advantage of glaive encarmine vs power weapon

[shatter]

Man by man else you can't be strictly speaking legally following the master crafted rule.

[Ookami_81]

I just bought the BA codex to know how I'll be cut to pieces by the Red Ones. And I was astounded reading the magnificient two handed swords I was jealous about were not relic blades !

I admit it's good from a non BA player to read, but I think it's a shame that the "assault oriented marines" don't have relic blades in their armoury, nor artificer armour for the captains (generic captains, a very bad entry in your codex I think it is)...

So yeah, people are complaining for nothing: you also have drawbacks in your codex. I just envy you from a "look" perspective: your special units, exceptionnaly sanguinary guards, are just awesome-looking: golden armoured white winged guys with two handed swords... Angels Of Death in a true sense. :P

[Niiai]

Well...the 2 handed sword is pretty good against wytches. :) Så lets hope you fight a LOTT of dark eldar :)

[Roachboy]

I reckon they should have just given us relic blades instead of making up a new weapon.Would have upped the cost of sang guard a bit but i could live with that

 

Also, Relic blade/artificer armour captains are the ONLY thing I miss when using angels

[igotsmeakabob!!]

I think a lack of Relic Blades is a way of keeping us 'balanced' with C:SM. If we had them.. well then, we would have one fewer retort when called "Space Marines, but better."

[JamesI]

Also, Relic blade/artificer armour captains are the ONLY thing I miss when using angels

Just use Astorath's rules for a relic blade/artificer armor captain.

[Ranwulf]

I think that the Glaive Encarmine when equiped by the SG, it's actually interesting and useful. Because you don't get only the 3 Attacks on the charge, you also get 2 shots with the Angelus Boltgun, or one shot with a special weapon. So it would be 5 attacks in one turn, re-rolling one. Pistol user and Power weapons gets 1 shot, and usually 4 attacks, which means, you get 5 attacks in this turns, but with no re-roll.

 

Now, costs:

 

Veteran costs with Jump Pack 45 points with power weapon. 4 Attacks on the charge. One shot. Save 3+.

 

Sanguinary Guard, 40 Points each with power weapon, 3 attacks on the charge, re-rolling one. Two shots with angelus Boltgun(that can actually kill orks, guardsmen, eldar, space marine scouts, since it's AP 4), And Save 2+.

 

Now, you can argue that Glaive Encarmine is bad, but when used by some units. But since SG it's the main user of them, you can actually tell that they ALL work very well.

 

Ran

[Slim Pickens]

The real issue with the sanguinary guard is they cannot be upgraded to larger squad size, they have no champion upgrade like honor guard do in C:SM, their chapter banner is less effective than honor guard in C:SM while more expensive, which compounds the issue that the glaives are poorly designed.

 

Being 5 man limit is the most crushing problem the SG have though. it means they have to be extremely careful what they attack, and without a priest to support them they really are lackluster.

 

Keeping in mind that the BA are a combined arms army, I understand the designers issues with buffing the SG up too much when they can receive so many outside buffs in combination, but I reall ythink they erred on the side of underpowered a bit too far on this unit.

 

Now adding Dante and making them scoring means they go back into the decent category, but they still are not exceptional.

 

I would have much rathered they forgo completely their shooting weapons and be made much more killy in combat. The last thing I need with a 5 man combat specialist squad is a mediocre shooting gun... but then again we already have assault terminators in this role...

 

I wish I had a reasonable solution to what should have been done with the SG, but they walk a fine line between overcosted and OP. I really do not like the glaive/angelus bolter combo solution at all however.

[Ranwulf]

I wouldn't throw a Veteran Assault Squad upon anything either. And altough they are small unit, I must say, 2+ Save and a Sanguinary Priest make them very tough to kill(bolters, heavy bolters,), and I don't quite think they are suppose to be the most killing unit in our codex, that's the DC+Chaplain job, SG are different, they are more like...Eldar. You have to give them the right equips and the right boosts so they can be either nice killers(5 Power Weapons helps a lot), excellent tank-hunters(3 Infernus Pistols, one powerfist and you are good to go), or they can get some other thing to kill. Thing is, they work fine, but not alone. They are not Assault Termies. They are not Dreads, they are a completely different unit. My Sanguinary Guard Army works fine, all of them go with one Priest

each and if possible, either a Jump Pack Librarian or a Jump Pack Chaplain, to boost them even more. If you do that, and knows how to use target priority, you be sure, they will work EXTREMELY well.

