Sweeping Advance v. We'll Be Back

[thade]

EDIT: Double post.

[SeattleDV8]

SA does not target models, it targets units. As your marines run down the fleeing Necrons, they are going to leave the fallen. Monoliths only teleport units in their turn, beginning of the movement phase I believe, and the fallen do not count as such until the beginning of their turn, when checking the factors of WBB. And you actually measure from each individual fallen Necron to units to check ranges, For WBB and for a Res Orb.

 

If they are not part of a unit before the WWB then the Monoliths Portal does not effect them.

A Necron model can only join a new Unit after a successful WWB roll.

A new unit nearby allows a downed model a WWB roll. By your logic this is a model without a unit and as such unable to be teleported.

See the trouble that causes, you now have a rule that doesn't work as it should.

A Res. Orb is checked when the model is wounded, not when downed.

Downed models from a unit with a res orb move with that unit, if they were just markers then they would remain where they fell.

Again 2 rulings in the FAQ point to the downed model still as part of the parent unit, and as so sweeping advance works.

Nothing in the WWB rules allow it to over rule the SA.

 

 

Just for your information if your local tournament uses the INAT FAQ

"NEC.13A.02 – Q: If a Necron unit is wiped out by a Sweeping Advance in close combat, can any of the models in the unit (including its damaged ones) use „We‟ll Be Back!‟ to repair themselves?

A: No, as a special rule cannot be used to save models from a Sweeping Advance [clarification]."

[thade]

INAT is sooooo bonk. I sometimes think they purposely go backwards on anything they are able. =P It's very weird. I've always been in opposition to the thing. GW tournies don't use it, so that's enough for me to dismiss it.

 

The WBB rule definitely implies that it's no longer part of a unit once the model is down, as it states the model stands back up and joins whatever Necron unit of the same type is closest of those in range. It makes a point of saying "not necessarily of the same unit." Since it stands back up and joins whatever is closest - becoming a part of whatever unit this is - then it makes sense to me that it's not part of a unit when it's down. They are "battlefield debris", after all.

[SeattleDV8]

INAT is sooooo bonk. I sometimes think they purposely go backwards on anything they are able. =P It's very weird. I've always been in opposition to the thing. GW tournies don't use it, so that's enough for me to dismiss it.

Then you would be wrong. Last years 'Ard Boys final used the INAT FAQ. That is a GW event.

 

The WBB rule definitely implies that it's no longer part of a unit once the model is down, as it states the model stands back up and joins whatever Necron unit of the same type is closest of those in range. It makes a point of saying "not necessarily of the same unit." Since it stands back up and joins whatever is closest - becoming a part of whatever unit this is - then it makes sense to me that it's not part of a unit when it's down. They are "battlefield debris", after all.

Ok then explain the 2 FAQ rulings that state they are part of the unit, and not just implied.

[Grey Mage]

The WBB rule definitely implies that it's no longer part of a unit once the model is down, as it states the model stands back up and joins whatever Necron unit of the same type is closest of those in range. It makes a point of saying "not necessarily of the same unit." Since it stands back up and joins whatever is closest - becoming a part of whatever unit this is - then it makes sense to me that it's not part of a unit when it's down. They are "battlefield debris", after all.

Ok then explain the 2 FAQ rulings that state they are part of the unit, and not just implied.

GW contradicting itself as per normal? *shrugs*

[SeattleDV8]

Indeed , for example

Dark Eldar FAQ

"Q. Does a torture amp allow a Raider to ram

other vehicles?

A. No."

Ork FAQ

"Q. Can you use the Deffrolla when Ramming

vehicles or does it only work when Tank

Shocking non-vehicle units?

A. The death rolla does indeed inflict D6 S10 hits

against vehicles, as Ramming is just a type of

Tank Shock."

[Mezkh]

lol, this thread made it's WBB roll and made me spend 10 minutes trying to find my Necron codex in storage so I could quote the rules in question, but with no luck. Ah well.

 

Anyway, downed Necrons ignore unit coherency per their rules, but they're still a part of their unit. The codex doesn't state they leave it, so they don't. Permissive ruleset and all. And we've got several army rules that STRONGLY imply that downed Necrons are still a part of their unit, to the point of being broken/not working if it wasn't the case they were. On the flipside, no rules are broken or don't work if we treat downed Necrons as still being a part of their unit.

 

All those angles wrap that argument up.

 

Therefore, when we come to the interaction with the sweeping advance rule:

 

"The falling back unit is destroyed. The destroyed unit is removed immediately. Unless otherwise specified, no save or other special rule can rescue the unit at this stage: for them the battle is over".

