Our worst HH fears

[Isryion]

So, there is probably a very low expectation of what sales could be. IE, the Blood Angels subject matter simply accounts for X sales. Swallow accounts for X-1y, which still is greater than their estimate, apparently X-2y. Have somebody that can write a bit better and you might be selling more than you could simply by having BA be the subject matter. They might actually have :gasp: a good story.

So it's official that the BA books under-performed? I haven't read that anywhere.

 

No, you missed the point, but have you read any good reviews of them? My point is they are probably doing at least as expected, but considering the word-of-mouth, had they actually been well written, they probably could have done better.

[Pcm979]

But not much, in the grand scheme of things. Not enough for GW to care, anyway. As you said yourself, most people who bought them probably did so because they were already fans, in spite of the reviews.

[Brother Jim]

While I must confess to not really having enjoyed Swallow's previous Blood Angels' novels--Black Tide was my favorite, and it was only "OK"--I thought that Flight of the Eisentstein was incredible; it's one of my top three favorite novels of the Horus Heresy series. If Swallow can equal or exceed that piece of writing with a Blood Angels' HH novel, I will be very happy...

[Brother Yorei]

i happened to like the BA books. of course, i do view he BL as an alternate view of the 40k universe, so i dont get bent out of shape if some of the BA get duped by a very resourceful inquisitor and an over zealous apothecary gets tricked by Bile because he is too focused on getting rid of the flaw to see that the skin he is wearing isnt really his. that being said, i did like the Flight of the Eisenstien better and would like to see future BA books written with the same level of detail and accuracy.

[Koyote]

Now, I'm a bit biased. My favourite Chapter is the Flesh Tearers...

Aaron, consider this for a moment...

 

If you were to write the Blood Angel novel for HH, not only would the sons of Sanguinius get an author deserving of them, but YOU would have the opportunity to name and write a certain Blood Angel captain... A captain that, after the heresy, would lead the newly formed Flesh Tearers into deep space aboard the battle barge Victus. A Blood Angel captain who, like the rest of his Company, favors chain-axes to chainswords. A captain who is perhaps a bit of a hot head and maybe even admires the ferocity of his (pre-heresy) World Eaters brethren a bit too much? A captain whose traits, much like Sigismund's, would one day shape the character of his second founding Chapter.

 

This captain doesn't have to be a major character in the book, but even so, think what a privilege it would be to be allowed to write the pre-history of your favorite Chapter.

 

Think about it... :D

 

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/10011970/forbiddenfruit.jpg

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

If you dont like the author then dont buy the book. Its just that simple.

 

0b :)

[noodlenerd]

If you dont like the author then dont buy the book. Its just that simple.

 

0b :wub:

Is it wrong to actually want a good book?

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

6, 7, 8 or pages of whining will not change anything. Look where it has gotten you up to this point.

 

0b :wub:

[Brother Jim]

If you dont like the author then dont buy the book. Its just that simple.

 

0b

 

 

Actually, it's not quite that simple. I've liked some of Swallow's work, while also finding some of it atrocious. He's hit or miss, but one can hope for further improvement... ;)

[Morticon]

The whining (within reason) will still help people like me, who dont buy the books, to get two sides of the story. Thats why the healthy discussion/debate is entertained.

 

When it goes full on into major Swallow bashing, JamesI or myself will melta it, but for now, its a good indicator of how and why the books are "wrong" or not.

[SamaNagol]

You know what ABSOLUTELY DOESN'T HELP? Saying nothing and just not buying the book.

 

That works when there are directly competing products from other companies which offer the same service. However in this instance you aren't going to get someone else offering a better value and better quality Blood Angels horus heresy novel, you just get what GW give you. So you have to complain if you aren't getting what you want.

[Th12t33n]

I have read the omnibus, and black tide, im currently reading red fury... and i must say i read black tide in 3 days. ive owned red fury for like 2 weeks now and am not even 100 pages into it.. it really sucks to be honest i cant get into it at all.. that could be due to me knowing what happens because im an idiot and read the last book first but still. i mean i just cant feel it at all...

