IA: Dragon Knights

[dragonknight4275]

I AM REDOING THE IA FOR MY CHAPTER, BASED ON THE NEW CRITERIA FOR A GOOD IA THAT THE B&C ARE HOLDING A POLL FOR. I WILL DELETE THIS ONCE I FIND OUT HOW. ;)

 

This the info base for my DIY Space Marine Chapter. It's most definetely NOT going to be a quick read, but read it piece by piece and learn all about the Space Marines of the DRAGON KNIGHTS CHAPTER................

 

Origins

"Brothers! We are young and we are strong. Let us show the High Lords that they made the right choice to allow our existence! Let this be our beginning!" Chapter Founder Phalanx addressing his warriors during the Mantris V Incursion

 

The Dragon Knights were formed in 738.M41 when a cadre of veterans from the Black Templars Chapter were given permission from the High Lords of Terra to take a fraction of the new Templar recruits. These would be the first warriors of a new Chapter. Among this cadre was the Space Marine known as Phalanx, who was (and is) a vital character in Dragon Knight history. The planet Ferrolius was designated to the fledgeling Chapter as a homeworld and also as an ideal location for the training base that the veteran cadre required to commence the training of the Neophytes that would become the first warriors of the Dragon Knights.

 

The Mantris V Rebellion and the Naming of the Chapter

Chapter Master Phalanx

A Black Templars Castellan with a reputation for preferring violent charges rather than stationary firebases, the High Lords saw in Phalanx something other than a formidable warrior with a short temper. They saw in him characteristics of a great leader and he was chosen to become the first Chapter Master of the Dragon Knights. He is the most senior Dragon Knight in existence and he still holds the position of Chapter Master, although he personally trained a certain Neophyte who is now Supreme Dragon Lionheart to succeed him when he is KIA or retired. He worked without rest as the Senior Drill Instructor to train the first warriors of the Dragon Knights and for all his mighty deeds, he will remain in Dragon Knight legend forever.

In 778.M41, the sudden rebellion of the Mantris system's human population sent shock waves of surprise throughout all the systems and worlds around it. Being the closest Imperial unit to possibly deal with the unexpected threat (a mere .07 lightyears away), the first warriors of the new Chapter, under the command of the key veteran Phalanx, were deployed for the first time on Mantris V. Mantris V was a dense jungle planet and also the capitol world of the entire Mantris system and the initial landings were met with surprisingly little resistance. Almost too little, concluded Phalanx.

 

For four weeks, the troops under his command were enjoying the easy planetfall while Phalanx himself was almost paranoid of a trap. His thoughts were proved right when their makeshift position was suddenly attacked during the middle of the night. The assault was fast, hard-hitting, and rather mechanized, and Phalanx quickly realized that the rebels had launched an assault, hoping to wipe out the intruders while they were off guard. However, it was apparent the rebels were not expecting Space Marines as enemies, so as quickly as the battle started, it ended. Phalanx's warriors were left dumbstruck as for one second, the air was filled with bright energy beams, the roar of bolter fire and the sound of chainswords whirling through the air, and the next second eerily quiet, the attackers dropping the hostile expression and disappearing into the shadows.

 

Phalanx was deeply angered after the sudden raid. Bent on revenge, he sent out several reconnassaince missions to locate the rebels' base or stronghold, each of them coming back empty-handed. A long two weeks after the surprise assault, a dim ray of hope cut through the thick cloud of danger. A 5-man recon squad had been sent to the initial drop zone to recover a forgotten communications array but discovered a stronghold with walls as high as 3 Dreadnoughts as as thick as a battle tank in the drop zone's place. Suspecting that the rebels were cutting them off in a line of strongholds, the squad quickly contacted Phalanx and began sending him a video feed of the base. However, the feed was cut off by disturbingly advanced jamming systems and Phalanx could only listen as the squad was slaughtered by a suspicious enemy patrol. But the squad did not die in vain. Phalanx still had the part of the video feed that got through. And so, with the enemy's intentions revealed and one of their bases located, Phalanx and his warriors starting drawing out the Plan.

