Grey Knight organization.

[Brother_Kaelgrim]

Hey folks I'm painting up a GK force and I'm trying to come up with a nice fluffy background for them.

 

My force uses a variation of the GK paint scheme with a mithril silver/blood red scheme and I'm wondering what one would call them as a force.

 

Are they a company? A warband? Do they name themselves after the one leading them, IE Kaelgrim Company?

[Doomaflatchi]

Generally speaking, the Grey Knights do not use the standard troop organizational structure outlined in the Codex Astartes (Chapter, Company, etc.) due to the fact that their numbers are large, widespread, and highly fluid. As far as functional groups, they usually operate in a Task Force under the leadership of a Brother-Captain (if the highest-ranking member is only a Justicar, they are field-promoted for the duration of the mission) which is then comprised of individual Squads of battle-brothers.

 

As for your army, just make it a standing Task Force under the leadership of whatever you use for an HQ choice (Inquisitor, Grand Master, or Brother-Captain). This works especially well if your leader has a particular foe he seeks to fight, like hunting down the daemons of one particular legion, as this gives a perfect reason for his force to remain cohesive beyond a single engagement. He can adopt an alternate color scheme to denote their assignment, and then take them across the galaxy in pursuit of that foe. So, you'd have Kaelgrim's Strike Force, or something of the like.

 

Hope this helps. B)

[Brother_Kaelgrim]

Yes it does. Kind of leads into my next question though.

 

Would it be unreasonable for a group of GKs to hunt a set of heretics/daemons through the Webway? For example they are charged by an Inquisitor Lord to defend the Black Library or something while an Inquisitor makes his way to it? (I believe thats happened before several times, not sure)

 

I just have this image in my head of Grey Knights swooping out of the shadows, striking down daemons as they become lost and dazed in the Webway. It seems like the perfect arena for them as it would hypothetically let them cut the daemon's numerical advantage down to size. And whenever my force isn't fighting in the Webway, well there is a gate nearby and a guy has to repair his gear sometimes B)

[Grand Master Tyrak]

Generally speaking, the Grey Knights do not use the standard troop organizational structure outlined in the Codex Astartes (Chapter, Company, etc.) due to the fact that their numbers are large, widespread, and highly fluid. As far as functional groups, they usually operate in a Task Force under the leadership of a Brother-Captain (if the highest-ranking member is only a Justicar, they are field-promoted for the duration of the mission) which is then comprised of individual Squads of battle-brothers.

 

QFT. Essentially, the only permanent formation is the squad - all other formations are put together and dissolved as needs be.

 

Would it be unreasonable for a group of GKs to hunt a set of heretics/daemons through the Webway?

 

I would say no. The Eldar are very picky about who uses their Webway (meaning the task force will be permanently looking over their shoulders), and as a result of this the Imperium doesn't know much about it. The odds of getting in are reasonable when in the right place at the right time - the odds of getting out again (and in the right place) are much lower. Grey Knights are a little too precious to be used on such a risky mission, especially when the Eldar can be relied upon to be as anti-Chaos as the Ordo Malleus.

 

For example they are charged by an Inquisitor Lord to defend the Black Library or something while an Inquisitor makes his way to it? (I believe thats happened before several times, not sure)

 

It's not a public library, y'know. :) All those who have gone in there have gone in with the permission of the guardians of the Black Library. If Ahriman hasn't got there in ten thousand years, I doubt an Inquisitor is going to have much success (that doesn't stop him trying though). Even if you got into the Webway, it could well be that he spends his time running around it fruitlessly while the Laughing God and his Harlequins jeer at him.

[Magnus Thane]

GK strikeforces are assembled as per the requirements of the mission and the GK assets available.

[Brother_Kaelgrim]

Thanks for the replies folks! I'll have to ponder some more about the fluff, but having a fluid organization is good. Means I can get creative with naming and such :)

[Inquisitor =D=]

Gk's +Webway = No.

 

Sorry man but please for the sake of us all stay away from the Inquisition War's story line. Please. ;)

 

As for the force organization I'm not sure that they do name themselves as such... From what I'm to understand the amount of Gks and indeed which Gk's is case per case. Example mission A requires 1 Brother Captian, 9 Gk's , and a Land Raider. While mission B needs 2 Justicars and 18 Gk's with multiple incinerators. Its never really whats on hand just whats needed.

 

=]D[=

[Brother_Kaelgrim]

Inquisition War? Never heard of it.

[hmk17]

It got rereleased a while back. An okay read, if you just want more ][ stuff.

[Inquisitor =D=]

Inquisition War? Never heard of it.

 

Ah... My bad Usually when we hear the words "Inquisitor" and "Webway" thats what people are going off of. Lol...

[jeffersonian000]

Grey Knight (per my reckonning) are deployed as a Task Force about one or more Strike Cruisers. The knights themselves are a Strike Force composed of one or more Strike Teams, with each team lead by a Justicar under a Brother Captain who is in over all command, with Grand Masters in charge of one or more Task Forces, form a Fleet or Armada.

 

As to Webway access, Imperial Inquisitors of the Ordo Malleus due have access to the Black Library, which may only be reached via the Webway. And last I checked, Grand Masters are counted as amoung the highest levels of the Inquisition as Lords in their own right.

 

SJ

[Doomaflatchi]

As to Webway access, Imperial Inquisitors of the Ordo Malleus due have access to the Black Library, which may only be reached via the Webway.

 

I don't think this is quite right... as I recall, the only humans that the Eldar have ever granted access to the Black Library are the members of the Illuminati - a secret society within the inquisition whose members would be executed for their heretical views if the rest of the Inquisition ever found out.

[Grand Master Tyrak]

As to Webway access, Imperial Inquisitors of the Ordo Malleus due have access to the Black Library, which may only be reached via the Webway.

