Ikken Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 I was just watching the Beasts of War utube clip http://www.youtube.com/beastsofwar#p/u/0/m7CwjN4JD-M about multiple independent chars . and was wondering if this would be a practical option ,or what combos would be effective . because we can have up to 4 ICs it may benifit us more than most . what would be the pros and cons ? for example we could have a 20 man mega unit ,15 blood claws , a wolf priest , ragnar , a wolf lord , and maybe a rune priest just for kicks ,plus a WGPL . this would mow through just about anything , and you could stack the ICs up against enamy ICs . the con would be there is not a transport big enough for the unit so it would have to foot slog . and it would be helish expensive , points wise . another possibility would be a rune priest and 3 WGBL plus a full unit of skyclaws .that could be very effective , and a suprise for your opponent . or 4 wolf lords in termi armor attached to a 11 wolfguard in termi armor ,stuffed in a rhino <_< just kicking this out there for discussion , is it a viable tactic or a points sink . what situations would this work well in and which armies would this work well against ? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
styx Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Personally, I would buy you dinner and a beer if you did this in a game against me, it would be only fair before I screw you over. *kidding about the dinner/beer part* Doing something like that against me, I would just have to plow down that unit to kill a huge chunk of your army with little to no effort. The point sink is huge and if your was playing VPs that is a huge critical mistake. Even worse for a KP mission. I call it stuffing the turkey if you ask me....oooo...nice juicy land raider loaded with a squad and tons of ICs! Yum! Who brough the sweet potatoes? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athalus Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 You mine as well put a giant target on your head at that point. Gotta make lots of viable targets so you can get them in for the attack. The only things I see that are worth combining is Logan grimmnar with a rune priest so you can get tank hunters on him with living lightning =). That way you can stay the hell outa range with some Long fangs or something, perhaps drop podding into a really defensible position to shoot from? Nevertheless, its a primo build expenditure and a huge waste if you get burned. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305223 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormshrug Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Anything that big would probably be something of a point sink, I suspect (though, as another thread discussed, it could be cool in Apocalypse. But Apocalypse is defined by being simultaneously awesome and an exercise in strategic ridiculousness). Fundamentally, the problem is that I don't think you'd really want to run that many ICs most of the time, even if you separated them out. I mean, with decent equipment, the point costs for those squads are (conservative ballpark with no Codex in front of me - they'd probably be more): 650ish points for the first (ICs only). 500ish points for the second (ICs only). And around 600 points for the third (again, ICs only). Even totally ignoring the problem of losing them to template fire, it seems like you'd be better served putting those points into simply putting more Bolter-wielding Grey Hunters onto the field the vast majority of the time, given the enhanced value of troops in 5th Edition. If you want to run multiple "character"-type models in a single squad, Wolf Guard attached to an IC and a squad are probably your best option. If you do feel compelled to try this, though, I suspect you'd be most successful against close-combat armies, and have the most trouble with range-heavy armies. This build might actually even be pretty good against CC armies (provided you're not fighting lots of s8 or Monstrous enemies), but it would be somewhat limited in flexibility. All of your power weapon attacks would cut through enemy troops pretty well, but that's assuming you could effectively get to combat without being shot to death first. Anything with lots of artillery would assuredly be your worst matchup, given that you'd see a lot of insta-gibbing of your ICs. In conclusion, I'd compare this to the six Dreadnought army I built on a lark using the Vanilla codex. It's a kick (particularly to see their face when you put down almost nothing but Dreadnoughts), but it's extremely inflexible; if they have lots of tankbusting, you're kind of screwed. You may steamroll some opponents with it (as I have, on occasion), but you'll also get rolled frequently due to its glaring weaknesses. It could be entertaining to play, but it probably won't be "good." -Stormshrug Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
calgar101 Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 My new 2000 point Space Wolf army includes this- Logan grimnar, Njal Stromcaller, Ragnar Blackmane and a custom Wolf Lord as HQ, troops are a tooled up 9 Wolf Guard with Arjac Rock fist and a unit of 14 Blood Claws with Lukas the Trickster. My plan is to do a refuse flank with Njal and Logan with the Wolf Guard and then my Wolf Lord and Ragnar in the Blood Claws. If i can get those Blood claws into combat well if i calculated it correct i could get over 100 attacks on the charge Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305359 Share on other sites More sharing options...
greese_m0nkey Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 A simple version of this is 14 BC with Ragnar and a plain WP in a LRC. BC's for the body count Ranger to give the useful bonuses and the WP for re rerolls. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305433 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacefrisian Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 A though (but foolish) player would go for the following setup. Logan Ragnar: with wolves Ulrik Njall Arjac 15 Bloodclaws one being Lukas It will be shot to pieces i think but its still badass. Unless the local nid player gets overjoyed and places his Mawloc nearby and scatters outside of the unit. Than its dinner time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305473 Share on other sites More sharing options...
calgar101 Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 space thats not legal as you need 2 troops atleast. Mine is legal since having Logan makes Wolf Guard count as troops :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305485 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ullr Direfang Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 i think space was pointing out a unit build not an army build. I have personally thought this tactic, if you want to call it that might actually work well with proper for thought. with the right build, and even some of th SCs i hate so much i think some one could throw a pretty nice list together. granted all other choices would have to be committed to taken out threats to the "wolf hammer' unit you have just made but it is an idea i think a lot about. o, and to the OP, your last idea of a bunch of guys in termie armor all in a rhino can't happen. i don't know if it was sarcasium but i did catch it (it could be this whole typed over the internet thing) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305515 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiguriusX Posted March 6, 2010 Share Posted March 6, 2010 You could make a skyclaw unit with multiple HQs wearing JPs WL WGBL RP WP They all go with 10 sky claws and the JP delivery system runs you 100pts for the delivery of 4 HQ by DS (instead of a LR) If everyone has Runic armor + SS and you pick a smart location to DS you should survive to launch a counter attack This seems to be the cheapest delivery system to get you within striking distance with minimum incoming fire The major drawback is you have no guarantee what turn this massive point sink unit will arrive Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/193966-multiple-ics-in-one-attack-unit/#findComment-2305611 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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