 

The plan that Phalanx came up with went like this: 3 full squads of bikers equipped with teleport homers would zoom into the described zone within the enemy base. 30 Terminators would then teleport into that zone without scattering, thanks to the homers, and assault the defenders from the inside. While the defenders inside the base were busy with the Terminators that are ripping them apart, Vindicators, Predators, and other heavy tanks would bombard the wall defenders with multiple salvoes of shells. Only after the wall defenders were either completely shell-shocked or dead would the rest of the foot troops move in to finish off the remaining few and widespread enemies. Then Phalanx and his warriors would use that base as a foothold and take out the remaining enemy bases, eliminating all the rebels in the process. After making sure each and every one of his warriors had memorized the plan and the signals to be used, Phalanx ordered the first phase of the plan to be activated. At 0100 hours, the 3 Bike Squads were deployed and the assault was underway.

 

The first phases of the assault went accordingly to plan, the Bikers easily dealing with the night guards and positioning themselves with their teleport homers in the dead center of the base. A couple moments later, exactly 30 battle-brothers in Terminator armour materialized and immediately set about their phase of the plan: Assault the hostiles inside, drawing as much attention as possible. The brave brothers let out a bloodcurdling cry and launched themselves at the nearest enemy unit, flailing lightning claws and swinging mighty thunder hammers. The bikers zoomed out of the base, flicking their headlights on and off in a pattern, the signal for the tanks to begin their salvoes. The sound of cannons firing, lascannons blasting, and shells screaming through the sky filled the air and the whole of the enemy finally realized that they were under attack. The sirens wailed and the wall defenders quickly awakened to find themselves getting either blasted apart by the deadly missiles being launched into their ranks or shaken off their feet by thundering Vindicator shells pounding the very walls they were standing on. However, this is when things started to go wrong. Phalanx, a master calculator, had both underestimated the strength of the walls and had also forgotten about the night patrols that were certain to have been lurking the area. This is where the two mistakes clashed. With a rumble, the walls started to strain and heave under the sheer mass of the artillery fire directed towards them while the returning night patrols threw themselves into the fray. The reserve foot troops that were supposed to close in during one of the final phases were forced to fight, and ultimately waste strength and manpower, against frenzied rebel night patrols which included specially-trained combat-oriented humans and, quite to Phalanx's suprise, a large quantity of renegade Imperial Guardsmen. But that was not the worst of the Space Marines' problems. The walls had finally taken enough battering and began to crumble and topple, crushing many unfortunate defenders as well as some of their own Terminator-armoured battle brothers! The cry of his own brothers that were being crushed rang in Phalanx's ears. He was experienced enough in battle to know that no plan was ever perfect, but to have friendly blood spilled because of some sloppy calculation error was unacceptable.

 

As more and more returning night patrols joined the fray, Phalanx began to lose hope. Tanks were exploding, the base's walls crumbling and crushing many in the process, and it looked like victory was the rebels'. Then an earsplitting screech sounded above the war cries of both sides. An enormous FlameScale dragon had appeared from seemingly nowhere and was belching flame and striking with its tail, smashing or burning dozens of rebels at a time. It was like this, so that in a matter of minutes, the entire rebellion defense garrison of the base was put to the torch. Phalanx gaped at how quickly and efficiently the dragon had finished its work and when he looked at it again, it was laying down peacefully, washing itself. Suddenly, Phalanx heard a deep, majestic voice inside his head, talking to him. It took a while for Phalanx to realize that by means of some mysterious psychic connection, the dragon was able to communicate with him. The dragon was strangely polite, introducing itself as Phantoromus, the very last FlameScale dragon in existence. Phalanx exchanged the dragon's greeting in the same introductory fashion. Phantoromus asked what Phalanx what he was warring over on dragon territory, to which Phalanx replied that he had been cleansing the planet of a xeno incursion that had occured. The dragon nodded his understanding. However, the dragon asked for a recognition or thanks for restraining himself to attack Phalanx's warriors, as well as saving them from a shameful defeat against mere humans. Phalanx, of course, agreed, and in honour of Phantoromus, the Chapter was named the Dragon Knights.

 

Homeworld: Ferrolius

The Dragon Knights' choice for their homeworld was Ferrolius. What used to be a rocky, volcanic deathworld was turned into the mighty home of the Dragon Knights Space Marines, their fortress-monastery standing tall and menacing atop the highest peak on the planet. The rugged world was best known for the different species of dragons that the planet provided habitats for, so it was a prime candidate for the "Dragon" Knights' home as well as a valuable resource for new recruits. The recruits were selected from the fierce but civilized human tribe that was the only human settlement of the deathworld. To become a warrior in the tribe, a tribesman had to slay and bring back the skin (or head) of a ferocious SteelHeart dragon, the most dangerous species of dragon on the planet.