I don't think this is quite right... as I recall, the only humans that the Eldar have ever granted access to the Black Library are the members of the Illuminati - a secret society within the inquisition whose members would be executed for their heretical views if the rest of the Inquisition ever found out.

 

Illuminati or not, the Eldar have let some Inquisitors into the Black Library before now. Key word there: "let". Chaos has not been kept out of there for millennia without good reason - you don't just stroll in the direction of the Black Library unless you fancy being a plaything for the Harlequins. And that assumes you could even get into the Webway at all. Even Inquisitor Czevak was forbidden to speak about what he found out in the Black Library, so I'm not sure what use it would be to you anyway.

[Inquisitor Fox]

I don't think this is quite right... as I recall, the only humans that the Eldar have ever granted access to the Black Library are the members of the Illuminati - a secret society within the inquisition whose members would be executed for their heretical views if the rest of the Inquisition ever found out.

Although realistically the Illuminati are just Thorians with a few extra ideas tacked on.. in and of itself the beliefs they have aren't heretical... it's the whole plotting to pull essentially a grand coup out of their butts on the day the Golden Throne fails Conspiracy thing that becomes a little more problematic B)

[jeffersonian000]

There is a bit of a misconception on who actually controls access to the Black Library. Which is, in fact, is that the Black Library controls access to itself. Only those that cannot be corrupted by chaos may enter. As such, most Eldar cannot enter the Black Library, yet many Inquisitors and all of the Illuminati may enter, as well as all Grey Knights. Harlequins are the guardians of the Library, and are themselves composed in equal parts of Craftworld, Exodite, and Dark Eldar, per there own fluff. There is even fluff stating the Harlequins work with the Inquisition, and that both have access to the Black Library for the purpose of defeating choas.

 

Now, there has never been (to my knowledge) any fluff stating the Grey Knights have ever entered the Black Library; however, there is no reason to assume that they would be barred entry if such an occasion ever did occur.

 

SJ

[- 7eAL -]

Here's a foolish riddle off the top of my head:

A Grey Knight enters the Black Library.

When he leaves, he discovers that he is a changed man.

What is he now?

[Inquisitor =D=]

Here's a foolish riddle off the top of my head:

A Grey Knight enters the Black Library.

When he leaves, he discovers that he is a changed man.

What is he now?

 

Depressed.

 

"Brother Captain, I went to the black library and all I got was a lecture...."

 

I'm really curious where you guys are getting your soucres as to the Library. No really, just curious. All I have to go off of are various novels and codexi. I don't remember it saying anywhere that humans had access and the eldar didn't. Cause from what I remember only the Pheonix Lords and certain Eldar Psykers are given access....

 

=]D[=

[brownie21o]

Depressed.

 

"Brother Captain, I went to the black library and all I got was a lecture...."

 

I'm really curious where you guys are getting your soucres as to the Library. No really, just curious. All I have to go off of are various novels and codexi. I don't remember it saying anywhere that humans had access and the eldar didn't. Cause from what I remember only the Pheonix Lords and certain Eldar Psykers are given access....

 

=]D[=

 

Ravenor got to, just off the top of my head.

[Grand Master Tyrak]

I'm really curious where you guys are getting your soucres as to the Library.

 

Inquisitor Czevak comes from the older fluff on the Eldar (the articles that GW used to have on their old website). All the Eldar information came from his point of view. Around the time of the 13th Black Crusade, he is believed to be being held captive in the Webway by the Eldar (can't remember the source). Later, he crops up again as speaking at the Conclave of Har to say that he cannot speak of what he saw in the Black Library (4th ed. Rulebook, IIRC).

[Validar]

@the force organisation: A certain quiz on this forum suggests that the Grey Knights actually has 10 companies, just like other codex chapters. He has sources that confirms this.

 

Now, I havn't read the sources myself. Is he right or wrong?

[Grand Master Tyrak]

Now, I havn't read the sources myself. Is he right or wrong?

 

There are two current trends on this. First is the Index Astartes line - the Grey Knights have ten Companies and a Chapter Master. Imperial Armour 2 follows this line with ten Brother-Captains and the single Grand Master, and is produced later than C:DH.

 

Second is the C:DH line - there are no companies, with the squads of the Grey Knights being spread out over the Imperium, and multiple Grand Masters, one of whom sits on the Inner Conclave of the Inquisition. The Grey Knight novels follow this line, with multiple Grand Masters and ad-hoc formations rather than fixed Companies. The BL novels are the most current (but have contradictions even with the material they are supposed to be following), and in descending order we have Imperial Armour 2, C:DH, and Index Astartes: Grey Knights and Deathwatch.

 

The rest is logic. I'll just lay out a few points:

 

Firstly, it was believed that a single leader in command of the Grey Knights would have too much power. This makes sense to me - the Inquisition is well-known for being decentralised and cellular rather than hierarchical due to the authority that they wield.

 

Secondly, it has been put forward that the Grey Knights have up to 3000 Marines. I've never seen the source for this so I can't confirm it, but it means either more Companies, larger Companies or no Companies. Either way, it seems less practical to have Companies of 300 (using the Imperial Armour 2 line of ten Company commanders) under a single commander - it's too centralised.

 

Thirdly, the Grey Knights have to cover the entire Imperium. Even with more Marines, using Companies is far too unwieldy and inflexible, particularly for problems that cross the jurisdiction of multiple Companies. It seems better to have no Companies, greater flexibility in creating formations as needed, and allow squads to be split up and stationed around the galaxy to facilitate rapid response without worrying about Company hierarchy, especially when you are supposed to be the first on the scene. Having the fastest ships and best Navigators isn't much use if you get held up by Company red tape and protocol.