Token Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 Are runes magical, like dwarven runes in fantasy, or are the runes the runepriests use just to identify them as runepriests or something similar? Could a rune, fluffwise, give a model a 5+ save or replace a storm shield? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadir Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 I think that runes are magical. At least a few of them - see runic charms, that give your troops boost. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318472 Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlbitz Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 I don't think that they are actually "Magic" so much as the Space Wolves believe they are. I don't think its the Runes that give a Rune Priest his power so much as that they believe that they have power and thus become their point of focus. Same thing with a Wolf Tail Talisman. Probably no real power in the item itself, but because the superstitious Space Wolves believe they have power they work. To me, its all about their faith in these items more so than the actual power of the item itself. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beef Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 As littlebitz says, however in previous incarnations the runes were not purely decorative, they serve to channel and concentrate thier psycic powers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318545 Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinkenheim Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 some runes are magical, the type carved by the rune priests for instane. at least i imagine they are, much like dwarven runes, they help focus the energy contained within them or the energy that a person can summon to themselves. others however (and i believe the vast majority) are merely good luck charms and little more than decoration. however that doesn't mean they are powerless, the thousand sons novel mentions that belief in somethings power can be nearly as good as the thing having actual power. its a faith thing, you think you are lucky or that you are portected. It doesn't mean that you are, but should something save you then suddenly its because of your charm and it proves the power it has in your mind. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispy Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 The runes are a method of focusing psychic power. It is a system of belief and power that exists in the Rune Priests mind. Their is power in their belief, and that belief allows them to impose a method of order over the chaotic forces of the warp. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318672 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarapham Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 I can imagine it works a bit in the same way as with all things ork. An ork weapon is useless in the hands of a human because they only work because the orks believe it works. A rune is useless by itself but as others have said it´s the belief in it that actually makes it work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318686 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiguriusX Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 Runic armor has "runes of protection" and gives your 5+ save against wounds from psychic powers. See p. 61 of the codex Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318697 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlSkaven Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 As Wispy said they are in fact a method for fucusing their power... however they are more often used ( the Runes ) for divinations...its the Rune priest version of the imperial tarrot!!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318708 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Betrayed_Spacewolf Posted March 15, 2010 Share Posted March 15, 2010 Well as a nordic pagan yes I believe the runes have power. In the old beliefs the runes were not only communication but wards against evil and such. What amazed me was that many of the runes on the models are the ones used to repel evil. Such as tiwaz the t shaped rune on the helmets Runes are inscribed by the artificers and the rune priest gives them power. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2318736 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Remus Posted March 16, 2010 Share Posted March 16, 2010 Well, in A Thousand Sons (Great read btw) Ahriman made a bit of a refrence to the charms and such that Space Wolves carry. He mused that the belief in such totems, like the runes, projected their own power and protection against the powers of the warp. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2321793 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Be careful with "A Thousand Sons" quotes as they may spoil it for those yet to read(and if you have not started reading shame on you! :D ) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2322081 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCarter Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 Runes are a location for microcircuits that actually do the job. In the same way, prayers and chants are mnemonics for operating and servicing equipment in a largely illiterate society and rune on equipment are microcircuits or operating keys. Some circuits focus psychic energy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2323511 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Betrayed_Spacewolf Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 seems the tulpa belief is strong in the 40k universe Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2324969 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 Are runes magical, like dwarven runes in fantasy, or are the runes the runepriests use just to identify them as runepriests or something similar? Could a rune, fluffwise, give a model a 5+ save or replace a storm shield? Not really, no. Runes are a focus for the psychic powers of a Rune Priest, among other beings. Basicly a Rune embodies a concept, or a set of concepts, and provides you with a way of thinking about the sum total of that concept and/or its component parts. Its a very free flowing system of meditation that, proportedly, can produce mystical effects. Runes are also used as the basic alphabet, wich can lead to some confusion. Fenrisian script in 40k resembles the Norse elder and younger futharks, or Runes, and follow the same general guidelines- IE they have basic meanings, sounds, and mystical meanings. In the real world they are often used for divination, though they have other magical uses according to many believers. They can also be formed into "bind runes" or conglomerations of multiple runes used to create a "spell"... much like Dwarves in WFB actually. The alphabet system has largely fallen out of use, but was used far enough into modern history to be, usually, understandable by scholars whove done their homework. I wouldnt paint a Rune on somones arm and expect it to count-as a stormshield, unless ALOT of effort went into a 3-d conversion that drew the eye to it a bit, and you explained what it counted-as at the begining of the game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2324986 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Betrayed_Spacewolf Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 aye very good. mage if you want to put runes on your vehicles i suggest the fehu, teiwaz, algiz runes as these are all believed to repel evil. