Iron Hands player of old

[tksolway]

I played Iron Hands back in the days of Third Edition. I have played a few games with them using the SM codex and was not impressed by my options. Then someone told me that the Wolves get an HQ dread, and Termies to lead squads. My first reaction was to buy the codex and see if I could build a better Iron Hands army with it.

 

Obviously my army won't be the tweaked out monster that it could be, because I want some squads to be led by termies, and I have already chosen my HQ unit. But I am interested in any wisdom the wolves of the forum could provide on overall army choices. I have a preliminary army list posted here:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=199759

 

but I would love to know if there is anything I should know that isn't obvious to non-wolves player.

[Evilbob]

Looks to fit Iron Hands pretty good. Usually chaos players using our dex ticks me off, but I do love Iron Warriors and feel really sad that they got cast off in the new CSM dex.

[08ak1]

Perhaps a good choice would be a GH unit with 2 Melta and a Power fist (alternatively you could break out a power armored WG to give them a powerfist/combi melta but i see your using a unit of WG and already have 10 and no other Elite choices available so it would have to come from your unit of WG.) Maybe drop pod them too, giving you a mid game anti tank/objective holder unit.

 

maybe a Vindicator

 

Long fangs would of course be good too but you already have one unit of em and if your expanding to 2k points investing in more troop choices is a good idea usually though your pretty decent right now with 3 units.

[Beef]

Hell you could use the stats of TW as half marine half machine constructs. That would be coolm kinda like semi dreds (IH versions of killer kans)

[Logan230]

First I suggest dropping the jumpers, 5 is not enough and without a leash they can get baited and killed. If you want cheap heavies, I suggest LS Typhoons. Also if you want to drop pod something, I suggest GHs or dreads, blood claws only hit stuff, they don't. Shoot very well. Put 14 bloodclaws in a LRC with a Priest and WG sarge if you really want them. That's my opinion. I use Bjorn in my 2k tourney list and he is great.

[tksolway]

Perhaps a good choice would be a GH unit with 2 Melta and a Power fist (alternatively you could break out a power armored WG to give them a powerfist/combi melta but i see your using a unit of WG and already have 10 and no other Elite choices available so it would have to come from your unit of WG.) Maybe drop pod them too, giving you a mid game anti tank/objective holder unit.

 

maybe a Vindicator

 

Long fangs would of course be good too but you already have one unit of em and if your expanding to 2k points investing in more troop choices is a good idea usually though your pretty decent right now with 3 units.

 

 

I like the idea of switching my BCs for GH with meltagun and WG combi-melta/Pf, but I've been told that if I have a single Drop pod it has to come in the first turn (in another thread)

[Silverwolf]

When drop podding, 50% of your Drop Pods (rounding up) come in first turn.

 

So if you take 3 pods, 2 come in on first turn and 1 comes in as reserves. If you take 1 pod, it drops in first turn. This can acctually be quite good if your taking say a single tank-hunting dread (M.Melta/Las & CC.Arm/Missiles). It can be placed on the flank of the enemy somewhere, behind it's nice little AV12 shield, and LOS harrass enemy armour / monstrous creatures. This can provide a significant distraction from your shock troops that are moving across the field at the enemy. Large battles, take 3 pods, with say 2 Dreads, and a WG Termie team or Grey Hunters, drop both dreads turn one to harass and distract, then the Termies/Grey Hunters where they're needed as they become available.

 

Never bring B.Claws in via pod though, you can only run 10, 9 if you want a leash on them, and they're useless for shooting. There's two ways I've seen to field B.Claws... 1x 15man pack, with a HQ, in an LRC. OR 2x 15man packs, with HQs, running behind 2x 15strong packs of Fenrisian Wolves (Chaos Hounds for you?). 30 Blood Claws with 4+ invuls, behind 30 Fenrisian Wolves CAN be quite nasty, it's a lot of bodies to shoot at, and a lot of attacks once they get to you :lol:. The Wolves tie units up early, with the Blood Claws then coming in behind next turn to clean up.

[Grey Mage]

I played Iron Hands back in the days of Third Edition. I have played a few games with them using the SM codex and was not impressed by my options. Then someone told me that the Wolves get an HQ dread, and Termies to lead squads. My first reaction was to buy the codex and see if I could build a better Iron Hands army with it.

....

but I would love to know if there is anything I should know that isn't obvious to non-wolves player.

Bloodclaws arent a very good choice for an Iron Hands army- theres no good reason for the lesser WS/BS, beserk charge, or headstrong rules. Its just not how IHs operate. Definitely a unit to avoid. Along the same lines- skyclaws and swiftclaws for the same reasons.

