IT: The Unchained

[Ace Debonair]

I had thought about scrapping the Cursed Founding idea, as it is proving to be rather tricky and I came up with an interesting (RE: I hope I didn't subconsciously steal it) idea to replace it.

 

And your idea is...?

 

When people say about adding mystery to an IT, this isn't generally what they mean. :)

[Captain Juan Juarez]

I had thought about scrapping the Cursed Founding idea, as it is proving to be rather tricky and I came up with an interesting (RE: I hope I didn't subconsciously steal it) idea to replace it.

 

And your idea is...?

 

When people say about adding mystery to an IT, this isn't generally what they mean. :blink:

 

Well the Imperium is as corrupt as they claim Chaos is, so when the Grey Ghosts become Unchained they are free from all of the Imperial shackles to wage war on the corrupt individuals and institutions of the Imperium, such as the Ecclesiarchy.

[Captain Juan Juarez]

I'm bumping this... Because I can - Also because I've altered the premise in #1 post.

[Ace Debonair]

The Grey Ghosts, in their formative years, would come across the very blackest hearts and different Chapters; corrupt Eccleisarchy Cardinals and forces of the Dark Angels to name but two.

 

While Eccleisarchy Cardinals is a sweet name for a chapter, I suspect there's actually a fault with this sentence. :)

If you're looking for cold-hearted chapters, the Dark Angels are a pretty good choice. The Iron Hands would also be a damn fine chapter to work with in this instance, and I can think of a couple of DIY's who could also take up the mantle of cold-chapter-#2. ;)

 

Incidentally you still have these guys down as cursed founding in post #1. ^_^

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Incidentally you still have these guys down as cursed founding in post #1. :)

 

No... I don't... :P

 

The Grey Ghosts, in their formative years, would come across the very blackest hearts and different Chapters; corrupt Eccleisarchy Cardinals and forces of the Dark Angels to name but two.

 

While Eccleisarchy Cardinals is a sweet name for a chapter, I suspect there's actually a fault with this sentence. ;)

If you're looking for cold-hearted chapters, the Dark Angels are a pretty good choice. The Iron Hands would also be a damn fine chapter to work with in this instance, and I can think of a couple of DIY's who could also take up the mantle of cold-chapter-#2. ;)

 

The Cardinals could be a sports team to be honest :)

 

But I don't just want Astartes Chapters.. I want them to wage war against the corrupt of the Imperium, so the Ecclesiarchy is part of it!

[Dosjetka]

I believe that the only organisation that is not corrupt is the =I= though I may be wrong about that, as they do have some Inquisitors who turn to Chaos, yet does that mean that they are corrupt?

 

Also, do you absolutely want to make a traitor chapter? I read in a book about Templars (fiction) that a small group, including the main character, who cut themselves off from all apart from their Lord because of the atrocities commited in Jerusalem in the name of God (beating, etc...). So, what you could have is a loyalist Chapter who's only has connections with the other Imperial organisations for survival. Otherwise, they wage their own wars and only listen to the =I= and their Chapter Master on where to go and what to do. Is that a good idea? Feel free to take it and use it :) Always glad to help.

 

Ludovic

[Dosjetka]

Nothing? :( (small bump)

[Ace Debonair]

Nothing? :) (small bump)

 

Give CJJ some time, buddy. He might be meditating on your words even now. :(

[Captain Juan Juarez]

If by meditating you mean not even online.. Thats me! :P

 

It is an interesting idea BBL, but I do want to try my hand at a Traitor Chapter.. Also, I'm not sure that a "standard" Astartes would ever become sickened by the acts of the Imperium, fo in the grim darkness of the future there is only.. WAR.. Hu huh.. What is it good for.. :P

[Dosjetka]

Maybe that's how it could start off though, no? That's how the begin and as they see more and more corruption, they turn renegade or whatever?