 

The Dragon Knights found the tribe's warrior initiation quite interesting and decided to incorporate the practice into their Chapter and it has lived on as a Chapter tradition since then. The Chapter's armour incorporated some of the planet's features as well, the red on the armour representing the fiery volcanoes and the fierce Lava dragons that made their home there. The the helmets' eye lenses also represented the rare creatures of the planet, being coloured a bright green, as all Ferrolian dragons' eyes were.

 

 

YAY! I started a new section! But that's all I have for now, I'll add more constantly.

[NightrawenII]

Phalanx is name of the IF fortress-monastery.

Using a Black Templars as the parent chapter is somewhat dubious. Look in the Octaguide for more details.

Mantris is resembling Matrix.

 

just my two halers.

[dragonknight4275]

Phalanx is name of the IF fortress-monastery.

Using a Black Templars as the parent chapter is somewhat dubious. Look in the Octaguide for more details.

Mantris is resembling Matrix.

 

just my two halers.

Sorry, I don't quite catch your point about the IF Fortress-monastery. Are you trying to say I took that name?

 

I actually play the Chapter using Black Templar rules, so they have to have SOMETHING to do with them

 

And about Mantris to Matrix, I don't quite get you there either. What is your point? What is Matrix anyway?

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Sorry, I don't quite catch your point about the IF Fortress-monastery. Are you trying to say I took that name?

- The founder was named after the Chapter Fotress of the progenitor Legion... It's just weird and/or sloppy.

 

I actually play the Chapter using Black Templar rules, so they have to have SOMETHING to do with them.

- Nope.. Can play them how you like. Just because they Crusade, doesn't mean they have anything to do with the Templars. The Mantis Warriors and Lamentors went on (Penitent) Crusades, nothing ot do with the Templars there.

[dragonknight4275]

Sorry, I don't quite catch your point about the IF Fortress-monastery. Are you trying to say I took that name?

- The founder was named after the Chapter Fotress of the progenitor Legion... It's just weird and/or sloppy.

 

I actually play the Chapter using Black Templar rules, so they have to have SOMETHING to do with them.

- Nope.. Can play them how you like. Just because they Crusade, doesn't mean they have anything to do with the Templars. The Mantis Warriors and Lamentors went on (Penitent) Crusades, nothing ot do with the Templars there.

excuse me?? Are you calling me sloppy?! Do you have a better name than what I have? Then please be kind and suggest it! And although the Imperial Fists are the Primogenitor legion doesn't mean I can't use their names. I'll also have you know that the name of the Founder had nothing to do with Imperial Fists at all. The entire Chapter doesn't have anything to do with the Imperial Fists except for being forged by a successor chapter to them. I didn't even know that the Imperial Fists had a fortress-monastery because last I checked, they had a homeworld called Terra.

 

Do you really think that I use Black Templar rules just because they Crusade? Besides, I don't believe I said anything about Crusading when I replied to your comment. I use Black Templar rules because they have some really cool things that generic codex Marines would never have access to and because everyone at my GW plays Codex Marines. I wanted something different.

 

Overall, what you are saying doesn't apply to me or my Chapter at all. It may seem like they do, but they don't. And note that I will add people who assume things about me in a negative way to my Ignored list. It's not a threat, but keep that in mind when you're calling me sloppy and/or weird. I try to avoid being harsh, but I cannot stand some things (like this) and I do try to keep away from things like them.

[Captain Juan Juarez]

If you can't listen to criticism, I'd suggest you vacate the Liber.

 

Also, if you're not going to bother to read what I type and instead make assumptions reagarding what is meant, then most likely you'll get little feedback.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

What has been said have been valid points and it looks as though all you're looking for is praise for your ideas. Saying you'll ignore (in essence, silence dissent) is a threat. A threat to making this Chapter unique and characterful. Quit taking any constructive criticism as an attack on your character when it isn't.

 

The Dragon Knights were formed in 756.M41

The latest Founding was in 738.M41.

 

The assault was fast, furious, and technologically advanced, although neither Phalanx nor his warriors could recognize the race of the attacker. As quickly as the battle started, it ended even faster. Phalanx's warriors were left dumbstruck as for one second,

These are Space Marines, not Guardsmen. Would seem pretty obvious as putting two and two together that these attackers were Eldar.

