios]

How do we know that Horus or The Emperor won... maybe it was a third option... that is the problem it is all made-up and the answer could be anything, which I like ;)

[Walter Payton]

How do we know that Horus or The Emperor won... maybe it was a third option... that is the problem it is all made-up and the answer could be anything, which I like :D

 

Personally I love the idea of Horus getting to the shield console to put them back on and finding Alpharius yelling 'secrets and lies' before dissappearing.

[Hellios]

How do we know that Horus or The Emperor won... maybe it was a third option... that is the problem it is all made-up and the answer could be anything, which I like :D

 

Personally I love the idea of Horus getting to the shield console to put them back on and finding Alpharius yelling 'secrets and lies' before dissappearing.

 

Except it happened something like this...

 

Ensign: Sir, shields are down!

Horus: Trooper A go to the generator to find out what is wrong!

Trooper A: Yes Sir! *wanders away*

 

Trooper B: What are you doing here?

Trooper A: I've come to look at the shield console.

Trooper B: This isn't the console you're looking for, it's down the corridor to the left.

Trooper A: Oh thanks.

 

Trooper A: Is this the shield generator console?

Bob the janitor: "Secrets and Lies!" *disguises self as a bush and disappears*

Trooper A: DAMNIT! someone put metal in the microwave and knocked the shield generator out!

 

Trooper A: *back on the bridge* Yer so someone put metal in the microwave and knocked out the shields!

Horus: DAMNIT can't anyone read these days >.<

Sangunius: Oh hai!

Horus: *facepalm*

[Lord Kallozar]

Hmmmm... I have to admit this topic has got me very intrigued about the Alpha Legion. I started a topic not long ago about Alpha Legions worship towards Chaos but that was purely out of curiosity, but now after reading this its kninda getting me hooked on the XX Legion! Im starting to love the whole secrecy and mystery about them!

 

Ive not read the novel "Legion" (though i think im gonna get it very soon) but what do u guys think on the thoery that Alpharius might have suffered some form of schizophrenia which brought about the persona of Omegon? This could explain why nobody (not even the False Emperor) knew of Omegon.

 

As Alpharius was the last Primarch to be found, meaning he had the greatest amount of time away from Imperial sway, the Dark Gods may have reached out to him and created his schizophrenic state, making Omegon a creation of Chaos which was used to influence Alpharius' decisions on all things yet staying hidden.

 

Its just a long shot theory but heh this is the Alpha Legion we are talking about here, anythings possible right?

[Legatus]

I still think Dan Abnett had simply watched "The Prestige" before he started working on "Legion". ;)

[Piousservant]

I'll try to make this short. If you don't agree, then just ignore it. There may be some spoilers ahead.

 

At the beginning of Legion, there was a quote by Alpharius: "War is simply the galaxy's hygiene." This is a variation of "survival of the fittest" applied to the galaxy, where the constant state of warfare culls the weak and breeds strong races. Alpharius saw this as an immutable law of the universe, and for this reason he disagreed with the Emperor and his Utopian ideal for the galaxy. Alpharius and his legion were known for their pragmatism and unconventional methods of thinking and warfare, and that defines the Alpha Legion. You have to apply this knowledge when considering what drives Alpharius and his legion, and what choices they would make when the Heresy came to pass.

 

Here's the part I think most will disagree with, but the Cabal was not lying to Alpharius Omegon. The Acuity was not a trick or some kind of device to turn them to Chaos. The Acuity was 100% accurate. What they were shown DOES come to pass. Read it over again carefully if you don't believe me. The Cabal TOLD Alpharius Omegon that if Horus won, Chaos would consume humanity and burn itself out - this was not part of the Acuity. They wanted the Alpha Legion to sacrifice humanity to spare the galaxy. The alternative was a slow stagnation, of Chaos slowly but surely destroying the galaxy in a perpetual war as seen in the Acuity. This is the 41st millennium as we all know it.

 

So Alpharius Omegon had a choice. The twin primarchs looked at each other and said they knew what had to be done. They give the Cabal the idea that they'll go along with the plan to help Horus win because the Emperor would want Chaos defeated, but THEY'RE LYING. How do I know? Well we all know that Horus loses, that's the biggest tell. Also, they don't agree with the Emperor's plan for a galactic Utopia, so why would they care if the Emperor would want chaos destroyed to avoid untold millennia of warfare? Remember, "War is simply the galaxy's hygiene." Why kill off the entire human race so a bunch of aliens can have a free ride? That's not very pragmatic when it comes to the survival of your species.