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2324992 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 *nods* If you have a good hand, you might try looking up one called "the helm of awe" wich was believed to protect the bearer in battle, often enscribed inside of helmets. Its a cool looking one, and goes great on a rhino hatch. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325008 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Token Posted March 19, 2010 Author Share Posted March 19, 2010 Googled that rune, looks abit much like a chaos star.. I want my marines to have runestones and such too, but they seem to often have a snake on them, but a snake seems kinda chaos too, not sure what to have instead of it.. Older runestones were simply stones with runes on them, without snakes and such, a friend of mine said. But that was before the Viking age.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325080 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hfran Morkai Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 Serpents have always been interesting in mythology, normally coming across as evil, yet why does an almost globally recognized medical symbol carry such a symbol if it represents evil? This was a pretty good read about runes though, I might want to get some books on them to add to my lore (I know I can find it on the net but nothing beats a good book) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325086 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Token Posted March 19, 2010 Author Share Posted March 19, 2010 The Viking runes stones snake is probably midgårds ormen, the midgard serpent/snake, not sure if that one is evil or not, but it is the.. half sibling(?) of Fenris, a huge wolf, both childs of Loke/Loki, a Asagod with the ability to change forms into animals and such and whos allegiance is pretty shifty, not sure if he is on the side of the gods or the giants. Rant rant.. sorry.. Not sure if the snake is evil or not, thoughts on this? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325088 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hfran Morkai Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 Well Fenrir/Fenris was a daemon in Norse mythology and not the sort of dog you'd like to come across, he was arrogant and foolish, being bound by as magical chain but when it breaks the Ragnarok will be upon the world as Fenrir wreaks his vengeance. So it would be logical Jörmungandr happens to be daemonic as well. The World Serpent will cause the end of the world if he lets go of his tail, which makes it seem like it's a good omen, so long as the circle is whole. However he wasn't friends with Odin (because he was the god who cast him into the ocean) or Thor. Though I'm no expert in Nordic mythology, yet... If anyone knows of some good quality books on Norse mythology and/or Runes and their meanings if you could post them here I'd be much obliged. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325109 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 Taking Up The Runes: A Complete Guide To Using Runes In Spells, Rituals, Divination, And Magic (Paperback) http://www.amazon.com/Taking-Up-Runes-Comp...5278&sr=8-5 I know that this is good for beginners, since my GF owns a copy of this. This is more about runes themselves. If You want to read about Norse mythology, apart of Edda <_<, I'd recommend the books by Nigel Pennick, and to lesser extent Edred Thorson. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325154 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarapham Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 Well Fenrir/Fenris was a daemon in Norse mythology and not the sort of dog you'd like to come across, he was arrogant and foolish, being bound by as magical chain but when it breaks the Ragnarok will be upon the world as Fenrir wreaks his vengeance. So it would be logical Jörmungandr happens to be daemonic as well. The World Serpent will cause the end of the world if he lets go of his tail, which makes it seem like it's a good omen, so long as the circle is whole. However he wasn't friends with Odin (because he was the god who cast him into the ocean) or Thor. Though I'm no expert in Nordic mythology, yet... If anyone knows of some good quality books on Norse mythology and/or Runes and their meanings if you could post them here I'd be much obliged. Yeah you got it pretty much right. Fenris/Fenrir is bound by Tyr who loses a hand in the process. (Good fluff if you want a HQ with "bionics" or such.) When Fenrir gets loose during Ragnarök he is pitted against Oden and wins, but Odin is avenged by his son Vidar. Thor is pitted against Jörmungandr and slays him with his hammer before being felled by the snakes poison. But Thor´s son lives on and inherits the hammer mjölner. So one could use both the runes for Oden and Thor as signs of death and rebirth as I think you can see the theme there. *To Mikal: The easiest way to look up "mainstream" norse myth is to find a book called Snorres Edda, I´m not sure about what it´s called in English but that old icelandic text is the basis for most of the myths as we see them today. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325313 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Token Posted March 19, 2010 Author Share Posted March 19, 2010 More off topic ranting.. Some years ago i heard or read somewhere that Thor and Tyr might be the same god, any new info on this? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325361 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CainTheHunter Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 More off topic ranting.. Some years ago i heard or read somewhere that Thor and Tyr might be the same god, any new info on this? Actually they are two different deities, at least used to be in the age of vikings. Dunno, maybe recently they merged or smth... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/194855-are-the-runes-in-themselves-magical/#findComment-2325373 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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