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Heres the actual premise I came up with to explain the new version:

 

The Chapter has served alongside a few other Chapters, the notables including the Dark Angels and Black Templars - maybe even the Marines Malevolent - and these instances have shown the characters of other Chapters to be found wanting; the Dark Angels who disappear for unknown reasons, the Templars who slay an entire community for the sake of a single rogue psyker, the Marines Malevolent who have a ruthless disregard for human life in the pursuit of their goals.

 

Ecclesiarchy Cardinals who rule words in the Emperors name and treat them life personal fiefdoms and Imperial Guard Commanders who leave worlds to die or ignore those in peril.

 

For these reasons - and any more I can come up with :lol: - the Grey Ghosts depart from the Imperium, sickened by the corruption and callous attitudes that rule the core of those in power. They slip their shackles, become Unchained and free to pursue all foes of the Emperor, Cardinal or Chaos worshipper.

[Ace Debonair]

Heres the actual premise I came up with to explain the new version:

 

The Chapter has served alongside a few other Chapters, the notables including the Dark Angels and Black Templars - maybe even the Marines Malevolent - and these instances have shown the characters of other Chapters to be found wanting; the Dark Angels who disappear for unknown reasons, the Templars who slay an entire community for the sake of a single rogue psyker, the Marines Malevolent who have a ruthless disregard for human life in the pursuit of their goals.

 

Ecclesiarchy Cardinals who rule words in the Emperors name and treat them life personal fiefdoms and Imperial Guard Commanders who leave worlds to die or ignore those in peril.

 

For these reasons - and any more I can come up with :huh: - the Grey Ghosts depart from the Imperium, sickened by the corruption and callous attitudes that rule the core of those in power. They slip their shackles, become Unchained and free to pursue all foes of the Emperor, Cardinal or Chaos worshipper.

That sounds like a good start.

Might be a few too many famous names with all three of those chapters, though. Perhaps a DA successor in place of the real thing?

 

If by meditating you mean not even online.. Thats me!

:P

Yeah, that's what I meant. :lol:

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Heres the actual premise I came up with to explain the new version:

 

The Chapter has served alongside a few other Chapters, the notables including the Dark Angels and Black Templars - maybe even the Marines Malevolent - and these instances have shown the characters of other Chapters to be found wanting; the Dark Angels who disappear for unknown reasons, the Templars who slay an entire community for the sake of a single rogue psyker, the Marines Malevolent who have a ruthless disregard for human life in the pursuit of their goals.

 

Ecclesiarchy Cardinals who rule words in the Emperors name and treat them life personal fiefdoms and Imperial Guard Commanders who leave worlds to die or ignore those in peril.

 

For these reasons - and any more I can come up with <_< - the Grey Ghosts depart from the Imperium, sickened by the corruption and callous attitudes that rule the core of those in power. They slip their shackles, become Unchained and free to pursue all foes of the Emperor, Cardinal or Chaos worshipper.

That sounds like a good start.

Might be a few too many famous names with all three of those chapters, though. Perhaps a DA successor in place of the real thing?

 

I did cringe at the famous names.. But as I was typing those were the only ones from actual background that sprang to mind and would fit the theme.

 

A Dark Angels successor would be fine, but for the anti-psyker no one really does it better than the Black Templars I don't think.. But any other influences from other Chapters I'm totally open too, answers on a post to.... This thread!

[Dosjetka]

I must agree with Ace about the DA successor Chapter instead of the DA's themselves. As for the BT's, well, they are the best at the anti-psyker theme but you could maybe look about a bit and see if there's a DIY Chapter (successor or not of the BT's) that have the same hate?

 

As for the MM's, I don't know much about them so I can't say much but maybe do the same as above with another DIY Chapter.

 

Again, at the end of the day, it's your Chapter/Warband, this is my advice. Take or leave. <_<

 

Ludovic

[Ace Debonair]

I must agree with Ace about the DA successor Chapter instead of the DA's themselves. As for the BT's, well, they are the best at the anti-psyker theme but you could maybe look about a bit and see if there's a DIY Chapter (successor or not of the BT's) that have the same hate?

