New Guy asks: Where's the Love for CSM?

[servitob]

Hi Folks,

 

New here, so please be gentle!

 

So currently I play loyalist marines for fun and have done since the latest 40k release. I'm just thinking of broadening my horizons a bit and wondering whether turning traitor is worth it nowadays, because the CSM models are just so much better looking!

 

Most of the time I play against 1500 point zerg horde armies and so I ALWAYS end up in mass close combat. I nearly fainted when I read CSM troop choices can operate in hordes of 20, and they carry a close combat weapon. When I read that you can increase their toughness by 1 and be lead by a big monster daemon I was virtually crying out for the favours of the dark gods! But still, I potentially would lose a lot of tactical squad heavy weapons, my loyalty and 'they shall know no fear' rule which could be a bit of a kick in the renegade nuts.

 

To get to the point, after reading the forums it seems that in a lot of posts CSM players are disgruntled with the codex. Are they really that broken? Do they compare at all to the more 'up to date' army lists? Are they competitive against horde armies?

 

So people... To summarise... Why do you play CSM?

[the jeske]

Why do you play CSM

there is no other way of playing an undivided legion anymore.

[Chaos Lord Shamrockius]

For me, I play/collect them through habit!

 

The latest codex isn't great, very varied or very in keeping with our previous background but it has it's bonuses, and close combat is one of them. Only a few battles in to playing with this codex, I can safely say that I feel the best way to sum us up right now is a power armoured horde army with a variety of special weapons and some good heavy support options to boot. Mobility is key, followed by good use of icons and the right attitude of "no model, however unique or proud you are of it (daemon princes, lords or dreads especially), it is not too precious to die" (learned the hard way due to my 200pt Termie Sorcerer I poured my heart into painting gets shot to bits in turn 2 after doing nothing while my hated toaster-dread picked off tank after tank after tank).

 

I also collect for the variety of options when converting. Every model can be unique, everything is a part of some tank/dread/champ/Lord/DP if you look at it the right way. The chaos conversion options are huge. As you may have gathered, I loathe our Dread in the same way that I could never live with my mother again, but then you look at the loyalist options in the basic and iron clad and your mind warbles with opportunity as to how you can take that poor, unenlightened waste of imperial plastic, wave it in front of the cabal of gods and bring it to life in a whole new demented way. I fell foul of walking past a full shelf of said loyalist dread again today and, well, after blowing my budget, I am now covered in glue and have a mind full of ideas. Shall Tzeench taint this poor sap? Shall he lay down heavy cover fire for my Alpha Legion or Night Lords while the troops flush in to a close combat frenzy? How would it like to carry every banner of the dark gods en masse in the name of Lorgar's men? Or would it like to show it's kinky, feminine side or maybe be covered in pestilence and decay of either Slaanesh or Nurgle.

 

May the dark gods bless my mind tonight as I sleep to make the right choice on yet another "myterious" arrival to my daemonette who no doubt will question where this new addition came from while a claw is neatly placed.

 

And also, i always remember that our codex may suck right now but it hasn't always been this way and will not always be this way. Tzeench has a reason for it all...

[templarboy]

I play CSM because the world does not need one more darn Ultrasmurfs army. I have played eldar (2nd and third ed.), Loyalist (I mean scum) and even squats. I like the chaos stuff better. I think of it this way-while painting and assembling, I spend way more time than actually playing. I'm gonna collect and paint something that is cool to me. Now if the oblit models didn't suck sooo darn bad........

[ntgcleaner]

I don't know much about CSM yet because I just started, but I was attracted to them for their CC skills. Especially the Berzerkers having a ton of attacks and fielding up to 20 of them is pretty amazing. 41 attacks right off the bat (With a skull champion) and the numbers go up from there. I especially liked the maneuverability of the raptors with ~36 attacks with the right squad makeup (I made a post about it earlier).

 

I started with Daemonhunters and they are beasts in HtH IMO but they have very little numbers and it's hard to get to the right place with them. So, I wanted to switch it up and I wanted to try CSM. I like their numbers and price per unit and the cool special units they have.