 

Suspecting that their hostile race was the Eldar

frenzied Eldar night patrols which included Harlequin troupes and Howling Banshees as well as quite a large quantity of Guardians

Looks like I was right.

 

Battles are boring in text, which is why Black Library's books suck so much. It was all I could do to read through it all. Just give a paragraph's worth of the description of an eventful battle and focus on the effects of it.

 

What is Matrix anyway?

It's a movie.

 

I actually play the Chapter using Black Templar rules, so they have to have SOMETHING to do with them

Actually you don't. The Eighth Company is the Assault Reserve in a Codex Chapter and they can easily be represented by Initiates (AM with no jump packs) or as AMs with jump packs in the BA Codex. Your choice of codex shouldn't dictate the background of your Chapter.

 

Read the Octaguide on why it is a bad idea to have your Chapter descend from the Black Templars directly, under "On specific pedantic criticisms in fluff and writing" subheading.

[Octavulg]

"Brothers! We are young and we are strong. Let us show the High Lords that they made the right choice to allow our existence! Let this be our beginning!" Chapter Founder Phalanx addressing his warriors during the Mantris V Incursion

 

I'd argue for "...that they made the right choice by creating us! This is our beginning!" Dunno why. Especially the last bit - a beginning isn't the sort of thing you propose. It just sort of happens. 'This is our beginning!' would feel a lot more like "this is the defining moment" and less like "I think this moment is important, so now it's our beginning. Right? Right.".

 

The Dragon Knights were formed in 756.M41 when a cadre of veterans from the Black Templars Chapter were given permission from the High Lords of Terra to take a fraction of the new Templar recruits. These would be the first warriors of a new Chapter. Among this cadre was the Space Marine known as Phalanx, who was (and is) a vital character in Dragon Knight history. The planet Ferrolius was designated to the fledgeling Chapter as a homeworld and also as an ideal location for the training base that the veteran cadre required to commence the training of the Neophytes that would become the first warriors of the Dragon Knights.

 

I'll quote myself (one of my favorite activities, actually):

 

You are not the [blank] Templars

Many DIYers like to have the Black Templars be their training cadre. However, there are a number of both in-universe and out-of-universe problems with this. Why would the High Lords choose the Black Templars? They're headstrong, violate the Codex, and are completely outside Imperial control, even moreso than the usual Astartes independence. The High Lords would not trust them. Nor would they be a good choice for a training cadre, precisely because of their particular quirks – they'd pass them on to the new Chapter, which would provide the High Lords with another problem chapter. Added to this, there's the fact that most people seem to simply take the opportunity to recreate the Black Templars, thus raising the issue of why the exercise was undertaken in the first place. The Black Templars as a Chapter cadre raise far, far more problems than they solve.

 

Also, Chapters do their own recruitment - the High Lords couldn't give the recruits away to someone else.

 

Chapter Master Phalanx

A Black Templars Castellan with a reputation for preferring violent charges rather than stationary firebases, the High Lords saw in Phalanx something other than a formidable warrior with a short temper. They saw in him characteristics of a great leader and he was chosen to become the first Chapter Master of the Dragon Knights. He is the most senior Dragon Knight in existence and he still holds the position of Chapter Master, although he personally trained a certain Neophyte who is now Supreme Marshal Lionheart to succeed him when he is KIA or retired. He worked without rest as the Senior Drill Instructor to train the first warriors of the Dragon Knights and for all his mighty deeds, he will remain in Dragon Knight legend forever.

 

As previously mentioned, Phalanx is already the name of the Imperial Fists Fortress-Monastery. Which, I might add, can fly. It'd be a little odd for him to be named such (especially since he's a Black Templar - the BT would seem likely to have a bunch of stories referencing it, among other things). Plus, why would he be named Phalanx in any case? If I named my child Regiment or Platoon, someone'd have me committed.

 

Lionheart also carries some problems, partly due to its-not-even-remotely-subtle links to Richard I, and partly because I'm beginning to get the feeling no one in this Chapter has an actual name instead of a collection of nouns. :D

 

[snip very long battle]

 

OK...

 

Firstly, battles are not intrinsically interesting (at least, not to people who come reading IAs). The situations they take place in can be interesting, their consequences can be interesting, and the people involved can be interesting. But the actual battles? Not so much. It's Space Marines hitting stuff - and there's already a lot of that around. People come here to read about what makes your Chapter unique - and that won't be the cut-and-thrust of their battles.

