Thunderfire Tech Marine

[Warprat]

As I read it, the gunner is a regular Tech Marine. He would not be able to join the servitors unless he survived the destruction on his gun. The servitors would have to roll for mindlock, until then.

 

Nice for fluff, but not effective points wise.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Can a tech marine join the unit of a Techmarine/Thunder-gun? I'm kinda puzzled but this while reading this tread..... as for the Servitors I would agree that they should be able to field but the risk/value of the unit causes a lot of if's that would make it a no.

 

- I just noticed something funny ... Techmarines do not have the option of droppods and clearly with the rules one thundergun does not allow you to drop the marine with it. This is amusing.

 

AS far as I'm skimming in the text is that the techmarine gunner is set only to operate this gun just from fluff point of view, if he was additionally set to control a unit of servitors he would need 3 more arms to do all of this operating. The modifications to the techmarine allows him to focus on this one set of gun. I feel it just makes sense to avoid the additional unit.

 

1.) As an IC, I don't see why a Techmarine couldn't join the TFC. . . why would you want them to? The artillery rules clearly state that only the crewmen purchased with the gun can operate the gun, so you get no benefit from it.

 

2.) The Techmarine and the cannon are a single unit, therefore the pod carries both of them.

 

3.) He needs no extra arms to order the servitors around. They take verbal orders, and I guarantee that a Techmarine can speak Binaric machine code, which servitors understand just as well as Low Gothic thanks to their coding wafers.

[gorbhan]

1.) As an IC, I don't see why a Techmarine couldn't join the TFC. . . why would you want them to? The artillery rules clearly state that only the crewmen purchased with the gun can operate the gun, so you get no benefit from it.

 

Since a one man unit cannot join another man unit im pretty sure a thunderfire choice would count as a one man unit. The cannon itself would be a vehicle so the gunner would count as the one man unit. Thats my opinion anyway.

[Bannus]

Technically - according to RAW - the Techmarine Gunner cannot take Servitors for the reasons mentioned above - but given there are a lot more effective things to spend points on, I don't think many people would have an issue with it. Just clarify it before you play a game.

 

"No, no! You can't take that unit of Servitors - it would be unfair!"

 

Yeah, I'd like to hear that one :D

[Acebaur]

He's still a Techmarine. Period. As Tyrion said a scout sgt is still a scout, so a techmarine gunner is still a techmarine. Especially since the thunderfire cannon entry refers you back to the techmarine entry.

 

The servitors can't join him as was said until the cannon is destroyed. Why take them? because it's fluffy, remember this is a game. It's not all about winning.

 

As far as extra arms, he already has them. Remember he comes with a servo-harness?

[Brother Valerius]

I have to agree that if we say you can't take servitors because he's a "Techmarine Gunner", that's the path of madness. Where does it stop? As has already been pointed out, technically Tigurius isn't a psyker, and technically a scout sergeant can't ride in a LSS. If anyone I encountered wanted to go to such lengths to rules lawyer that he/she was willing to ignore the way the English language works to try to claim a technicality (and wasn't doing so purely to have an interesting debate)... I would be stunned. Surely no one suggests that we should ignore the laws of English, or else we can't interpret the words in the rule books at all.

 

Furthermore, even if we try to strictly interpret these rules, the RAW support the argument that this is a Techmarine, with all the normal trappings thereof (as Acebaur points out). I quote: "Each Thunderfire Cannon is crewed by a single Techmarine (see page 71 for special rules). Note that the Techmarine does not benefit from the Independent Character and Blessing of the Omnissiah special rules unless..." (C:SM p. 73). Not only do the rules say simply "Techmarine" everywhere except the unit composition entry on p. 142, the entry on p. 73 specifically refers us to the "Techmarine" entry, and makes mention that a rule that is Techmarine (and MOTF)-specific is not in effect until certain conditions have been met. If for no other reason than that mentions of "Techmarine" outnumber mentions of "Techmarine Gunner" 4:1, I would say that RAW tells us to treat the unit as any other Techmarine... but then we also throw in the fact that the rules go out of their way to refer all details (except stat line) to the Techmarine entry. I think the evidence is clear here.

[Grey Mage]

We already have a thread going on this, what is this thing and where did it come from. :P

 

Heres a link to the other thread for convenience: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=203006

 

Weve covered most of the pertinent facts already.

 

Furthermore the fact that it references you to a special rule on the Techmarine page is irrelevant- the MotF does the same thing, but is obviously not a techmarine.

 

While I wouldnt complain about anyone taking them, its just not how the rules work so dont expect to be able to do it in a tournament game.

[Brother Valerius]

I believe this thread got moved over from Amicus. It is also older than the thread you linked, just sayin'. :P

 

To your point about the MOTF, I would give you that one if there was an entry for a "Techmarine Gunner" that referenced the Techmarine entry, but there isn't, so the reference to me means "This literally is the unit on page X, and we're not going to cut & paste it for you. Turn the page, you lazy bum."

 

Regardless, that's just icing on the cake compared to my main point, which is that the rules state "Techmarine" 4 times in reference to the guy, and "Techmarine Gunner" once. To me, if the rules say different things in multiple places (referring to the same unit in all instances), the one that gets said most often takes precedence. I maintain that RAW, you can take servitors with this guy (not that I would).

[Grey Mage]

And his profile certainly says "techmarine" not "techmarine gunner"...

 

Wich is interesting, if you want to take that to an extreme and say that there are no rules for such a model.

[Gaz1858]

Im actually gonna change my stance o this and say you can take servitors if you have a TFC.

 

Under the information page for the TFC it states that it is crewed by a Techmarine, not techmarine gunner. Techmarine gunner only comes in under the entry in the army list. So one part says Techamrine and the other says Techmarine Gunner. So im gonna go with yes you can

[Frosty the Pyro]

Im actually gonna change my stance o this and say you can take servitors if you have a TFC.

 

Under the information page for the TFC it states that it is crewed by a Techmarine, not techmarine gunner. Techmarine gunner only comes in under the entry in the army list. So one part says Techamrine and the other says Techmarine Gunner. So im gonna go with yes you can

Army list takes priority though on what comes with what though. I would not begrudge an oponent that did take some servitors, but I stand by that its not the actual rules.