Help my brothers!

[Arnor]

Greetings brothers

 

Basicly for the past few days iv been toyin with the idea of makin my own wolf lord an not sure if i should or not an if so wat to epuip him with.

 

Wat i got so far is (goin for a small bit shooty massive bit assulty):

 

runic or termiator armor?

wolf tooth neckless

storm bolter or combi-flamer?

powerfist or wolf claw?

saga of warrier born

 

 

the bit with ?'s are wat im not sure on please adives

 

Arnor

[the jeske]

costs too much .

 

first of all do you already have a power armored rune priest with chooser of slain ? if not then get one . it should always be your first HQ.

 

as the lord goes.

 

If you take him then know that lords cost a lot of points and still die like normal meq and if they dont then they cost as much as special and then there is little sense in playing a normal lord .

 

I would play something cheap like a WL with neckless wolf claw storm shield on a mount and for him to join 3 WTC one with hammer ,one with SS , one naked.

[hendrik]

welcome pup

have an ale and take a seat to listen to this greybeards' advise

first of all, use proper spelling. your profile says you're from the UK so proper english shouldn't be to hard for you. this makes it easier for us to read.

second, this really gives us quite a lot of options i'll try to give my opinion on them.

runic armour or TDA; both have a 2+ armour save but the TDA also has a 5+ inv save. the only way you can give the wolf lord an inv save is by taking TDA, a belt of Russ or a storm shield. since you want your lord to be shooting a stromshield's aout of the option. now it's up to you to decide which to choice. overall i prefer runic armour + belt of Russ over TDA.

strombolter or combiflamer; in my own experience i've not really used flamers with great succes, unless against hordes so here i would go for the stormbolter

powerfist or wolf claw:

the wolf claw allows you to keep your high I, something that's really valuable. if you should hawever decide to not want that I bonus, i'd say thunderhammer > powerfist.

[Arnor]

ok cool cheers for the help.

 

ill think about it a bit more before i go ahead with anythin.

[Grimtooth]

What is up with always advising the min/max rune priest option as your first HQ choice? A army without a wolf lord or even a leader? And even then a rune priest doesn´t even come with an invulnerable save.

 

In my opinion, every army should start out with either a wolf lord or wolf guard battle leader.

[the jeske]

In my opinion, every army should start out with either a wolf lord or wolf guard battle leader.

ok . again can a lord or leader be instant killed ? yes , unless he takes a saga . does it make him cost tons of points then ? yes it does. Does he work only in melee , where he can be singled out [more or less only place where he can actually be hurt by your opponent]? yep it is still the case. With rhino rush gone since 3ed what are the ways of delivering a hth focused unit in to hth ? LR[a lot of points ] bike [a lot of points considering a bodyguard of bikers has to be taken] a wolf mount [ditto again] . So this is the lord . now the army . Each and every army that can take a form of psychic hood should have one [one point for auto including a Rune pries] . Choser of slain hurts infiltration based armies bad. A lot of the RP psychic powers hurt many armies bad [like jaws vs nids or jaws vs pms , what doesnt mean other psychic powers are worse] . As the RP is a support character [and a cheap one too] he doesnt really do melee , so less chance for him to die . If he somehow ends up in hth he is a buffed up sgt with a force weapon [what isnt bad considering his cost] . etc etc

Is this enough why RP are always the first choice for an HQ ?

[Logan230]

Honestly? No, I agree with Brother Ramses. I believe in building the army, then the HQ and so far, I have not found a place to put a Rune Priest in my lists. Are they good Wolves? I will completely agree with that, but I will also state that in my local Metagame, there are 0-1 psychic armies, thus no need for a psychic defense. By your own admission, a Rune Priest is a support character, honestly I have no place in my army for a character that sits still the entire game to shoot things, and I will not give up a grey hunter in my rhinos to fir him in there because their job is to rush forward, dakka, then CC. With the emphasis on the CC. Nor do I field Long Fangs for him to hang out with. Thus that leaves, once again in my case, putting him in TDA and dropping him with my termies, or putting him in the LR. which ever they are using this game.

I believe that there is no such thing as a "First" choice HQ. They have to fit your play style, your list, and the personality of your army. My personal preference? WL w/ TDA, SS, FB, WTN and Saga of Beastslayer. comes in at about 200 and slaughters anything that moves. Besides, what is stopping your enemy from one shotting your RP? so they both die really easy, the difference is one is good at range the other is a CC beast. take your pick. thats my .02 isk.

[Grey Mage]

I wouldnt say that Rune Priests are Slouchs in CC, but I will admit they arent as good as a WL- but they are cheaper.

 

Wolf Lords become a viable HQ choice IMHO at around 1500 to 1750pts. Less than that and you should take a WGBL to save points, or a priest to enhance the effectiveness of one of your squads. More than that and you will need a Rune Priest for psychic abilities, either offensive or defensive.

 

Frankly though I agree with the idea of never giving up your GHs to stick in an HQ, since I dont do that for WGPLs either. Thus I find the best HQs for me are Rune Priests *on a bike with swiftclaws or on foot with long fangs, or in a razorback with WG* Wolf Priests in LRCs with Bloodclaws, or with a JP with Skyclaws, or a WGBL in a Razorback with WG.