 

Ran

[Tame]

Man by man else you can't be strictly speaking legally following the master crafted rule.

 

And this is a huge time waster when playing a Sanguinary Guard army :huh:

[BrotherMoses]

On Sanguard they're worth it because they don't come with pistols so they already dont' have the +1 A. I wouldn't put them on anything else because they're really lacklustre. I would model one on a captain in a hearbeat, but I'd just use it as a powerweapon anyways. You can't even tell the difference really.

[Mycroft Holmes]

The best way to batch roll:

Different style/color dice makes it pretty easy. 5 sets of 3 dice makes it super easy.

 

Mycroft

[SamaNagol]

That and a Captain can't take a Glaive anyway :devil:

[Demoulius]

biggest advantage was that because of the glaive encarmine GW made these amazing looking boxsets :rolleyes:

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I really like the Sanguinary Guard. I think the best way to run them is with a power fist, two infernus pistols and the Chapter Banner... then attach a Chaplain/Recluisarch and a Priest. Sure it's a lot of points tied up but it hits like a lead pipe & to me that has always been what Blood Angels are all about.

 

0b :rolleyes:

[Ookami_81]

I'm no expert but I think that if you spend the points - in a BIG army that is, you have means to make them really dangerous, but it supposes:

- adding at least 3 infernus pistols

- adding chapter banner

- adding a priest

- adding Dante

- "adding" the Sanguinor (keep him in its +1A power range) (not sure of his name in english, I'm talking about your flying MCEq in golden armour :sweat: )

 

With that you can kill tanks/transports, landing anywhere you want, count as troops, having 5 attacks on the charge for each guy, 2+ save and FNP... and a huge point sink, OK, but sure it should be fun to try that !

 

Concerning tank killing... Any of you know why vanilla marines have a S 10 multi-melta, and yours is S 8 ? It's basically the same weapon, so maybe it's a mistake in your codex ? If it's for the sake of balance, I think it's a poor choice: you people are able to make a tank 33% faster, but not to properly clean a multi-melta so it's weaker than normal.... :rolleyes:

[Ktan]

Concerning tank killing... Any of you know why vanilla marines have a S 10 multi-melta, and yours is S 8 ?

 

The C:SM Multi-melta is S8

[Ookami_81]

You sure ? ;) I'll check tonight in my codex, but I'm pretty sure I've seen S 10 somewhere. Black Reach book maybe... :D

[Jaarl Stormfang]

Definately S8. A S10 melta would be ridiculous.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

IG bastion breacher for Medusa... only 5 points.

 

0b :tu:

[fivepointedstar]

i always thought blade encarmines were just master crafted pw. im maybe overlooked the two handed part. but wouldnt Sanguinary guard still be good with a s4, ap4 bolter with assulalt 2 it kinda gives them the relentless rule if you think-about-it. But i agree with about capitian not getting artificer armor, doesnt make sence on a "artsy- angeleque" army. Plus i do miss auxiurary gernaded hq, it adds to the fun of 12" frag, or krak launcher+ personal weapon attacks. but the storm ravens, and death comp dreads do add some much needed flair. even though id like to run a MotF with BA. might be fun to have a geared out blood thirting techie with two servo arms running at ya!

[Ookami_81]

I looked in every book and it's in fact S8 for a multimelta. Some mean chaos daemon surely tried to make me overstate my own strenghts...

 

I've seen around the B&C BA topics some people are running Dante + Sangpriests + Sanguards and only that. I found the idea fun and really cool in a theme perspective but I was really surprised said lists were competitive. What do you think of those lists in a tactical perspective ? Even with inferno pistols and fists, shoudn't they be really weak against meched up armies (and against hordes also because of the very very low body count ?)

[Remmah]

I bet the sanguinary guard are jealous of their Vanguard buddies. I'd trade my glaive and silly bolter in for a power weapon and pistol any day.

 

How many points do we pay for those craptastic weapons anyway?