[Koyote]

I just finished reading Aaron Dembski-Bowden's story At Gaius Point in the Legends of the Space Marines anthology. It's the best story in the book, followed closely by McNeil's and Counter's stories. The writing is quite good and the story and characters compelling. And while the Flesh Tearers are deeply flawed Astartes, ADB treats them with the respect they deserve -a lesson for James Swallow.

 

So despite JS having dibs on the Sons of Sanguinus, I am utterly convinced that ADB is the best Black Library author to write Blood Angels in Horus Heresy series. Read At Gaius Point and you will know that I speak the truth. ;)

[Pigeons]

I honestly haven't read any of the Horus Heresy books.

And honestly, it surprises the hell out of me that the narrative has taken so long. Is the civil war taking place over centuries or something? This isn't Dune, people. I'm not sure if I even want to read them. I'm getting my degree in English Lit (cue hoity toity voice), so of course I'm an avid reader, but I like narratives to come to a conclusion in a manner that makes sense and is timely! I've got stuff to do! I've all but given up on Lost for this reason. Great show. Great acting, writing. Get to the damn end!

Ok, let me take a breath. I've had too much coffee. Sorry.

What I'm getting at is that I wonder what all the fuss is. We all know how the story ends.

 

 

 

really? this post is surprising if you're an english major.

 

 

 

it's practically one of the greatest and most elaborate and expansive stories ever told. only star wars even comes close to the depth and breadth of the Heresy.

 

 

 

first, we've got the back stories and actions of TWENTY different space marine legions. even the least interesting of them all, the cut and dried ultramarines, went through some pretty interesting events during the Heresy. and as we saw with horus rising-fulgrim, you've also got all the different perspectives of events where multiple legions were present.

 

 

then all of this culminates in the battle for terra, the most massive and epic battle ever waged. i mean really, i could write a trilogy of books JUST about the battle for terra.

 

 

and that's not even to mention all the other fun stuff like the mechanicum civil war, the formation of the inquisition and the sisters of battle, the formation of the assassins guilds, the aftermath of the Heresy where you literally have an entire GALAXY being rebuilt from the ruins of war, plus the sundering of the founding legions into Chapters in the 2nd founding of space marines, the separation of the legions and the army and navy into three distinct divisions of the Imperium, all with their own chains of command, you have the rise of the high lords of terra.....

 

 

then of course there's what all the OTHER races were doing during this momentous time, such as eldrad trying to warn humanity about Horus in Fulgrim.

 

 

 

i see the series stretching for AT LEAST 20 books, if not more like 25-30. easily.

 

 

 

 

 

oh and all that having been said, and since i know one of the authors is posting in this thread:

 

 

 

please no more books like descent of angels. i've hit a freaking wall with this book. it's not bad in any way, it's just...not 40k. i feel like i'm reading a warhammer fantasy novel. i'm sure the actual "from when the emperor comes" on, is amazing, but i'm frankly close to just skipping ahead to those parts, something i rarely if ever do. i'll usually put a novel down altogether before skipping ahead.

 

 

it just reads as too far off topic when i want to be reading about the actual heresy, not something that happened before the Lion was even discovered by the Emperor. at least it's only half of the book, though, i guess.

 

horus rising-fulgrim were wonderful though.

[Koyote]

Now, I'm a bit biased. My favourite Chapter is the Flesh Tearers...

Aaron, consider this for a moment...

 

If you were to write the Blood Angel novel for HH, not only would the sons of Sanguinius get an author deserving of them, but YOU would have the opportunity to name and write a certain Blood Angel captain... A captain that, after the heresy, would lead the newly formed Flesh Tearers into deep space aboard the battle barge Victus. A Blood Angel captain who, like the rest of his Company, favors chain-axes to chainswords. A captain who is perhaps a bit of a hot head and maybe even admires the ferocity of his (pre-heresy) World Eaters brethren a bit too much? A captain whose traits, much like Sigismund's, would one day shape the character of his second founding Chapter.

 

This captain doesn't have to be a major character in the book, but even so, think what a privilege it would be to be allowed to write the pre-history of your favorite Chapter.

 

Think about it... :)

 

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/10011970/forbiddenfruit.jpg

So his name is Amit 'the Flesh Tearer,' Captain of the 5th Company.

