ANTI-ORK TACTICS

[psychoplatypus]

Hey all!

 

My friend (hope he isn't reading this) and I are getting set to play a game this Saturday. He'll be using his new orks, and I'll be proxying a Slaanesh-themed army.

 

I'm not sure how big the fight will be but I'm guessing 1500-1750 points.

 

What do you guys recommend for fighting Orcs, and what kind of strategems? I don't know his playing style, but it will probably be as efficient (but not cheesy) as possible.

 

I'm thinking Sonic blaster squads, havocs, vindicator, flamer and melta rhino squads, land raider, raptors. Is a LR worth it? Please help!

 

Thanks in advance,

 

Psychoplatypus

[Brother Nihm]

Stratagems?

Are you guys playing Cities of Death?

[David the Despoiler]

The LR is helpful to get the drop on the Orks, to ensure that you get the assault, not them. Berzerkers can deal with regular Orks, but we need something a bit harder to take out nobz.

[The_Crippster]

Autocannons and flamers.

 

 

Lots of them. Flamers->Hordes Autocannons->Vehicles/Nobs

 

 

Sonic blasters generally aren't worth it. 5 Marines and 1 blastmaster then 10-man doomsiren and psword/fist champion are the way to go. Generally not a good idea to play with havocs, but if you must, I'd reccoment 2 Autocannons and 2 MLs or 4 Autocannons. Oblits are also a good choice, plasma cannons/guns are pretty sweet VS nobs, as are vindicators. If you wanna play lash go ahead but you might come off as a jerk if you do it in a friendly game. Dakkapreds are also pretty nice.

 

 

If I were playing against orks, I'd consider running Dual LR but I'd prefer to field more oblits than 2 LRs and 3 oblits. Autocannons will also help with taking out those pesky lootas.

[psychoplatypus]

Hey thanks guys. Sorry, by strategems I meant the actual word, strategy.

Could you explain to me why havocs aren't such a good choice? I'll take the oblits, but am curious as to why havocs have gotten such bad rap.

 

Ok, no sonic blasters. Berzerkers for the regular orks. For the nobs, possessed? Termies? Chosen?

 

All two cents welcome!

 

Psychoplatypus

[the jeske]

oblits for the nobz . with the wound aloctation system only units that can hurt nob bikers enough is stuff like TH/SS termis.

havocks bad because

1) do nothing against AV14 and are weak against av 13 . [so problems with guard and auto lose against LR rush]

2) they are static with no way of changing that.

3) they cost more then oblits that are good against everything.

[The_Crippster]

yeah, it's just because of obliterators versatility, cost, and survivability.

 

Havocs aren't necessarily a bad unit, they're just situational and unless you tool them will probably not be terribly effective.

 

Oblits on the other hand will never ever ever be useless. In fact that will always be far from it.

 

I suppose you could do 4 autocannon havocs vs. orks but it is kinda tooly (and the 3 oblits plasma cannons/guns for the cost will do much better). You could also consider using plague marines, 1-2 units of 5-7 marines with 2 plasmaguns/squad. They're tough and will kill pretty well at range. Just dont let those pesky power klaws get them in close combat.

[Hellios]

Do you know if he takes huge boys units? If so a Havoc squad with 4 flamers and a rhino is rather amusing... as long as you have a spare HS slot.

 

Defilers aren't bad... and have a chance of killing anything with a battle cannon... except maybe mega-nobs... in which case destroy the transport early on and enjoy the turns you get to shoot them... nob bikers (and bikers) will get cover save s but you should be able to kill a couple a turn... and you should be able to kill a few orks in combat if you need to but expect to die if they have a power klaw (which is normal) unless they only have 3 orks left.

 

As people have said oblits are good.

 

Any CSM troop choices are good against orks if used and equipped right... except for 1ksons...

 

I would avoid elites just because in general HS or troops can serve you better in this case... or like the havoc squad you could do a flamer unit with chosen but that would cost more than the havocs... I think (don't have the dex)

 

DPs with wings and Lash... once his vehicles are gone (not normally that hard unless they have KFF) this means you can play havoc with his units, clustering them for templates... moving them back out of assault range or moving units into isolation so they can be taken by one of your smaller squads.

[Kaliber]

I really enjoy using defilers to drop large blast templates on Orks from out of range. My buddy cringes everytime he sees me grab it. Cram as many templates in as you can is my suggestion.

