SM with GK allies

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

So i dont have the DH codex yet but in looking through various stratigies ive discovered that GK forces work best when they are rapidly deployed, foot slogging GK arent good. So that half is kind of ok but im not sure how to use them in conjunction with a normal SM army. Im going to give a basic outline of what i want in my army and any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

What I think im going for is to join the GM with the terminators and deep strike that unit, the legion of the damned and the GK marines to tear up the enemy while the 2 tactical squads move up to take objectives protected in the land raiders. Now ive heard some controversy about if im aloud to use drop pods or not in a SM army with GK allies, if i am then the ven dread will use one to get into the enemy and if not then i'll either drop him for something else or give him a las cannon for tank killyness. That just leaves the chaplain, if i can rules wise ill have him deploy via deepstrike with the legion of the damned (he'll have terminator armor) and if not he'll be in power armor and ill put him in one of the tactical squads (though it seems like that would be a waste for him).

 

NOTE: this is minus unit options but is probably for a 2000 pt force

 

HQ-

 

Grey Knights Grand Master

 

Chaplain possibly in TDA

 

Elites-

 

Grey Knights Terminator squad

 

Venerable Dreadnought

 

Legion of the damned

 

Troops-

 

2 Tactical squads

 

Fast Attack-

 

Grey Knights squad

 

Heavy Support-

 

either 2 standard Land Raiders

or

2 Land Raider Crusaders

[jeffersonian000]

You can take a squad of GKT as a retinue for the GM, allowing you to spend only one FoC slot on them (HQ). This frees up an Elite slot for another GKT squad if you want, or another elite SM unit.

 

SJ

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Well im planning on converting all of my grey knights units so that they are all plastic and its gonna get kind of expensive but I'll definitly take the GKT squad as a retinue instead of an elite choice, i just dont know if I'll take another GKT in my elite slot.

 

Can anyone help me with the delimas of having a drop pod for my dread in the army? And also if my chaplain has TDA will he be able to deep strike into combat with the legion of the damned? To me it seems like it would be no different if he joined a TDA squad when they teleported in BUT apart of me is saying that he cant because TDA models can only deep strike through teleportation and the legion deep strikes through a special ability?

 

Also any comment on how my tactic would work?

[Justicar Valius]

Take that GK squad out of Fast attack NOW!

 

I wouldn't take the PAGK right now really. Sternguard would be a lot better.

 

Also seconding the GKT as retinue in case you couldn't tell with the Sternguard selection.

 

Also, this list seems a bit naff in general. Legion of the damned out. Chaplain should go out. Replace with somthing better or give him an assault squad and jumpakc.

 

Also wait one week, either DE or GK are going to be confirmed according to some sources. You don't want to start a project to find you can no longer ally in GK.

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Take that GK squad out of Fast attack NOW!

 

Also, this list seems a bit naff in general. Legion of the damned out. Chaplain should go out. Replace with somthing better or give him an assault squad and jumpakc.

 

Also wait one week, either DE or GK are going to be confirmed according to some sources. You don't want to start a project to find you can no longer ally in GK.

 

Whats wrong with the GK squad as fast attack or my chaplain and legion of the damned? And im not sure what naff means

 

And for the waiting one week thing i wouldent actually be starting this army for awhile. I already have the 2 tactical squads, the ven dread and my land raiders from my SM army so technicly its already started.

[Justicar Valius]

Legion of the damned are really bad. Chaplain got hit with the nerf bat very, very hard.

 

PAGK aren't worth the points as it is, losing the scoring status for deepstrike makes them even less worth it.

 

Naff means bad but in a less severe way, especially when it is a bit naff.

 

Not enough troops for 2000 points. Look if you think it will do well by all means it's your stuff. Heck I don't even own codex:SM just I think i could do ok against this with pure DH, which is a worry.

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

I was just wondering why you suggested to get rid of them as they have worked pretty well for me in my normal SM army (the chaplain and LoD). But based off of your suggestions and since im moving the GK terminators to a retinue, if i dropped the LotD that would leave me with 2 open elites choices which i could replace with suggested sterngaurd and if i dropped the chaplain and took kantor i would have 4 scoring units instead of the 2.

 

And im curious as to what exactly makes sterngaurd better than LotD? they have the same stats save that LotD are leadership 10. The only thing i can see for them being better is they are cheaper and have better weapon options for the normal marines compared to the options available to LotD marines. Are the 3++ saves or the ability to deepstrike onto an objective without a drop pod (and i know there is always a risk of scattering but to me the risk is acceptable) as well as being fearless and Ld 10 not worth it?

 

Im not trying to sound like im arguing or anything im just curious because i feild 2 units of legion in my normal SM army and they do well 80% of the time. Though i wont argue that i need more scoring units

[Justicar Valius]

Just the versatility of sternguard. The ammo is imense. I think they have an AP3 ammo, a 2+ poisoned ammo and other awseome stuff. combi meltas make them a real threat and that 3++ invulnerable while good does not outweigh the ammo IMHO. Also I've faced legion once. 2 incinerators, 'nuff said :lol:

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Yes they have the various ammos that can come in handy IF the right situation arises to use them and the legion are aloud to have melta weapons (though admitidly not as many as sterngaurd). I think im just kind of biased towards using legion as i use them quiet a bit in my normal army and they always work quiet well especially when i use them to hunt tanks or monstrous creatures or as a tar pit unit. And when backed up by my assault squad or dreadnought (which in my normal list has a drop pod) they survive combats quiet well. And as no one in my gaming club there arent any GK units (besides potentially mine) so i dont have to worry about incinerators. I think what i will do is try taking the 2 sterngaurd in my list and if i dont like how it works out ill put my legion back in. It wont be to hard as my entire army is going to be GK themed im going to convert "veteran" grey knights which i could use to represent either or (of course giving them the proper war gear)

 

Whats the deal with drop pods? am i allowed to have them in my Sm army if i have Gk allies?