 

As for the MM's, I don't know much about them so I can't say much but maybe do the same as above with another DIY Chapter.

 

Again, at the end of the day, it's your Chapter/Warband, this is my advice. Take or leave. :P

 

Ludovic

 

The Marines Malevolent could probably be replaced by the Red Lords, if they're any use to you.

 

They're more than willing to shell a city to pieces to kill a single traitor. Heck, they'd probably shell their own collective mothers to kill a single traitor. :blush:

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Dark Angels Successor - ?

 

Black Templars - Check, going to keep them in for a bit of oopmh and I don't think any other Chapter matches them for what they hate.

 

Marines Malevolent - Red Lords, Check.

 

 

Now to expand on that... I think that the Origins will probably the hardest section to get right, mainly because they won't have a homeworld I don't think - whether that is ever or for another a reason Ive yet to decide on.

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Bump - Because I've been working on it sort of!

[Ace Debonair]

The Grey Ghosts, in their formative years, would come across the very blackest hearts and corrput organisations, such as the Ecclesiarchy and Inquisition.

 

The actions of these people and forces would wildly skew the attitudes of a select few within the Chapter, forcing them to see the corruption that is at the heart of the Imperium as a whole and ensuring that they declared a crusade of their own to pruge these elements.

 

Perhaps you shouldn't just say the inquisition is corrupt. It'd be particular inquisitors, and you'd have to be pretty lucky/unlucky to run into more than one corrupted inquisitor. :rolleyes:

 

I want Tuya to be considered a paradise, so that it adds another tragedy to the Chapter - though the Marines would not consider it so - when the Chapter falls.

I think perhaps they would - if it's overrun by orks and then destroyed, I reckon your lads would rightly be very upset.

 

Undecided - Trying to think of something unique but I fear that may just complicate matters.

Smaller size might force them into covert operations, and with a name like Grey Ghosts, I reckon your chapter had stealthy leanings anyhow. :D It's not unique, exactly but not overdone.

 

?? Unsure about this, as techincally any geneseed could be used bar Guillimans though I suppose even the pure will develop defects over time.

Well, are there any of the traits that go with the geneseeds that lend themselves to the Unchained? If not, then go for big blue's geneseed. It's like the blank slate of the geneseed section. :lol:

 

The idea came to me that the fulcrum of the turning of the Chapter was inspired by the Chaplain presence within - that they stopped preaching of the hate for Xenos, Mutant and all enemies of the Imperium of Man and merely preached hate for all things corrput. Over time, this Gospel would turn from those who are corrupt to everyone not of the brotherhood.

 

Dude, cool. :lol:

Sounds good, CJJ.

[Ferrata]

The Grey Ghosts, in their formative years, would come across the very blackest hearts and corrput organisations, such as the Ecclesiarchy and Inquisition.

I think you have done what many writers do when they write about a traitor chapter, they want them to be justified in their fall - almost be seen as the good guys. It is fine for them to think they are the good guys, but my own personal taste is that if you fall from the Emperor's grace, do it properly and be bad. So here, for example, instead of painting the Imperium as corrupt make it so the chapter doesn't understand the actions of others, they fail to see the bigger picture. Maybe the Inquisition burns an entire world, but because of this, three more stay inline. Your chapter is very now, this instance, what about now in their hearts and they cannot look to the future. They see this as an evil act for pure evil sake (Unlawful Chaos) whilst it was actually an evil act for the good of the Imperium (Unlawful Good). You can still have the chapter become disheartened towards the corruption that they see in the Imperium, but you never actually say the Imperium is corrupt.

 

Gene-seed: Always go Ultramarine. You don't need to think about it then.

 

Combat Doctrine: Why does it need to be something different? They would more than likely continue their traditions on, seeing as they are the only pure force in the galaxy :rolleyes:

[Captain Juan Juarez]

The Grey Ghosts, in their formative years, would come across the very blackest hearts and corrput organisations, such as the Ecclesiarchy and Inquisition.