 

TWC and Fenrisian Wolves are also hard ones to explain, and Id just avoid them in general. Experianced scouts isnt bad though.

 

Id also keep the "Devastator" squads to 5 man, as again, IH devastators tend to only have 4 heavy weapons in a squad.

 

So, seeing your list Id drop all the bloodclaws, one long fang, and get yourself another LF squad and another GH squad with meltaguns, either DPing or Rhino-moving. Of course, if its rhinos you could drop the terminator that would have led them.

[Barn]

This topic comes up fairly often on the Aussie boards, the most recent list is here.

 

I think that also has a modeling diary linked for inspiration ;)

[tksolway]

Thanks everyone for the help. I have altered my list based on a lot of the comments. The thing that really makes it difficult is the lack of transport for the Termie led squads. Has anyone ever tried a Marching army of SW based upon their couterattack ability? It seems that since the GH are better shooters than anything else (especially with termie help) that having a limited number of transported troops backed up by foot sloggers might work? I haven't tried it yet, and I know I would be more vulnerable to heavy weapons, but I was wondering if anyone else had the same idea.

[Tograth]

Ive recently been experimenting with footslogging lists, and in general they dont seem to be very strong.

 

the biggest thing about footslogging lists is that you need as many bodies as possible on the table, and you need to go all footslogging if you are going to be doing it at all. in general, I've managed to cram about 70 marines in to a 1750 list. I've a good example list below. One thing with footslogging lists is that they die very easily, and imperial guard will really ruin your day. In a footslogging list, you want to avoid bloodclaws, even with a wolf priest handler, as they are simply too easy to kill, as the biggest problem with a footslogging list is that you are in general the one who is going to get charged.

 

1750 footslogging list:

 

rune priest - living lightning, tempests wrath, chooser

rune priest - living lightning, storm caller, chooser, bolter

 

3 wolf guard - each with combimelta / powerfist

5 wolf scouts - mark of the wulfen, meltagun

lone wolf - TDA, thunderhammer, storm shield

 

10 grey hunters - 2x melta, mark of the wulfen

10 grey hunters - 2x melta, mark of the wulfen

10 grey hunters - 2x melta, mark of the wulfen, wolf standard, power fist

10 grey hunters - 2x plasma

 

6 longfangs - 2x lascannon, 3x missile launcher

6 longfangs - 2x lascannon, 3x missile launcher

6 longfangs - 2x lascannon, 3x missile launcher

 

total: 1749 points, 69 models, 43 troops models, and 15 heavy weapons.

 

each of the wolf guard goes into one of the melta grey hunter squads. longfangs you deploy spread out a bit, to ensure that regardless of where your opponent deploys you'll still have a shot at something.

 

you move the GH squads up first turn, running if needs be. second turn you use your fangs to pop the nastiest vehicles transport and then you use the plasma squad to dakka them to death.

 

one thing to remember when deploying is to deploy in terrain if at all possible and to deploy spread out. the biggest threat to you is high strength blast weapons.

[Natanael]

I'm gonna try a foot-slogging force backed up by 3 pods filled with terminators, "Iron Hands-style". Got a game friday so I'm gonna try to make a list until then. Gonna be up against daemons tough, so might not be the best opponent to try it against.

 

- Natanael

[tksolway]

I think I will try and come up with a footslogging list as well, to try if I get the chance. I'll have to do the math and make up a list. It will have dreadnoughts and termie sgts though, might not end up having enough bodies, we'll see.

[Skirax]

I posted a thread on this once, people seemed to go for it. I wouldn't mind if you used it against me, hell if you were creative enough to call 'Sagas' something else to get the rules, I'd WANT to play you.

 

Edit: Oh, and @Grey Mage, if he has a way of passing off Fenrisian/Thunder Wolves as serf-beasts sent by the Mechanicum to aid them, that would be fine, wouldn't it?

[rodgambit]

I thought about doing something similar with my extra AoBR models since I wanted all my SW's to be more custom built from the SW boxes. If I went with IH's i'd probably go with Bjorn as the Dread HQ or Logan Grimnar. I had converted a a termi model by adding a servo harness and gave it a tech marine power axe and used it as a counts as logan. Then i'd probably go with a termi pack leader per squad, run a lot of plasma and melta in my troops. I like those archo flagelent models or something similar to act as fen wolves. Thunder hammers seem like a cool option on the pack leaders and then maybe some more dreads or heavy tanks for long range fire support. I put it on the back burner since I already have wolves and BA, but I've always had a soft spot for IH's.