 

WBB rule doesn't specify the unit may be saved from a sweeping advance in any way, therefore all models in the unit, up or down, are removed, gone, finished.

[Brother Caleb]

The Monolith entry in the dex states concerning the use of the Power Matrix that:

 

If there are no eligible reserves, and a Necron unit and any Necron Lord that has joined such a unit is at least partially within 18" of the Monolith, they may phase out and re-emerge from the portal. Any models in the unit that, although eligible to self-repair, failed their 'We'll Be Back' roll at the start of the turn and were removed, may re-roll once as they emerge from the portal. If you intend to use the portal in this way during a turn then leave models that failed to self-repair on their sides until the end of the Movement phase.

 

It seems to me that this rule shows that models that fail their WBB roll are still in the unit, and if they are going to use the portal, they stay as debris. One might argue that they are in the unit only after they have failed their roll, but that doesn't hold much water, if any. If a model is in the unit after it fails and is still debris, then it seems easy to conclude that debris that has yet to roll is still in the unit. Put another way, if a model is in the unit after the WBB back roll, it's in the unit before the WBB roll.

[GeoWolf]

@SeattleDV8: Please point to me where in the FAQs it says the parent unit? Or in the Necron 'Dex. They don't, I've read both and read them again when I come in here. All it says is THE unit. It does not say anywhere "original" unit. Any unit that meets the requirements can become "The" unit to the fallen. And in response to you quote, nowhere in the Monolith Power Matrix entry does it say anything to the effect of "models that fell from this unit" or "models that failed their WBB rolls that are part of the original unit."

 

@Brother Caleb: As per the FAQ, fallen Necrons don't even count as necrons while being debris. To top the off, only ICs can join or leave units as part of their status. How then can a lowly Warrior switch units if he was part of one already? Now, if he wasn't part of a unit while down then he can join another unit upon standing.

 

@Mezkh: Yes, they ignore the unit coherency, because they are not a part of the unit. Also, it would be strange if unit coherency mattered when using the Tomb Spiders ability to pick them up. If a Tomb Spider is within 12", any unit that is the same type ANYWHERE on the board may be used to make the WBB roles. A unit can be over 36" away from the fallen, but they will join them. BTW I like your opening line. :)

[Mezkh]

Downed Necrons are still a part of their original unit, because codex doesn't say they leave it as a part of lying them down for WBB rolls.

 

The Codex states several things like they are ignored for the purpose unit coherency, but this is not the same as stating they are unitless. In fact it sort of implies the opposite I think, as if they weren't a part of the unit, you wouldn't need to state they are ignore the mechanic of unit coherency no?

 

It also says something along the lines of 'downed Necrons cannot be attacked in any way and are ignored for normal game purposes, they are treated as debris.' I could see this being used to argue infer they are a in a unitless environment, but I see it as simply stating as such that downed Necrons don't block LOS/movement/difficult terrain/Counting as Necrons, all those normal game mechanics. Leaving their unit isn't a game mechanic as mundane as that, we're not given that 'feature' as one of the examples, you think you'd need a specific statement of it for something like that to take effect, and it's stronger to infer that the opposite is the case as as then other parts of the codex and FAQ aren't 'broken'.

 

Finally Necrons who pass their WBB roll can join other units, even other ones across the board as per the tomb spyder if conditions are right for that, but the fact their is a mechanic for them to potentially swap units on passing a WBB roll doesn't rule out they were unitless beforehand. ~90% It happens to be the case a Necron that passes WBB stands up as a part of it's initial unit if members in it were still standing, but this rule covers those situations for where another same type unit is within 6" or a TS is within 12", and IMO it acts kind of to cut off a weird coherency and placement thing if an entirely downed unit could stand back up on it's own without joining anyone.

 

I'll agree the WBB and Res Orb rules are a bit convoluted and not stated clearly! But to sum up it doesn't say outright one way or the other exactly what is the case, and if you infer from the codex entry that they aren't a part of any unit, you tend to break (as in render entirely pointless and suspect) rules in other areas of the codex, while if you infer the opposite, you don't have any problems in my gaming experience. Just stay out of CC with Warriors!

[SeattleDV8]

Well stated Mezkh, thanks.

[Divergent Reality]

As a Necron player I error on the side of grouping the downed models as part of a unit for sweeping advance.

 

With minimum sized warrior squads, they tend to get wiped to the man when hit in hand to hand. So questions like this are few and far between for me.

 

But when it does occasionally occur I simply remove the entire squad, downed models and all. It is a hindrance to me. But it is only a small one.