 

So, to sum this up and get back to the topic at hand, here's what I think the Alpha Legion are up to. Alpharius Omegon knew what had to be done: they had to ensure the survival of the human race. Chaos could not be destroyed without destroying humanity in the process, making it a necessary evil. Chaos needed humanity, and humanity needed Chaos. It's that simple. So the part the Alpha Legion played during the Heresy and ever since is to play each side against the other. Their secret machinations that seem to make no sense are all centered around perpetuating an eternal war where neither Chaos nor the Imperium can win, all to ensure the survival of the human race.

 

Loyal or Traitor? I guess the answer is both. Loyal to humanity and themselves, but embracing Chaos as a necessary component of human survival. Complicated yet simple, and very pragmatic.

 

 

Fantastic description! That's exactly how I figured it in my head, but you've expressed it far better than I could. I hope that if GW ever expand on this background (and in some ways, I hope they don't) that this is the angle they take. It doesn't make any sense for them to sacrifice all of humanity to save all the xenos races from chaos. Why on earth would Alpharius want to do that?

 

 

On the twins - I love the concept, actually. I just think the execution was just underdeveloped. I also suspect the Emperor would know. Alpharius Omegon might think the Emperor doesn't know but that's different. ;)

[nurgling6688]

so i have a question. Since the Alpha Legion operates outside of the eye of terror, in real space, and in real time, not warp time, do they recruit alot? I mean the only reason the other traitor legions are still around is because for them it has only been 1,000 years tops, for some its been decades. But since the Alpha legion dont live in the warp id assume that there are none of the original marines left from the heresy except for maybe their primarch. So they must recruit right? like a normal space marine chapter?

[Legatus]

An "in universe" text in the Index Astartes Alpha Legion is asking the very same question. Since they do not operate from within the Eye of Terror they are not under its unnatural lifespan increasing effect, so it is supposed that they do recruit in some way. It is left standing as a question though, and not answered in that article. That text is also further proof that Space Marines are not immortal (as if there was any more proof needed...).

[Clewz]

Well if salamander is anything to go by astartes can live 10,000 years

[the jeske]

An "in universe" text in the Index Astartes Alpha Legion is asking the very same question. Since they do not operate from within the Eye of Terror they are not under its unnatural lifespan increasing effect, so it is supposed that they do recruit in some way. It is left standing as a question though, and not answered in that article. That text is also further proof that Space Marines are not immortal (as if there was any more proof needed...).

 

 

well the new ones arent . the old pre heresy era ones were very different . compering to the sm that are made now , they were much better, I mean they had the tech to turn adults in to sm [even salamaders and sw dont go further then late teen nowdays].

Dante is 1k + years old and it doesnt look like he is going to die of old age .

[Hellios]

so i have a question. Since the Alpha Legion operates outside of the eye of terror, in real space, and in real time, not warp time, do they recruit alot? I mean the only reason the other traitor legions are still around is because for them it has only been 1,000 years tops, for some its been decades. But since the Alpha legion dont live in the warp id assume that there are none of the original marines left from the heresy except for maybe their primarch. So they must recruit right? like a normal space marine chapter?

 

Arkos the faithless was around during the time of the Heresey and seems to be alive and kicking. I'm not saying he has lived outside of the warp (who knows), I'm just saying he is old :devil:. However they do "recruit" in the background it has them hypnotising I think the population of a planet where a space marine chapter recruited and over time more and more of these people got inducted as space marines and then they flipped a switch and these space marines killed the other space marines... and I guess they might have been inducted into the Alpha Legion... but who knows... It wouldn't be surprising but AL are a but mysterious.

[Walter Payton]

An "in universe" text in the Index Astartes Alpha Legion is asking the very same question. Since they do not operate from within the Eye of Terror they are not under its unnatural lifespan increasing effect, so it is supposed that they do recruit in some way. It is left standing as a question though, and not answered in that article. That text is also further proof that Space Marines are not immortal (as if there was any more proof needed...).

 

 

well the new ones arent . the old pre heresy era ones were very different . compering to the sm that are made now , they were much better, I mean they had the tech to turn adults in to sm [even salamaders and sw dont go further then late teen nowdays].

Dante is 1k + years old and it doesnt look like he is going to die of old age .

 

The geneseed can still work on adults-I would say that the chances of sucess are so low, however, once you pass 17-19 or so, that it is better not to try. And Dante is a poor example, as the BA are famously long-lived.