 

Furthermore, IAs aren't about battles in any case. Read the GW ones - battles are described very, very briefly. What matters is the consequences of the battle. IAs are overviews of a Chapter's entire history - no battle is sufficiently important to rate more than a paragraph. Read IA BA or IA IF - the Siege of Terra takes up a few (very) short paragraphs.

 

An IA is supposed to explain who your Chapter is. Battles are one of the worst methods for doing that, and long, very detailed battles the worst of those. Especially since you launch straight into it, without establishing enough of the Chapter's character or of any of the individual marines' character for us to give a damn about them.

 

Also, giving the dragon a type before introducing them is entirely meaningless.

 

And that's leaving aside the bit about how Marines+Dragons has been done more than a few times before, and tends to fall apart 'neath its requirement for even more suspension of disbelief than Space Marines normally require.

 

excuse me?? Are you calling me sloppy?! Do you have a better name than what I have? Then please be kind and suggest it! And although the Imperial Fists are the Primogenitor legion doesn't mean I can't use their names. I'll also have you know that the name of the Founder had nothing to do with Imperial Fists at all. The entire Chapter doesn't have anything to do with the Imperial Fists except for being forged by a successor chapter to them. I didn't even know that the Imperial Fists had a fortress-monastery because last I checked, they had a homeworld called Terra.

 

There is a difference between calling what you did sloppy and calling you sloppy. Honest. If you can't separate your personal sense of self-worth from what you write, I strongly suggest you go somewhere else. People here expect that you are trying to improve your work, and will act accordingly - and that will include telling you that you are sloppy, wrong, spelling badly, writing badly, writing too much, not writing enough, have stupid names, have a stupid concept, or can't write a coherent plot to save your life. Sometimes they'll be right. Sometimes they'll be wrong. But covering your ears and yelling about how everyone's mean is neither productive nor polite. As Juan said, if you are unprepared for criticism, you will find the Liber Astartes an unpleasant place to visit.

 

The Imperial Fists are the only Chapter with the right to recruit on Terra, and it is (IIRC) technically their home world. However, they are based on the Phalanx, a giant spaceship. Furthermore, a Fortress-Monastery usually goes on a home-world, so being based on Terra would be no obstacle to them having one.

 

In regard to a better name...the BT tend to draw from Germanic influences for their naming patterns - find a nice, tough, German word that means something violent. There are plenty.

 

Do you really think that I use Black Templar rules just because they Crusade? Besides, I don't believe I said anything about Crusading when I replied to your comment. I use Black Templar rules because they have some really cool things that generic codex Marines would never have access to and because everyone at my GW plays Codex Marines. I wanted something different.

 

Which doesn't invalidate his point that you don't need to be even vaguely related to the BT to use their rules.

 

Overall, what you are saying doesn't apply to me or my Chapter at all. It may seem like they do, but they don't. And note that I will add people who assume things about me in a negative way to my Ignored list. It's not a threat, but keep that in mind when you're calling me sloppy and/or weird. I try to avoid being harsh, but I cannot stand some things (like this) and I do try to keep away from things like them.

 

I'll quote myself again. It's really a lot of fun.

 

"But you are not a unique and beautiful flower who deserves to be protected from the world. You are writing about a universe where millions are routinely slaughtered by ravening horrors from a dimension inconceivable to man - you should have a certain strength of character by now. Stiffen your spine, bite your lip, and try not to take it personally. Even if people are telling you everything about your IA is wrong, remain calm and collected. Be polite to them. Feel free to point out inconsistencies in their logic, of course, but do not stick your fingers in your ears and start singing "I'm So Lonely" just yet.

 

At minimum, every person on Liber knows what they, personally, hate to see in an IA, and generally speaking, they post because they feel this IA has redeeming qualities that can be improved. You posted your IA here in the hopes of making it better and finding help with the development of your ideas (OK, so you posted it to show off how awesome you are and have people praise you, just like everyone else did. Fixing it to their standards is the quickest route to that). When you ask for a response, you will often get one. Take advantage of it. Find out what they object to. Find out why. Consider their opinions objectively - are they right? If you saw this in someone else's IA, would you agree with it? Do not let your affection for your ideas blind you to their flaws. These opinions are being offered because the people in question think that your IA can be improved. It is important to listen to them and treat them with respect."

 

The last line is my favorite.

 

Anyway, there's not really that much here once you take out the battle details, so I guess I'm done for now.

