Commander Dante

[Brother Nathan]

since rising up from the rage mepheson has always in the fluff been the most powerful libarian in the imperium. whilst tigerus just knows the most. elderad, he died didnt he? and is an eldar anyway.. Arihman, hes bound to know more and be around mephs power withsocery, but phsyically is a whimp, all be it a wimp with a 4+ inv but still... and hes in the warp and not the imperium.

[Battleborn Five0]

A more Blood Angels-themed God of War might be the option to choose whether your squads fail or succeed their Red Thirst test.

 

Also, is there anyone in the world who doesn't think he should've had Eternal Warrior? Apart from Ward, of course.

 

Can I get an Amen!?

[Ironfather_cogface]

Eternal Warrior: Ok, i can understand that yes, he is an embodiment of a warrior of the ages and i also understand that maybe he is just past his time (can i add special rule- "Its them Darn Loud Kids from down the block..." vs Noise Marines?) and doesn't quite have the stomach for it all anymore?

 

Fearless: Dante is over a millenium old and is likely to avoid reckless behaviour at this age. he is a decisive, cautious and exacting commander, not a blood hungry lunatic or a mindless zealot. And as a marine, fearless really doesnt mean much- if Dante retreats, he's probably just stepping back to reload...

 

His arrival via deep-strike, (not needing to scatter and all) makes perfect sense, dude's been doing it for ages. If he picks the third blade of grass from the right of the ant-hill, im not telling him otherwise.

 

BUT

 

Death mask of Sanguinius, lowering an IC's stats for the game...

 

Good god, where do i start?

 

He hops from side to side on his battle-line or in his battle barge, arms outstretched towards his desired foe yelling 'OOGIE BOOGIE BOOGIE' until they feel genuinely ill? Or does he pick off enemy characters who didn't call in sick for the day when they probably should have? Or does he yell "MY PRIMARCH DIED. THIS IS HIS FACE WHEN HE DIED. YOU MUST CRY NOW" over and over until the enemy feels depressed?

 

WHY? Why the hell would a chaos marine or an eldar phoenix lord be affected by a religious relic from a race they clearly dont care about??

 

If Dante's stats boosted against that enemy in combat, or that enemy rolled Ld or suffer penalties, then fine, im alright with that, but otherwise, the enemy character suffering just because Dante has arrived at the party and wants to show him his shiny new face?

 

Most ridiculous piece of Wargear ever...

[vahouth]

Let's face it.

Dante is not the most survivable character in the game,

but his awsomeness is easily depicted, with his mask.

In the presence of Dante, any character can be somewhat less than he really is...

Even the mighty Logan Grimnar only has 2 wounds!! lol

[Brother_Dan'l]

Bingo. Vahouth hit it in one. It's not that the enemy character suddenly became ill and messed his armor, it's that Dante is so damned good that the other guy seems weaker when facing him. It's their way of trying to get you send Dante after that guy. And it makes Dante that much scarier if you do, but without giving him Mephiston's statline.

 

It does seem to me that the Mask would have made more sense if it had it's effect on any IC Dante was currently in b-t-b with instead of a permanent, pre-game effect. But that's just me. :wacko:

[Terrahawk]

It does seem to me that the Mask would have made more sense if it had it's effect on any IC Dante was currently in b-t-b with instead of a permanent, pre-game effect. But that's just me. :(

 

Now that would have been really cool. Seeing lesser characters cower in fear in the presence of Dante's terrifying Death Mask. :D

[Brother Landrain]

I think part of the problem is that Eternal Warrior is kind of a band aid for the too frequent use of Instant Death.

 

IMO, too many things can ID a named character, and honestly, people get upset when they buy a fancy model, paint him up special, and he goes POP! every game onthe first turn. Or if they are so worried about ID, they spend the whole game trying to protect him and never really use hime.

 

I would think that any "Chapter Master" should have Eternal warrior. Why?

 

Well, while yes a Lascannon to the face would hurt, there have been people who survived cannon balls taking their leg off, and continued fighting. Chapter Masters have survived ages, and its not just being tough, being smart, being lucky, etc. It is because of all of those things.

 

Also, I would say depending upon the Chapter, having one other character, either its chief Libby, or Chief Chaplain depending upon Character style should get EW. Both would be ok to me honestly, and could even just make it generally that 2 HQ's get EW.