[Canadin]

The number 1 best was to kill Nobs, specialy biker nobz, is Abbadon

 

He is overcosted and generally useless in most army builds, but the one thing that he does amazedly is place many S8 power weapon strikes at init 6 as well as survive the counterblow with 4+invul and immune to insta death

 

As for the Orks other weaknesses, they cant penetrate AV 13 and 14 at range (unless they get super lucky with zzap guns and shock-attack batteries) so land raiders and preds are nice

 

Also, include a lot of melta-guns and autocannons. Oblitz arnt rly worth is cuz they dont get many shots, and any important ork vehicle is protected by a force feild, so many shots is much better.

 

Chosen with melta-guns are very nice because they outflank, carry many melta guns or flamers, and dont cost a heavy slot.

 

Havoks are also not terrible, but if they are to ever be used effectively, it is genrally with 4 autocannons and with them gunning down AV 10-12 tansports. Against Orks, they are very vulnerable to Loota Fire; so it is better to go with armoured heavies that can blast away lots of Orks at once (predators especially) Defilers are not quite as safe VS orks because they are very vulnerable to Lootas

[Captain Tezdal]

I just throw 'zerkers at it, of course that's my tactic for everything

[Sgt. Blank]

In addition to Chaos, I also play Orks. I think the advice given so far is great and just wanted to highlight a couple points.

 

1) With the exception of nobz (and nob bikers)*, Orks will need a significant numerical advantage either shooting or assaulting against units as tough as Chaos Space Marines. Tactically, it's key to keep your units supported and prevent 20-30 orks from assaulting one unit. You might consider showing a broad front in deployment then using transports to consolidate into a tighter position, forcing the enemy to chase you. Use terrain to your advantage and create bottle necks.

 

*Nobz are an exception since they have 2 wounds per model and the possibility of having 'feel no pain'. As has been suggested, shoot them with meltas or other 8+ strength weapons to deny them FNP or pour gallons of bullets at them from autocannons or heavy bolters (ideally from a Predator). It's also key to remember that while nobz are ridiculous in assault, they only have a mediocre leadership and you'll only need to kill 2 or 3 to force a check. Most nob units, especially after casualties, will be testing against their base leadership.

 

2) Be sure to charge them if they will reach you in assault next turn. Even if you use a unit that is mediocre in assault, you end up denying them a ton of attacks and the strength bonus from furious charge. This is especially true with nobs, who will go at the same initiative as chaos marines with furious charge.

 

3) Kill their transports. This pretty much goes without saying, but if they are using transports, stop them or slow them down. Trukks are AV10 and Battlewagons are only AV12 on the sides, so this is fairly easy to accomplish.

 

4) Ramming and tank shocking are fun, especially against big blocks of infantry and flimsy transports. If you have Rhinos in your list and have already delivered their passengers, find something to run over or into :P

[redsoxrule201]

I know this is way after when your actual battle happened, but i just read the post. For a couple years I have played with the Orks and have just recently switched over to CSM, all though i have not played against the orks yet with my chaos army I have given it a lot of thought since i gave one of my friends my ork army.

Really all orks can do is hth with some minor shooting, but they are really scary when it come hth. This is because of how cheap each model is to field and how many base attacks each one get. With that being said it is not the best of all ideas to try to beat the orks in hth, they get too many attacks and even if you have termies with their 2+ save, it still wont do much good against them anyway because u will probably be dealing with about 20 wounds from a basic 20 man boyz squad attack and that can yield a lot of rolls of ones. Even though the orks are amazing in CC they are awful when they get shot against because they have a really bad armour save (with most of your weapons he may not even get a save anyway). With that being said my best plan is to shoot them before they get to you, I say this for three reasons, 1. because of their extremely poor armour saves, 2. most of your guns out range his guns, 3. for those guns that he has that are the same range he has an awful BS so he has a high role for when he shoots.

My best advice without actually fighting them is to take at least two squads of NM with a blastmaster, because of the blast marker attack and with a S9 is great against them, also i would field at least 4 oblits just to shoot him to hell if he has nobz or something as powerful, even as insurance in case he fields any of the orks vehicles. I would field at least one unit of zerkers just as ur hth unit cuz they can hold their own in hth. As far as HQ goes i would field a DP with Mark of T and take warptime and gift of chaos (if u have spawn). I personally dont like the idea of an LR just because its a lot of points and i would not want to get too close to the orks if i could help it. I would just get a rhino or a vindicator for a lot less points and just stay away from is ppl with power claws. if you have/want another HQ i really like the look of Lucius, with his armor he can deal wounds back for every one that he saved which can put more hurt on the orks that you will be in hth with (put him with the zerkers)

Sorry for the length and i know you said that you are fielding a slaanesh army but this will help with a generic list of how i think best to beat the orks. On a side not try the CS as an HQ instead of the DP for more psychic powers