 

The actions of these people and forces would wildly skew the attitudes of a select few within the Chapter, forcing them to see the corruption that is at the heart of the Imperium as a whole and ensuring that they declared a crusade of their own to pruge these elements.

 

Perhaps you shouldn't just say the inquisition is corrupt. It'd be particular inquisitors, and you'd have to be pretty lucky/unlucky to run into more than one corrupted inquisitor. :tu:

 

Classic mistake, eh? Everyone who writes any IA in its firsct incarnation always says "Inquisition"!

 

I want Tuya to be considered a paradise, so that it adds another tragedy to the Chapter - though the Marines would not consider it so - when the Chapter falls.

I think perhaps they would - if it's overrun by orks and then destroyed, I reckon your lads would rightly be very upset.

 

In my mind I didn't see that they would be - they are so uncaring about the Imperium that one more world will not tip their conscience.

 

Undecided - Trying to think of something unique but I fear that may just complicate matters.

Smaller size might force them into covert operations, and with a name like Grey Ghosts, I reckon your chapter had stealthy leanings anyhow. ;) It's not unique, exactly but not overdone.

 

Wanted to avoid the niches, because most have been done before but something to look into I suppose!

 

?? Unsure about this, as techincally any geneseed could be used bar Guillimans though I suppose even the pure will develop defects over time.

Well, are there any of the traits that go with the geneseeds that lend themselves to the Unchained? If not, then go for big blue's geneseed. It's like the blank slate of the geneseed section. :D

As an imperial force, no. But in their Traitor incarnation a zelous and preachy combo of the Word bearers and Templars seems the best description!

 

The idea came to me that the fulcrum of the turning of the Chapter was inspired by the Chaplain presence within - that they stopped preaching of the hate for Xenos, Mutant and all enemies of the Imperium of Man and merely preached hate for all things corrput. Over time, this Gospel would turn from those who are corrupt to everyone not of the brotherhood.

 

Dude, cool. :P

 

You're unluck Ace, if I'd ignored this IA I might have eventually suggested the Gospel of hate to you :P

 

Ferrata

 

Actually it isn't my intention to make them appear the only pure force in a corrupt world - and yes I want to justify their fall but only in so much as that no one here wants to hurt me for not doing so :P

 

Geneseed - Gotcha, have done so for my last few IA attempts.

 

Combat Doc - Tradtitions usually requires having some ;)

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Have expanded the Origins and the Gospel of Hate sections, as well as finalising Geneseed as that of Big Blue.

[Ace Debonair]

I get what Ferrata meant - there's no reason for the Unchained to change their fighting style when they fall from grace.

 

I still reckon the Raven Guard fighting-style would suit these guys, personally. :D

[Captain Juan Juarez]

I get what Ferrata meant - there's no reason for the Unchained to change their fighting style when they fall from grace.

 

I still reckon the Raven Guard fighting-style would suit these guys, personally. :D

 

It's less about a change of style and more about... Something I can't put into words - Which is oh so helpful.

 

After their fall it becomes less about how they punish the Imperium, but more that they simply do so - they forgo their penchant for a stealthy hit and run to make a frontal assault and declare "You are evil and so we have come" even though even as they purge the Imperium they become what they now hate.

 

 

The idea I want to convey is that up until the Gospel of Hate really becomes corrupted the Chapter simply possess pride in what they do and an attitude very focused on martial aspects - lack of interest in the political machinations of a CM like Dante or Calgar, for example.

 

So when Rayloth finally starts to preach about the corruptness at heart of the Imperium - IG Commanders, Inquisitiors, etc not serving what the Chapter sees as the good of Man - that things start to go a little "wonky".

 

On a side note, I have a brilliant idea for a sidebar of the final confrontation between Rayloth and the Lord Chaplain ;)