 

EDIT:

 

Ninja'ed by Thrawn. But now you don't have to actually look it up! :D

[dragonknight4275]

"Brothers! We are young and we are strong. Let us show the High Lords that they made the right choice to allow our existence! Let this be our beginning!" Chapter Founder Phalanx addressing his warriors during the Mantris V Incursion

 

I'd argue for "...that they made the right choice by creating us! This is our beginning!" Dunno why. Especially the last bit - a beginning isn't the sort of thing you propose. It just sort of happens. 'This is our beginning!' would feel a lot more like "this is the defining moment" and less like "I think this moment is important, so now it's our beginning. Right? Right.".

 

The Dragon Knights were formed in 756.M41 when a cadre of veterans from the Black Templars Chapter were given permission from the High Lords of Terra to take a fraction of the new Templar recruits. These would be the first warriors of a new Chapter. Among this cadre was the Space Marine known as Phalanx, who was (and is) a vital character in Dragon Knight history. The planet Ferrolius was designated to the fledgeling Chapter as a homeworld and also as an ideal location for the training base that the veteran cadre required to commence the training of the Neophytes that would become the first warriors of the Dragon Knights.

 

I'll quote myself (one of my favorite activities, actually):

 

You are not the [blank] Templars

Many DIYers like to have the Black Templars be their training cadre. However, there are a number of both in-universe and out-of-universe problems with this. Why would the High Lords choose the Black Templars? They're headstrong, violate the Codex, and are completely outside Imperial control, even moreso than the usual Astartes independence. The High Lords would not trust them. Nor would they be a good choice for a training cadre, precisely because of their particular quirks – they'd pass them on to the new Chapter, which would provide the High Lords with another problem chapter. Added to this, there's the fact that most people seem to simply take the opportunity to recreate the Black Templars, thus raising the issue of why the exercise was undertaken in the first place. The Black Templars as a Chapter cadre raise far, far more problems than they solve.

 

Also, Chapters do their own recruitment - the High Lords couldn't give the recruits away to someone else.

 

Chapter Master Phalanx

A Black Templars Castellan with a reputation for preferring violent charges rather than stationary firebases, the High Lords saw in Phalanx something other than a formidable warrior with a short temper. They saw in him characteristics of a great leader and he was chosen to become the first Chapter Master of the Dragon Knights. He is the most senior Dragon Knight in existence and he still holds the position of Chapter Master, although he personally trained a certain Neophyte who is now Supreme Marshal Lionheart to succeed him when he is KIA or retired. He worked without rest as the Senior Drill Instructor to train the first warriors of the Dragon Knights and for all his mighty deeds, he will remain in Dragon Knight legend forever.

 

As previously mentioned, Phalanx is already the name of the Imperial Fists Fortress-Monastery. Which, I might add, can fly. It'd be a little odd for him to be named such (especially since he's a Black Templar - the BT would seem likely to have a bunch of stories referencing it, among other things). Plus, why would he be named Phalanx in any case? If I named my child Regiment or Platoon, someone'd have me committed.

 

Lionheart also carries some problems, partly due to its-not-even-remotely-subtle links to Richard I, and partly because I'm beginning to get the feeling no one in this Chapter has an actual name instead of a collection of nouns. :)

 

[snip very long battle]

 

OK...

 

Firstly, battles are not intrinsically interesting (at least, not to people who come reading IAs). The situations they take place in can be interesting, their consequences can be interesting, and the people involved can be interesting. But the actual battles? Not so much. It's Space Marines hitting stuff - and there's already a lot of that around. People come here to read about what makes your Chapter unique - and that won't be the cut-and-thrust of their battles.

 

Furthermore, IAs aren't about battles in any case. Read the GW ones - battles are described very, very briefly. What matters is the consequences of the battle. IAs are overviews of a Chapter's entire history - no battle is sufficiently important to rate more than a paragraph. Read IA BA or IA IF - the Siege of Terra takes up a few (very) short paragraphs.

 

An IA is supposed to explain who your Chapter is. Battles are one of the worst methods for doing that, and long, very detailed battles the worst of those. Especially since you launch straight into it, without establishing enough of the Chapter's character or of any of the individual marines' character for us to give a damn about them.

 

Also, giving the dragon a type before introducing them is entirely meaningless.

 

And that's leaving aside the bit about how Marines+Dragons has been done more than a few times before, and tends to fall apart 'neath its requirement for even more suspension of disbelief than Space Marines normally require.