 

 

I am not a big fan of the whole 2xT instant death, especially when there is no save, that seems to me to be double jeapordy.

 

What I would prefer to see, is certain weapons have an D2, D3 or a D6 wound profile...

examples:

 

Powerfist, Bonesword - D2

Thunderhammer, Lascannon - D3

Destroyer Weapon, Battle Cannon - D6

[Zeller]

No matter what kind of experience, how awesome you are to your men, or if you're worth 20USD, a vindicator round landing at your feet is going to pulp you, smash you, and altogether erase any proof of your existence.

[Ironfather_cogface]

Bingo. Vahouth hit it in one. It's not that the enemy character suddenly became ill and messed his armor, it's that Dante is so damned good that the other guy seems weaker when facing him. It's their way of trying to get you send Dante after that guy. And it makes Dante that much scarier if you do, but without giving him Mephiston's statline.

 

It does seem to me that the Mask would have made more sense if it had it's effect on any IC Dante was currently in b-t-b with instead of a permanent, pre-game effect. But that's just me.

 

That sounds a bit more reasonable. Well put.

And utterly agreed upon with the BTB making more sense than just being on the table, but thats a rule/quirk GW seem to phasing out slowly anyway.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I think in the new edition of fantasy they have done away with ID.

 

0b

[Crynn]

I think EW isn't necassaraly a representation of age. Calgar is a titan and thus exceptionally tough and Logan is rather similar in ways. Lysander is the biggest hard ass going around and definately deserves it. I think Dante does deserve it not just cause he's old and survived but of all he has endured over that time. Eternal Warrior could be relevant to a lot of things. If nothing else his will power, he's held off from the black rage for over 1100 years. I actually worked it out and he's just a tad over 1300 years old. But there is no doubt he should have it.

 

If Dante had EW I think he should go back to 3 wounds

 

I do believe EW is handed out too much though, Although I agree that all the SM chars that have it deserve it. I think any 1 HQ having it for wolves is a bit rich though.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Space Wolves has EW like candy:

Saga of the Bear - Wolf Lord

Logan Grimnar

Aroc - WG

Lone Wolves

 

0b

[LordofDeath11]

Maybe Dante had, between his 600th and 1050th year as Chapter Master, Eternal Warrior.

Now, however, he's getting tired. He's planning on retiring to that little sanctum he saw last month. He's laying down the EW flag and accepting his mortality with a grim stoicism.

 

Insult form: Dante's so old he's out-aged Eternity!

Then I suggest the new special rules: 'I'm Too Old For This' and 'Get Off My Lawn'.

 

 

Along side with the'What button?' and 'Where are my false teeth?' rules.

 

Dante should suffer from senility on a roll of one and attack a friendly model in base contact.

[LordofDeath11]

or maybe "Where did I put my keys..."

 

Hey...that could happen to anyone. :blush:

[LordofDeath11]

It does seem to me that the Mask would have made more sense if it had it's effect on any IC Dante was currently in b-t-b with instead of a permanent, pre-game effect. But that's just me. ;)

 

Now that would have been really cool. Seeing lesser characters cower in fear in the presence of Dante's terrifying Death Mask. :)

 

Makes way more sense.

[Brother Nathan]

thats how his mask used to work and really should. Something like anything firing at him and his unit should -1/2 bs and ws. Maby - 1 initive too...

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Maybe Dante had, between his 600th and 1050th year as Chapter Master, Eternal Warrior.

Now, however, he's getting tired. He's planning on retiring to that little sanctum he saw last month. He's laying down the EW flag and accepting his mortality with a grim stoicism.

 

Insult form: Dante's so old he's out-aged Eternity!

Then I suggest the new special rules: 'I'm Too Old For This' and 'Get Off My Lawn'.

 

 

Along side with the'What button?' and 'Where are my false teeth?' rules.

 

Dante should suffer from senility on a roll of one and attack a friendly model in base contact.

 

As long as its an Inquisitor.

 

0b :mellow:

[Knyx]

Its still one of my favorite things to read on his page that "To his fellow Chapter Masters, Dante is an exemplar of the Fearlessness...."

And to find no Fearless rule two inches down that page.

[Sabadin]

What I would prefer to see, is certain weapons have an D2, D3 or a D6 wound profile...

examples:

 

Powerfist, Bonesword - D2

Thunderhammer, Lascannon - D3

Destroyer Weapon, Battle Cannon - D6

 

It was called 2nd Edition, and deemed "Too complicated".