[LorgarXVII17]

If your a loyalist now, its no time to turn traitor. I dont much care for the current codex, and dont see any updates within this year or the next. I could go into detail, but dont get me started. I can honestly say this current codex has been rather kind to me, letting me win many battles against eldar, nids and orks. I just dont like how its organized...

 

The Emperors grace is worth more than the Chaos gods right now.

[Magnus Thane]

The CSM codex hate is overrated. It's far from perfect but it's still a fun codex to play 'in it's own right'. If you never played the previous one, it doesn't matter that much.

And the models are really fun and cool. Give them a try, CSM's were my first army and are still my favourite WH40K 'faction'. It's an excellent elite (3+ armor) melee army which can perform reasonably well across the board but shines by far best by being assaulty. Rhino's, LR's, Oblits, CSM's and Deathguard being usually the bread and butter of most CSM lists.

[DrDoom]

Brother if you're looking for CSM codex love you came to the wrong forum....

 

Been playing Chaos since 2nd Edition, they've always been my favorite army. I like fallen good guys and I think the models are bad ass. I know some people don't like the current codex but its not the worst one we've ever had.

[IronWinds]

So people... To summarise... Why do you play CSM?

 

You answer to no one.... unless you want to. No emperor... no inquisition... no high lords... no one telling you what to do. Even if you play a Legion, your demon primarch gifts you with a planet to call home and only asks that on the rare occasion he decides to go do something that you follow. And even then you can rebel if you want.

 

Your army is an army of super killing monsters of death that do whatever they want, whenever they want, wherever they want. You never have to justify attacking someone... you don't have allies... just people with the same goals as you that you'll turn on later.

 

The power armor, terminators, obliterators, and demon princes are just the cherry on top. Chaos is the cake, and anarchy is the icing.

[The_Crippster]

I play chaos because it's the only true answer.

[JamesI]

I play chaos because I had a ton of marines and didn't want two loyal marine armies.

[saintevil]

First reason for playing chaos is defilers! OMG! I love my defiler to bits! Then i have to glue it back together again. Second is killing smurfs! I hated smurfs all my life and wil not rest until all are in a pot and simmering over a low heat. Even papa smurf! SM are lile monks. Boring and set in their ways. You can always predict what they are going to say. Chaos on the other hand are like armoured metallica fans at a pop concert! Chop! SPLAT! That is why i play chaos and loving it. Even with our so called KAK dex.

[servitob]

Chaos on the other hand are like armoured metallica fans at a pop concert!

 

Cheers for all your input and help people, it is much appreciated!

[infyrana]

Death Guard Plague Marines have always interested me, as has the odd model like Typhus, the latest Daemon Prince and all the ForgeWorld DG stuff. They just ticked all the right boxes.. and when I finally dug through an old White Dwarf and started reading all the basic fluff I could about them, I was sold and had to buy an army to collect :blink:

[chaplain belisarius]

Excellent troops choice-bolter, bolt pistol AND close combat weapon! Take ten men, take 2 meltaguns and give your aspiring champion a powerfist (plus a combi/melta if points allow!), stick them in a rhino and watch the carnage!

 

Marines shoot...chaos shoots and then hacks apart the few survivors!

[Corpse.]

I play CSM because I've always played CSM. They are flexible more on the melee side then the firepower side. But that won't stop a shooty chaos marine army outshoot loyalists because of specialist troops. It's just more restrictive firepower (and shorter ranged) then loyalists got.

 

For troops, aside from bikes, chaos has it much better. The other choices are a little under par compared to loyalists, so be ready to expect that change over.

[Mr. Sandbot]

I used to be a SM player, but after a few games I really didn't like the troop choices or HQ choices the SM dex had to offer. So I scoured around and looked for a Troop choice I actually enjoyed seeing on a board and playing with. I ended up with the Rubrics. Their back story just made the unit itself all the sweeter.