 

Things I note: Belt of russ is nifty, but a stormshield is often better. Unless your going for something like dual lightning claws or FB+BP Id always take a SS on a WL or WGBL.

 

Rune Priests are better in CCW than a WGPL, and give alot of flexability to the squad with the right powers. They also help with monstrous creatures- if your seeing alot of them around, a runic weapon can instant kill even the six wound gribblies without a problem.

 

Wolf Priests should be attached to any BC squad that isnt just 10 strong in a rhino. The rerolls truely make the youngins survivable.

 

Bust mostly- take the HQ you want, then strip every single toy from it you dont absolutely need until it is as cheap and efficient as humanly possible. But always keep five points for a wolf tail talisman ;).

[CODE40K]

OK im new to forums but not to wolves for me any army under 1500pts takes a priest, any army between 1500 and 2000 takes WGBL and any army over that size must have a wolf lord. In the games ive played with the new codex the Rune Priest annoys and distracts my opponents the most. This alone can sometimes change his battle plan and help you.

 

The other thing i try to remember is for me wolves are all about heroes and heroic deeds and the roleplayer in me cant help but bring that to the battlefield. The construction of your army will ultimately how you want to play and consider that before deciding on your HQ choices.

 

Hope this Helps.

 

DOC

[Skirax]

Have an ale on me! I'm buying ;)

 

Try the boar pork while you're here...

[the jeske]

comes in at about 200 and slaughters anything that moves

that is not true [unless you deep strike him alone what is a very bad idea]. His minimal cost is [as he is a hth unit] his bodyguar +the cost of the land raider they use . thats compared to the cost of a Rune priests that can hide in any squad and even if he doesnt cast one power [should not happen very offten] , he still hurts opponents on +4 .

400+points for a lord in termi armor +bodyguard vs 110 pts for RP = rune priest is better. to run a lord you more or less have to give up on a unit of gh or take fewer support units [what makes some of them non viable or a lot worse].

Also no he doesnt slaughter everything he touchs , he kills meq [and still has a big chance of eating a fist and dieing] and again only if he actually makes it in to hth.

[Logan230]

comes in at about 200 and slaughters anything that moves

that is not true [unless you deep strike him alone what is a very bad idea]. His minimal cost is [as he is a hth unit] his bodyguar +the cost of the land raider they use . thats compared to the cost of a Rune priests that can hide in any squad and even if he doesnt cast one power [should not happen very offten] , he still hurts opponents on +4 .

400+points for a lord in termi armor +bodyguard vs 110 pts for RP = rune priest is better. to run a lord you more or less have to give up on a unit of gh or take fewer support units [what makes some of them non viable or a lot worse].

Also no he doesnt slaughter everything he touchs , he kills meq [and still has a big chance of eating a fist and dieing] and again only if he actually makes it in to hth.

 

Well first off, when i said his cost, I was saying his model. now if you want to go into the whole unit then yes he comes with a very expensive following I wont lie. but to me its worth it, for me, he is a little Ragnar. I5, S5 with a 2/3 save. and imo taking marines against MCs in CC is the worst decision. can RPs do it? yes. is he likely to survive? no. but its a preference choice. I also think it is worth mentioning that i play in 1750 games. should of stated that earlier, my mistake. for those saying that such a unit makes you sacrifice other units, my army is pretty efficent to begin with, this is basically my big threat unit. my opponents get to chose between shooting the LR w/ Lord, the two GH Rhinos, trilas pred, MM LS, and worry about where my Wolf Scouts are coming from, and the Skyclaws that are bouncing around the board. if they hit the LR, then the Skyclaws and GH hit them, and vice versa.

[Level]

Jeske, I have to admit that I agree with you whole heartedly on this.

 

A Wolf lord is a great charachter but is weighing in at almost double the points cost of a Rune Priest.

It is important to have something that has a little bit of killing power in CC but if you look at the differences between the lord and the battle leader and the effectiveness of sagas in relation to their points cost all you actually need is a lord that can compliment a GH squad and put in some kills in to ensure that you can win the combat resolution. You don't have to and often don't want to kill everything in one turn, you just have to kill more of them than they do of you so that you break them and can potentially run them down. The initiative 5 is important so power fists and thunder hammers are in my opinion a terrible choice for a cc charachter as frost blades usually do the job well enough and you kill them before they get a chance to hit you. i find that a battle leader holds up just as well as a Lord in this regard and gives me the points to spend elsewhere so that I have a tactical advantage over my foes. The role of the rune priest is invaluable, even if you are not taking him for his ability to block psychic attacks his offensive powers are extremely powerful and he will certainly always be the first HQ choice in my lists.

[Grimtooth]

Jeske, the reasons you have given for a rune priest really are a joke.

 

For instance you act as if he is never going to get into the fight so won't die as easy, but then you point out his psychic hood that needs to be within 24" to be effective. Lots of heavy weaponry that are going to pop that no inv save character that are within that range.