[Crynn]

What I would prefer to see, is certain weapons have an D2, D3 or a D6 wound profile...

examples:

 

Powerfist, Bonesword - D2

Thunderhammer, Lascannon - D3

Destroyer Weapon, Battle Cannon - D6

 

It was called 2nd Edition, and deemed "Too complicated".

 

"Too complicated" = revised to third ed (simple 40k) to hit American market. hehe

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Bingo. Vahouth hit it in one. It's not that the enemy character suddenly became ill and messed his armor, it's that Dante is so damned good that the other guy seems weaker when facing him. It's their way of trying to get you send Dante after that guy. And it makes Dante that much scarier if you do, but without giving him Mephiston's statline.

 

It does seem to me that the Mask would have made more sense if it had it's effect on any IC Dante was currently in b-t-b with instead of a permanent, pre-game effect. But that's just me. :)

 

This is how I saw it too. No matter how good you are, somebody is better. And that person is Dante. I'm sure we can all think of a scene in a movie or something where a character who was built up as being badass faces someone who is even better. Even mighty foes like autarchs or chaos lords will be backfooted when facing the majesty, poise, and terrifying skill of Commander Dante, wrapped as he is in the greatest of weaponry and armor, unimaginable experience, and his terrible emotion. That is how I see it. In the Death Mask is all the rage, grief and bitterness of Sanguinius's murder. Such terrible emotional force is disarming, and crushes the resolve and spirit of Dante's foes.

[Imperialis_Dominatus]

doesn't quite have the stomach for it all anymore?... likely to avoid reckless behaviour at this age. he is ...cautious

 

Bah. Do you know what Chapter he leads? Cautious, avoiding reckless danger, not having the guts for it... isn't how the Blood Angels roll. When in doubt, run at it screaming the name of your Primarch and waving a chainsword. Not when in doubt, run away from it like a little girl and not a seven foot tall killing machine in tank armor with a rocket strapped to your back with the most powerful rage ever raged coursing through your bloodstream.

 

"Too complicated" = revised to third ed (simple 40k) to hit American market. hehe

 

And double bah.

[Khavos]

Only one model in a SW army can have Eternal Warrior via Saga of the Bear. That is not burn out.

 

That's not true.

 

Even if it was, having EW as a 35 point piece of wargear is going a little far, especially in comparison to the pathetic range of wargear available to the BA equivalents of Wolf Lords. Hell, I'd be thrilled if a BA Captain could even take Artificer/Runic Armor.

[Ironfather_cogface]

This is how I saw it too. No matter how good you are, somebody is better. And that person is Dante. I'm sure we can all think of a scene in a movie or something where a character who was built up as being badass faces someone who is even better. Even mighty foes like autarchs or chaos lords will be backfooted when facing the majesty, poise, and terrifying skill of Commander Dante, wrapped as he is in the greatest of weaponry and armor, unimaginable experience, and his terrible emotion. That is how I see it. In the Death Mask is all the rage, grief and bitterness of Sanguinius's murder. Such terrible emotional force is disarming, and crushes the resolve and spirit of Dante's foes.

 

Very very well spoken, but to me it seems reasonable that whilst say an Autarch would see the emotion in it and respect the artwork, or a chaos lord would see it and flinch a little, but the likes of a phoenix lord wouldn't even think twice of it. A hive Tyrant wouldn't register anything about the iconography of the mask at all and as far as the likes of the Avatar and C'Tan are concerned, well, ones a god and the other's not far from it, so to me the mask would mean even less to them than it does for the others.

Maybe Fearless models should be exempt from the mask's effect?

[Ironfather_cogface]

Bah. Do you know what Chapter he leads? Cautious, avoiding reckless danger, not having the guts for it... isn't how the Blood Angels roll. When in doubt, run at it screaming the name of your Primarch and waving a chainsword. Not when in doubt, run away from it like a little girl and not a seven foot tall killing machine in tank armor with a rocket strapped to your back with the most powerful rage ever raged coursing through your bloodstream

 

Ok, i'll admit i'm wrong there, but im just offering a possible 'plausible' answer as to why he doesn't seem to stack up for EW (which i actually think he should have, all cracks at his age aside). Why do you think he lacks EW?