 

And does this seem a little better?

 

HQ-

Grey Knight Grand Master with terminator retinue

 

Pedro Kantor

 

Elites-

Venerable Dreadnought (cc kit if drop pod able, tk kit if not)

 

2 Sterngaurd with drop pod (mounted in land raiders if drop pods are unable)

 

Troops-

2 Tactical squads (with rhinos but will use land raiders if drop pods are allowed)

 

Fast attack-

Land Speeder squadron (probably tank hunters)

 

Heavy Support-

2 Land Raiders

[DerekLee688]

There's always a target for sternguard. The only three ammo's I'd use are the AP:4, 2+ poison/AP:6, and the cover ignoring ones. The AP:3 rounds are only S:4, ten guys firing these twice at 25pts. each arn't good. If you could put Feel no Pain on them like Blood Angels, then that may work.

 

I personaly think PAGK are cool, but serve the opposite role of Sternguard. PAGK are geared for melee with range; their weapons are assault with true grit. Sternguard are geared for ranged with melee; their weapons are rapid fire with slots for special/heavy weapons.

 

I just wish I could take PAGK as manditory troops and then Hevies from C:SM, but that's more of a personal fault than a tactical one. 2000+pts. is definatly where the combination shines.

[Chengar Qordath]

Whats the deal with drop pods? am i allowed to have them in my Sm army if i have Gk allies?

Yes. There is nothing the ally rules that disallows drop pods.

 

The list looks pretty solid to me, though the wargear/weapon choices need to be fleshed out.

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Whats the deal with drop pods? am i allowed to have them in my Sm army if i have Gk allies?

Yes. There is nothing the ally rules that disallows drop pods.

 

The list looks pretty solid to me, though the wargear/weapon choices need to be fleshed out.

 

Right but i need to get the DH codex for my GKs, my dreadnought will have either 2 heavy flamers or a heavy flamer and keep the multi melta, im not to sure how to kit out the sterngaurd so suggestions are welcome. My tactical squads each have a power sword sergeant, a missle launcher and a flamer. Im thinking about taking 3 individual land sppeders instead of a squadron and each will have a multi melta and a havey flamer for versitility. The land raiders however ive never feilded so i dont know how to kit thim best. And im debating between either a LRC or a normal LR, im kind of leaning with a normal one because the las cannons will give me some more tank hunting ability.

[Hellios]

Whats the deal with drop pods? am i allowed to have them in my Sm army if i have Gk allies?

Yes. There is nothing the ally rules that disallows drop pods.

 

The list looks pretty solid to me, though the wargear/weapon choices need to be fleshed out.

 

Right but i need to get the DH codex for my GKs, my dreadnought will have either 2 heavy flamers or a heavy flamer and keep the multi melta, im not to sure how to kit out the sterngaurd so suggestions are welcome. My tactical squads each have a power sword sergeant, a missle launcher and a flamer. Im thinking about taking 3 individual land sppeders instead of a squadron and each will have a multi melta and a havey flamer for versitility. The land raiders however ive never feilded so i dont know how to kit thim best. And im debating between either a LRC or a normal LR, im kind of leaning with a normal one because the las cannons will give me some more tank hunting ability.

 

Take a powerfist... on the sgt... just in case... give people combi-meltas (you could mix plasmas but I like to make sure tanks are dead).... and you could stick a heavy-flamer/flamer or two in for giggles if you really wanted. You already have your HQs but if you ever decide to mess around with your list Lysander (for bolter drill) and a Librarian with Null zone can also be useful sitting in with the sternguard as they drop in...

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Whats the deal with drop pods? am i allowed to have them in my Sm army if i have Gk allies?

Yes. There is nothing the ally rules that disallows drop pods.

 

The list looks pretty solid to me, though the wargear/weapon choices need to be fleshed out.

 

Right but i'll actually post all the details of my list once i get the DH codex. Itl be fairly balanced though with each unit being able to handle horse and tanks except for the dread whos going to be cc oriented and my land raiders who will be tank hunters. I am actually not sure how to kit sterngaurd, any idea?

 

And i have no clue why i posted this twice. Please ignore

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Take a powerfist... on the sgt... just in case... give people combi-meltas (you could mix plasmas but I like to make sure tanks are dead).... and you could stick a heavy-flamer/flamer or two in for giggles if you really wanted. You already have your HQs but if you ever decide to mess around with your list Lysander (for bolter drill) and a Librarian with Null zone can also be useful sitting in with the sternguard as they drop in...

 

Ok so i take it these suggestions are given for a 10 man squad. I think ill follow what u suggested because it dosent sound bad. Everyone with combi meltas except for 2 with heavy flamers and then a power fist with the sergeant. But actually why do i need the powerfist if i have 7 combi meltas?

[thade]

Just one comment from me: why are you putting the Chaplain into TDA?

 

If your goal is to Deep Strike him with a unit of terminators, then that's a fine reason...though I recommend against Deep Striking in general when a Drop Pod is not involved.

 

Otherwise, the Chaplain has a 3+/4++ already, so the extra hunk of points to boost to a 2+/4++ and lose the ability to perform Sweeping Advances. Not worthwhile, in my opinion; points that can be spent elsewhere.