 

You listed Jaws as the psychic power to take. Well are you also going to take Master of the Runes so you can also cast either Storm Caller or Tempest Wraith? What about the fact that once again you need to be close enough for that 24" line to be effective that you are getting either assaulted or shot the heck up?

 

CoS is only as good as the placement. You either place it for max LoS to increase your rune priests use of psychic shooting attacks or you place it protect yourself from infiltrators. Considering that the radius for those infiltrating units is only 18", doing both is really that easy.

 

You then discount a wolf lord because he will need to be with a bodyguard. Well the rune priest is not drop podding or foot slogging solo. Any squad you can add a rune priest to, you can just as easily add a wolf lord.

 

My order of precedence goes as follows:

 

Wolf Lord or WGBL (dependent on points)

Rune Priest

Wolf Priest (and only if I am using Blood Claws in my list.)

 

My current everything list has my HQ coming in like this:

 

Wolf Lord in TDA with Wolf Guard in TDA, drop pod

WGBL with jump pack with Sky Claws, deep striking

Rune Priest in TDA with Wolf Guard in TDA, drop pod

Wolf Priest with Blood Claws, drop pod

[the jeske]

Lots of heavy weaponry that are going to pop that no inv save character that are within that range.

how are you poping a HQ from a 7-8 man plasma squad [with 2 psychic hoods covering more or less the whole army] ? the thing with the RP is he doesnt need to get in to hth [and in hth your opponent can always hurt your IC specially if he has a fist] to be effective , he doest boost the squad kill potential in no way a WL does , but still those are 3 force weapon attacks so around 1 meq killed. A WL works only in hth and lets face it there are more killy units then a WL and hiden fists do exist . A rune priest doesnt even have to get out of a rhino/lr to use the staff or psychic powers he is nice safe and cheap . A wolf lord costs a lot points and he aint a falcon , he does die.

 

You listed Jaws as the psychic power to take. Well are you also going to take Master of the Runes so you can also cast either Storm Caller or Tempest Wraith? What about the fact that once again you need to be close enough for that 24" line to be effective that you are getting either assaulted or shot the heck up?

no m8 I made an example of Jaws , because I didnt want to write about every psychic power there is . Cant be shot when am in a rhino and GW is getting rid of units with a 24"charge range , as the question goes what RP do at 24" range.

 

 

You then discount a wolf lord because he will need to be with a bodyguard. Well the rune priest is not drop podding or foot slogging solo. Any squad you can add a rune priest to, you can just as easily add a wolf lord.

yes , but it would have to be fast so bikes[lot of points . meh as an assault unit] , something in LR [even more points ] etc. And while it does protect him from shoting just like it does for the rune priest , the RP does not have to go hth where he gets fisted . the RP also doesnt cost almost 200 pts . where we have to ask ourselfs from what points do we buy the bodyguard unit . With a cheap RP or two I will always have more points to buy troops , then someone who plays a RP/Lord set up . unless you want to play without a rune priest at all , but then you will get owned by opponent psychic powers.

 

 

 

I also think it is worth mentioning that i play in 1750 games

that doesnt really change much as most armies will just have more fire power to down stuff. the lord may start to make a difference at 1850 when you gain extra support points[i mean the free points] and when one can play with 2 LR 2 cheap priests 1 lord with TWC behind them with GH camper plasma squad.

[Archnomad]

Woah. Calm down folks, this is a place for friendly discussion among us fellow Space Wolves. Save the hate for those skirt wearing Dark Angels and whatnot. :)

 

Now, have to say, I don't think Wolf Lord's are all that. They have almost no force multiplying potential. Realistically this game is about squads, and units, and (in 5E) vehicles. Characters in this game tend to be a fist away from death. The only kind of Wolf Lord I would consider is one on a Thunderwolf. Other times, a Wolf Priest or (my favourite) a Rune Priest will do more for the amount you put in.

 

Consider this;

 

10 Grey Hunters (2 meltas, motw, wolf standard) with a Wolf Lord (Frost Blade, Runic Armour, Belt of Russ, Wolf Neck Talisman, Wolf Pelt, Saga of the Warrior Born) charge into your average 10 chaos marine squad with 2 meltas, undivided icon, and a power fist. Yep, those chaos marines get massacred. But if you replace the Wolf Lord with a 100 pt Wolf priest, the same thing happens! (and that WP comes with a 4+ invulnerable in those point costs)

 

Rune Priests are a bit harder to work out. They don't contribute to combat, but in my 1500 point infantry list, I run 2 Rune Priests, one with JotWW/Hurricane, one with JotWW/Living Lightning. Yeah that's quite a shooty army, but in my last 1500 point game, JotWW killed 6 TH/ss Termies (out of 18) and Vulkan. I'd like to see even a pair of wolf lords take that out! And those RPs are 230 points for both.

 

In my Mech army I take 1 RP for psychic protection, with Thunderclap (usable within a vehicle) and Jaws of the World Wolf for beating big things. But my point is (after much rambling!) that even though the Rune Priest doesn't kill as much in combat (and even then he's rescued my Grey Hunters from squads before) he has so much more overall potential and utility!