After I played a little with my Rubrics, I started to appreciate the flexibility in your average CSM squad, not just in game, but modelling too (you can make chaos wolves, dark angels etc). As a result, I started to have even more fun just creating monstrosities to the Emperor out of my former loyalist bits. Making monsters is a great creative outlet.

But yeah, if you decide to turn traitor then you can start decorating your marines with chaos bits to save money too. :)

[Yogi]

The old chaos Codex was a Ferrari. The current one is like I dunno a Nissan Z.

 

So if you don't remember the Ferrari you have nothing to lose.

[noatalba]

Chaos lost what the orks lost...individuality. Way back in the beginning CSM had a million options, you could custom make Daemon weapons, mutations were randomized, and every so often in the middle of a battle your 300 point lord would ascend into princehood and disappear form your list or become a gibbering spawn and be relagated to a mindless killing machine.

 

The new list is nice, streamline, and missing the randomness. But, the most important thing is that this list is so much cheaper then any of the old lists...15 points a marine is great.'

[ShotgunFacelift]

I play chaos for the fluffl and modeling freedom that comes with it.

The codex has its limitations and is getting marginalized by the newer dexs (ex. Space Wolfs and Nids) but you can still field some realy neat armies.

[snapplekid50]

I play chaos as nothing else does it for me

It is my first army and has been my favorite army

Plus saying "death to the false emperor" is just too cool to pass up

[Rain]

Honestly most current Chaos players are probably people left over from years ago who have more or less always played Chaos. In the years between 2002 and 2007 Chaos had probably the most interesting codex of any faction and combined with good fluff made for a very popular army. Then that was all "streamlined". Some switched factions, others (like myself) eventually more or less stopped playing, while others kept playing with the armies they had. In other words, the only reason you would switch to chaos now would be to either A.) powergame with the usual lash/PM list or B.) pure fluff, not that any of that will show up in your list.

[DaanofWar]

I just started out with the CSM's, but I'll throw in my reasons along with the rest as I did recently spend a lot of time deciding over a new army.

 

- Originality. In between all the Ork and Space Marine players there aren't much Chaos Space Marine players in our store. I always like being original, so that already gave them a headstart.

- Gameplay. Tau were my first army and allthough I'm happy with the way I built and painted the army I never really liked their playstyle. I'm not much of a tactician and to be good at Tau you need to be willing to constantly tinker with lists and think about strategy, which isn't really my game. Therefore, with my second army I was looking for a dramatic switch between playstyles. The power-armored, asaulty nature of the CSM again made them a natural choice.

- Look. I don't really know anyone who can deny that the CSM's are one of the most badass looking armies in the game. Everything about the army simply screams asskickery. Defilers, posessed, terminators and even the regular chaos space marines all have loads of cool stuff that makes other armies look bland.

 

My advice would be to not let the veterans talk you out of the army with their grumblings about how the new codex is less interesting compared to the old one. Chaos Space Marines are a great army and way cooler than anything else out there.

[Archnomad]

Because Night Lords are cool, and I liked the fun and original, as well as versatile and customisable builds available.

 

And look where that got me. *grumbles*

 

I started playing nids, got the chaos book about 2 years later, fell in love. Made 4 chaos armies (night lords, my main army, emperor's children, word bearers and death guard), then the new book comes out. Great, now I have an excuse to buy more chaos models! So I go, impulse buy everything, play my first few games with my brand new book and realise I was just playing dark blue ultramarines with lightning and an extra attack in close combat. So, since I realised I've now branched out and played with;

 

Imperial Guard, Eldar, Dark Eldar, and I've now finally settled on Space Wolves. I like my Space Wolves, if anything they're more like the old Chaos than we are.

 

Ugh, what a mess.

 

 

Archy

[Ryan814]

I play chaos because I wanted to be the good guys, fluff wise I believe we are the good guys. Slighted and betrayed by their leaders and having victories won on your blood handed over to bureaucrats to mess up. I love a lot of the fluff surrounding them, the Black Library novels focusing on chaos are some of my favorite. Storm of Iron, and the Word Bearers books in particular.