Eldar Wave Serpents Ramming

[Imperial Templar]

Just a quick, not stupid I hope, question. If a wave serpent moves 24 inches, then uses the special rule to move another 12 in the assualt phase, can it ram my vehicle and count as moving 36 inches for determination of the ram? This came up ina game a friend played against the eldar.

[Grey Mage]

Just a quick, not stupid I hope, question. If a wave serpent moves 24 inches, then uses the special rule to move another 12 in the assualt phase, can it ram my vehicle and count as moving 36 inches for determination of the ram? This came up ina game a friend played against the eldar.

Yes and no.

 

Tank shock technically happens during the movement phase. Star Engines, wich allow them to move that extra 12" instead of shooting, do not specify if they work in the movement phase or the shooting phase.

 

If you go with allowing them in the movement phase then yes, you tank shock 36". This is the opinion I support because the rule states "an additional 12" in lieu of shooting" wich seems to imply that other movement is being done at the same time.

 

If you go with them moving during the shooting phase, then no.

 

Note- that S caps at 10 no matter how fast he moves. So, as an AV 12 tank 24" will already be as fast as he needs to go to get a str 10 hit on you. Also note that he must move straightforward just like any other tank, and since hes the one ramming will not receive the skimmers dodge rule.

[SeattleDV8]

The Eldar FAQ tells us that the Star Engine move happens in the shooting phase.

I would disallow ramming with that move just for all the problems it would cause.

For example, rams count the movement for that turn, not just the phase so the star would get an extra boost.

If the target vehicle was 1" away in the shooting phase , but the skimmer had moved 12" in the movement phase this would be added

Rams are in a straight line, but the star engines would allow the skimmer to change his direction 'mid-ram'.

[jesselowe]

Further clarification request: Can a Wave Serpent ram in the movement phase and then use Star Engines in the shooting phase to move 12" after ramming?

[JamesI]

Tactica Astartes is not the place to discuss rules issues nor is it to discuss filthy xenos (except how to eliminate them).

 

I'll toss this over to Official Rules where it belongs.

[Seahawk]

You cannot use star engines to ram by going 36", as ramming can only be done in the movement phase and the star engine's 12" kicks in during the shooting phase.

 

And yes, if your wave serpent survives the ram, there is nothing stopping using the star engines to move away.

[Frosty the Pyro]

Unfortunatly everyone here is wrong.

 

Tank shock is never said to be done during the movement phase.

 

Second paragraph under tank shock (pg 68)

"When moving a tank a tank the player can declair the player is going to attempt to make a tank shock attack instead of moving normaly"

you could argue that moving normaly is only the movement made in the movement phase and not that of star engines is not moving normaly, but that feals like streatching to me.

 

Aditionaly to determin the damage

"Speed: each full 3" moved that turn by the rammer before impact"

so thats movement that turn, which included both movement and shooting phases.

 

So excepting the part about move normaly, which I don't think is enouph, nothing prevents a 36" ram.

[SeattleDV8]

The Star Engine move is a result of a vehicle wargear and not a 'normal move'.

Given that a good arguement for a movement following the normal rules instead of the normal movement phase can be made , but it is implied that it happens in the movement phase.

BRB pg. 68 "If the tank moved slowly enough during the Tank Shock attack, it may fire as normal in the shooting phase."

Also in the case of a Ramming attack the vehicle has to move it's highest speed.

So does the star engine skimmer have to move 36" in both phases or only 12 " in the shooting phase?

Another silly example; a skimmer rams 21"+ in the movement phase ( a ST 10 hit ) and both vehicles survive, then in the shooting phase he could ram again 0" in the shooting phase plus the 21"+ from before for another ST 10 hit ?

I don't believe this was the idea.

The RAW is not clear on this, but given the many problems caused by allowing star engine rams I still would still say no.