 

Think about it Aaron, you could have been the author to breath life in this character... It could have been you. :ph34r:

 

Actually, I'm about 100 pages into Fear to Tread and so thus far I am quite pleased with James Swallow's treatment of Sanguinius and the IX Legion. In this instance it is good to have been proven wrong. :wink:

[Bradley Powers]

Wow, thread resurrection much? The book is out (or at least prerelease copies are out, I've read it) it's fantastic, and it doesn't make Blood Angels look like nambly pambly morons. In fact, I have to say it's the best bit of BA fluff I've read to date, going back well over a decade. In any case, bravo to Mr. Swallow, his penitence is done.

[Crimson Devil]

After reading the book I feel it makes the events of the first two BA books more plausible. The connection between the angels and Sanguinius is a very real thing even after his death, they would give anything to have him back. It wouldn't take very much chaos influence for the charade to work. The ruinous powers have all the time they need to set up this kind of scheme. Falling for it doesn't make the BAs fools or morons. It simply demonstrates the power of Chaos.

[Koyote]

Wow, thread resurrection much?

I had just finished the chapter where Amit is introduced and it reminded me of my two year old exchange with Mr. Dembski-Bowden. It's funny how the brain works. ;)

[Jorre]

I just finished the book last night. It's a good book and well worth the read! Respectful to the Blood Angels and 40k fluff! However I didn't find it quite as engaging as the better HH books. I never felt like it grabbed me and said "you ain't going anywhere until you finish reading this book". That doesn't mean it was bad, just not as great as I was hoping!

[daboarder]

I bring sad knews my friends. Apparently our first heresy book is coming soon and is titled Signus Prime. So what is the tradgedy I hear you say? The author of this upcoming book is HE WHO SHALL NOT BE NAMED! Yep it is now official BL really really hates us for some lamentable reason.

 

 

MMHMM!

 

Brothers I have just finished reading fear to tread and I really need to get this out.

 

 

 

OH MY GOD THAT WAS AWESOME!!!

 

 

Seriously Swallow has just beaten EVERY other heresy book written, I am not joking when I say that I loved every single line in this book, even the epilogue was dripping with brilliance.

 

Brilliant portrayal of everyone involved, even the wolves come across as the same overbearing fools as they have before but this time it is at least tempered with their understanding of the implications of their purpose.

[Blindhamster]

already said it elsewhere so I'll not say too much, but as it's been brought up in an old thread, it's fair to say Swallow did an outstanding job, every review of it has given it perfect or near perfect scores and many have noted it as being one of, if not the best horus heresy novels to date, and I'm completely inclined to agree.

[Night Runner]

I enjoyed it lot. Swallow did the BA proud. You get more Primarch time than us Space Wolves in Prospero Burns (even though it wasn't a bad book). Infact at this rate Russ will be the least known Primarch out there. If I was a BA fan I'd count my lucky stars.

[SamaNagol]

I was quite annoyed by Prospero Burns. It tried to be ful of intrigue and subterfuge. I wanted axes and mjod and Russ breaking backs and 13th Company chasing things into the warp.

 

Fear To Tread is a straight out and out 'action movie' and does exactly what you would expect.

[Mullinstron]

I also finished fear to Tread and I can say I enjoyed it but It was not, by far the best HH novel so far. Overall it was a good story, however the Blood Angel characters were shallow and for the most part uninteresting. There was nothing to really set them apart from a generic marine. They just were sort of Noble and trying to do the right thing. In a way their compassion differs them from some of the other chapters I read about, but that just made them seem more human and less Superhuman.

 

Overall I would give it a 3 out of 5. It was worth the read but it was nothing amazing.

 

~m

[Darklighter]

I also finished fear to Tread and I can say I enjoyed it but It was not, by far the best HH novel so far. Overall it was a good story, however the Blood Angel characters were shallow and for the most part uninteresting. There was nothing to really set them apart from a generic marine. They just were sort of Noble and trying to do the right thing. In a way their compassion differs them from some of the other chapters I read about, but that just made them seem more human and less Superhuman.

 

Overall I would give it a 3 out of 5. It was worth the read but it was nothing amazing.

 

~m

 

Blood Angels are supposed to be more "human" than other Marines at least on the surface. It's the flaw or darkness within that humbles them. The flaw also allows then to attune to the compassion of Sanguinius and his vision for humanity and helps them strive for a better future.