[LordGates]

I thought it was pretty cut and dry that Alpharius chose to side with Horus in order to actually fight for the Emperor.

That is what I got out of it.

And though I like the idea of Omegon being some schizophrenic twin, I am almost certain it describes Omegon physically apart from Alpharius in the book.

 

I was more curious about the NOW aspect of Alpha Legion. 10,000 years later, are we still good or bad? I am willing to bet it is fractured at this point. I mean, they destroyed an entire chapter of space marines, and I think they even have one or two Daemon Princes running around.

But all of this fluff is pre-Legion.

[Rain]

I thought it was pretty cut and dry that Alpharius chose to side with Horus in order to actually fight for the Emperor.

That is what I got out of it.

And though I like the idea of Omegon being some schizophrenic twin, I am almost certain it describes Omegon physically apart from Alpharius in the book.

 

The first rule of Alpha Legion: You do not talk about Alpha Legion

The second rule of Alpha Legion: You do not talk about Alpha Legion

 

Seriously though, they better not explicate the loyalty of the Alphas completely, it's shady state is one of the few "mysteries" left in 40k that are actually interesting. As for Arkos, pretty sure he was stated as having resided in the Eye of Terror, and he was even possessed by a daemon at one point, though he managed to retain his individuality. That said, the character was created before Legion was written so who knows how it works now. Oh and at the end of the Siege of Vraks Arkos was captured by the Angels of Absolution and hauled off to the rock for interrogation but we will almost certainly never learn his final fate.

[Lord Adras]

I thought it was pretty cut and dry that Alpharius chose to side with Horus in order to actually fight for the Emperor.

That is what I got out of it.

And though I like the idea of Omegon being some schizophrenic twin, I am almost certain it describes Omegon physically apart from Alpharius in the book.

 

The first rule of Alpha Legion: You do not talk about Alpha Legion

The second rule of Alpha Legion: You do not talk about Alpha Legion

 

Seriously though, they better not explicate the loyalty of the Alphas completely, it's shady state is one of the few "mysteries" left in 40k that are actually interesting. As for Arkos, pretty sure he was stated as having resided in the Eye of Terror, and he was even possessed by a daemon at one point, though he managed to retain his individuality. That said, the character was created before Legion was written so who knows how it works now. Oh and at the end of the Siege of Vraks Arkos was captured by the Angels of Absolution and hauled off to the rock for interrogation but we will almost certainly never learn his final fate.

 

 

The Angels of Absolution are Alpha Legion

 

[Dark Mechanicum]

When Fight Club meets with 40k, you get Alpha Legion.

[Rain]

The Angels of Absolution are Alpha Legion

 

Uhh are you sure or are you just guessing? I mean it's possible but I don't think it's even hinted at, and he killed quite a few of them before being captured including a captain if I remember correctly. It does say that no word of him reaching the rock even got to the Inquisition, but that could just as easily be because the Dark Angels don't care for others poking their nose into their business.

[LordGates]

He was joking.

The Angels of Absolution are a DA offshoot. They are pretty much dedicated to hunting the fallen.

[Lord Adras]

The Angels of Absolution are Alpha Legion

 

Uhh are you sure or are you just guessing? I mean it's possible but I don't think it's even hinted at, and he killed quite a few of them before being captured including a captain if I remember correctly. It does say that no word of him reaching the rock even got to the Inquisition, but that could just as easily be because the Dark Angels don't care for others poking their nose into their business.

 

It's an "everyone is Alpha Legion" joke.

[Legatus]

Sorry for the off topic, but I have seen the "10,000 year old Salamander" argument being raised before, and now I had the chance to browse through that book and see what that is all about.

 

Well if salamander is anything to go by astartes can live 10,000 years

Disregarding for a moment that it is a Black Library novel and the reply would therefor by default be "it isn't", it turns out there may have been warp storms involved. And as everyone knows warp storms mess with time and space consistency. I think it was not so much the ship of the Salamander in question that got stuck in the warp as that there were warp storms all around the world his ship crash landed on 10,000 years ago. He himself mentions that "there was a storm" when the other Marines ask him how he ended up there.

The others seem to be perplexed that there is a Marine that might have liverd that long, and when he is approached by one of the Apothecaries in the end, the following phrase is uttered: "By the laws of nature, the ancient Salamander should not still be alive."

 

In conclusion, I would not consider that a challenge to the repeatedly in the background refered to limited lifespan of Space Marines of a few hundred years.