 

excuse me?? Are you calling me sloppy?! Do you have a better name than what I have? Then please be kind and suggest it! And although the Imperial Fists are the Primogenitor legion doesn't mean I can't use their names. I'll also have you know that the name of the Founder had nothing to do with Imperial Fists at all. The entire Chapter doesn't have anything to do with the Imperial Fists except for being forged by a successor chapter to them. I didn't even know that the Imperial Fists had a fortress-monastery because last I checked, they had a homeworld called Terra.

 

There is a difference between calling what you did sloppy and calling you sloppy. Honest. If you can't separate your personal sense of self-worth from what you write, I strongly suggest you go somewhere else. People here expect that you are trying to improve your work, and will act accordingly - and that will include telling you that you are sloppy, wrong, spelling badly, writing badly, writing too much, not writing enough, have stupid names, have a stupid concept, or can't write a coherent plot to save your life. Sometimes they'll be right. Sometimes they'll be wrong. But covering your ears and yelling about how everyone's mean is neither productive nor polite. As Juan said, if you are unprepared for criticism, you will find the Liber Astartes an unpleasant place to visit.

 

The Imperial Fists are the only Chapter with the right to recruit on Terra, and it is (IIRC) technically their home world. However, they are based on the Phalanx, a giant spaceship. Furthermore, a Fortress-Monastery usually goes on a home-world, so being based on Terra would be no obstacle to them having one.

 

In regard to a better name...the BT tend to draw from Germanic influences for their naming patterns - find a nice, tough, German word that means something violent. There are plenty.

 

Do you really think that I use Black Templar rules just because they Crusade? Besides, I don't believe I said anything about Crusading when I replied to your comment. I use Black Templar rules because they have some really cool things that generic codex Marines would never have access to and because everyone at my GW plays Codex Marines. I wanted something different.

 

Which doesn't invalidate his point that you don't need to be even vaguely related to the BT to use their rules.

 

Overall, what you are saying doesn't apply to me or my Chapter at all. It may seem like they do, but they don't. And note that I will add people who assume things about me in a negative way to my Ignored list. It's not a threat, but keep that in mind when you're calling me sloppy and/or weird. I try to avoid being harsh, but I cannot stand some things (like this) and I do try to keep away from things like them.

 

I'll quote myself again. It's really a lot of fun.

 

"But you are not a unique and beautiful flower who deserves to be protected from the world. You are writing about a universe where millions are routinely slaughtered by ravening horrors from a dimension inconceivable to man - you should have a certain strength of character by now. Stiffen your spine, bite your lip, and try not to take it personally. Even if people are telling you everything about your IA is wrong, remain calm and collected. Be polite to them. Feel free to point out inconsistencies in their logic, of course, but do not stick your fingers in your ears and start singing "I'm So Lonely" just yet.

 

At minimum, every person on Liber knows what they, personally, hate to see in an IA, and generally speaking, they post because they feel this IA has redeeming qualities that can be improved. You posted your IA here in the hopes of making it better and finding help with the development of your ideas (OK, so you posted it to show off how awesome you are and have people praise you, just like everyone else did. Fixing it to their standards is the quickest route to that). When you ask for a response, you will often get one. Take advantage of it. Find out what they object to. Find out why. Consider their opinions objectively - are they right? If you saw this in someone else's IA, would you agree with it? Do not let your affection for your ideas blind you to their flaws. These opinions are being offered because the people in question think that your IA can be improved. It is important to listen to them and treat them with respect."

 

The last line is my favorite.

 

Anyway, there's not really that much here once you take out the battle details, so I guess I'm done for now.

 

EDIT:

 

Ninja'ed by Thrawn. But now you don't have to actually look it up! ;)

thanks for all the advice, I have to admit, it does seem fun to quote yourself :D I understand that I didn't act correctly (don't take that as one of those cheesy movie sayings, this time I mean it) responding to one of the "critics" and I will search redemption from him.

 

On the name matter, can you possibly give me some good ideas or at least put me on the right path? I've never really been good at names, I usually find myself searching on baby name sites for them :)

[Octavulg]

thanks for all the advice, I have to admit, it does seem fun to quote yourself

 

That's most of the reason I wrote a guide.

 

On the name matter, can you possibly give me some good ideas or at least put me on the right path? I've never really been good at names, I usually find myself searching on baby name sites for them biggrin.gif

 

Crusader Kings. It's a strategy game set in the Middle Ages. Fun and a good source of names.

 

Of course, that may not be practical. In that case, I'd recommend digging through Wikipedia for obscure historical figures. Start here with the House of Este, and then wander through arcane European medieval genealogy for a while. Something should pop out.

 

Try and make sure they're not too famous - for example, Barbarossa is too well known.

[dragonknight4275]

This is a reply to Grand Admiral Thrawn's response. Unless you are him, you don't have to pay this much mind.

 

What has been said have been valid points and it looks as though all you're looking for is praise for your ideas. Saying you'll ignore (in essence, silence dissent) is a threat. A threat to making this Chapter unique and characterful. Quit taking any constructive criticism as an attack on your character when it isn't.

I would accept it perfectly well if it weren't for the name-calling. I hardly think calling someone sloppy and weird is constructive, don't you agree?

 

The latest Founding was in 738.M41.

Oh. I'll change that when time permits.

 

These are Space Marines, not Guardsmen. Would seem pretty obvious as putting two and two together that these attackers were Eldar.

might have been Tau........oh yeah, Tau aren't that fast or furious..........

 

Looks like I was right.

yep, you were. Should I change it or something?

 

Battles are boring in text, which is why Black Library's books suck so much. It was all I could do to read through it all. Just give a paragraph's worth of the description of an eventful battle and focus on the effects of it.

I'll see to that. I was thinking that my description was too long as well.............

 

Actually you don't. The Eighth Company is the Assault Reserve in a Codex Chapter and they can easily be represented by Initiates (AM with no jump packs) or as AMs with jump packs in the BA Codex. Your choice of codex shouldn't dictate the background of your Chapter.

Still, I like using Black Templar rules. I enjoyed standard Templars a lot and I wanted them to influence the Chapter in one way or another. Say, do you have any better ideas than mine on how to do that?

 

Read the ... on why it is a bad idea to have your Chapter descend from the Black Templars directly, under "On specific pedantic criticisms in fluff and writing" subheading.

I see.......well, my response to this is pretty much the same as the one above. Also, the fact that using a Codex Chapter as a Primogenitor legion will force me to use the generic codex, which everyone at my GW plays. I kinda want a change. Again, any ideas on how to better incorporate some BT stuff into my Chapter?

 

Thank you for all the advice. I will look to revise the IA soon with your (valid) criticism. Thanks again.

[Octavulg]

I would accept it perfectly well if it weren't for the name-calling. I hardly think calling someone sloppy and weird is constructive, don't you agree?

 

He called what you did sloppy and/or weird.

 

There is a difference.

 

And I'll 100% support him on weird. It would be weird. A Captain named Macragge would be weird, too.

 

Still, I like using Black Templar rules. I enjoyed standard Templars a lot and I wanted them to influence the Chapter in one way or another. Say, do you have any better ideas than mine on how to do that?

 

Another Imperial Fists successor who admires some of the Templar's zeal, so takes a few of the quirks. Another way would be to have them actually reject the zealotry and disobedience of the Templars - making their similar doctrines nice and ironic.

 

Another option is simply a little bit of parallel evolution (which is the idea I'd prefer, honestly). The Imperial Fists produced the Templars once, they could do it again - just make sure to make them different enough for it to be interesting. Then mention your Chapter's occasional co-operation with Black Templar crusades, and their admiration for the BT's fervor.

 

I see.......well, my response to this is pretty much the same as the one above. Also, the fact that using a Codex Chapter as a Primogenitor legion will force me to use the generic codex, which everyone at my GW plays. I kinda want a change. Again, any ideas on how to better incorporate some BT stuff into my Chapter?

 

There's nothing in the Templar Codex that can't pass for Codex adherence if you squint. I mean, the BA and DA are still mostly Codex. The White Scars are Codex. The BT Codex can be, too. A weird way of deploying Scouts is hardly a real divergence. Crazy vows are just crazy vows.

 

The fact that they have a Codex at all is really quite amazing. You could fit them into C:SM with about five seconds of effort. Hell, they already do the stupid mandatory special character thing which has become so common...

 

I honestly have no idea why they weren't lumped in...

[dragonknight4275]

hello, thank you for looking over my Chapter's IA, for those of you who have been giving me good advice since the beginning, I have completely changed the Mantris V Incursion into the Mantris V Rebellion. I did this partly to shorten the (possibly very boring) battle and also to incorporate some of the feedback I've been getting. Thank you and keep the criticism coming!