[Pinky Narfanet]

I keep switching which way I think the rule should go. But I think I've finally got it figured out. My latest line of thinking leads me to believe that the key question isn't "Does the Necron belong to a unit?" but rather "Is sweeping advance a normal game purpose?"

 

If sweeping advance is a normal game purpose, then the downed Necrons should be left on the table as their special rules forbid them from being targeted. If sweeping advance is not a normal game purpose then they're pulled with the rest of their current/former unit. Right now, I'm inclined to think that SA is a normal game purpose and so should not impact any fallen Necrons.

[Mezkh]

then the downed Necrons should be left on the table as their special rules forbid them from being targeted.

 

Sweeping advance doesn't 'target' anything, it's rules state the unit is removed, and unless otherwise specified, no special rule may save them. The battle is over for that unit.

 

Unless otherwise specified means it has to say it the unit (or part of it in this case) is not destroyed by sweeping advance, as in ATSKNF.

 

Also for interest, the 4th ed book stated

 

The destroyed unit(s) is removed immediately. No Invulnerable save or other special rule (such as the Necron's We'll be back special rule) can save the unit at this stage

[Brother Caleb]

then the downed Necrons should be left on the table as their special rules forbid them from being targeted.

 

Sweeping advance doesn't 'target' anything, it's rules state the unit is removed, and unless otherwise specified, no special rule may save them. The battle is over for that unit.

 

Unless otherwise specified means it has to say it the unit (or part of it in this case) is not destroyed by sweeping advance, as in ATSKNF.

 

Also for interest, the 4th ed book stated

 

The destroyed unit(s) is removed immediately. No Invulnerable save or other special rule (such as the Necron's We'll be back special rule) can save the unit at this stage

Snap!

[GeoWolf]

The addendum for the 4th ed rule was to mean that the necrons are removed if caught by sweeping advance, and do not get laid down by it. It was not a shooting or CC attack, but a special ruling. But either way, not even then did it address the issue of Necrons already being on the ground from shooting, and thus had no part in the CC or it resolution. Oh, and that was 4th ed, welcome to 5th ed! :unsure:

 

I am not arguing that the unit caught is removed, quite the contrary I agree. But that is not answering the OP. Say you have a unit of ten marines and I have a unit of ten warriors. You shoot your pistols, causing 5 wounds, of which I save 2. Now at this point 3 necrons are laid on their side to represent the WBB roll next turn. *At this point you charge, and all things said, I lose the combat, and then fail my Ld test. We roll off and find that you catch me, destroying whats left of my unit of warriors. The question is what happens to the 3 warriors on the ground.

 

Now, at the point in time that I placed the *, the 3 warriors were out of the fight, and according to the WBB rules, are ignored for ALL game purposes(not sure on the exact wording, just got home from work and my brain pan hurts). Are they a part of the parent unit, and thus removed as well from SA, or are they separate from the unit.

 

In this scenario, If there are no other units in range for WBB, then the models are removed as they have no chance to get back up due to a break in the WBB requirements. However, if there happens to be another unit of warriors within 6" of the fallen, or a Tomb Spider within 12" and a unit of warriors elsewhere on the field, the requirements for WBB are still in place, and at this point the fallen would consider them to be their unit. The chain for WBB is still in place, and they would get their rolls and re rolls for teleporting.

 

This is how I read it, and interpret how it would happen. Think of the fallen as opportunists, latching onto whichever unit has the best bet of getting them back up. The Codex also doesn't expressly say that they ARE part of the unit still either, it just lays out how WBB works. and according to the wording, as long as the factors line up, they stay to get their chance. I keep going back to it, no where does it say that the fallen have to use the original unit they came from. All that matters is whichever units closest.

 

I think I had another point to make, but I just caught myself reading my own stuff over and over again. Hopefully what I said made sense, if not, maybe I can fix it later....

[Pinky Narfanet]

I find it "interesting" when people trot out old rulebooks and FAQs like they mean something. Each new edition of a game is like the "director's cut" of a movie: things get added, things are taken out--sometimes it makes the movie better and sometimes Greedo shoots first. It sucks, but that's the product that's out there. You can tell your kids that "back in the day" Han totally shot first, but it doesn't mean anything now.

 

But to the point: how, then, does one define "normal game purposes"? Sweeping advances seem pretty "normal" to me. The rule isn't in a codex, it's in the main book (unlike WBB or ATSKNF). Any unit that isn't specifically prohibited from performing one can do so. SAs happen in any game with any army.

 

Now, if you can convince me that the Necron wouldn't be removed as a casualty (a term which doesn't have a good definition in the rules), then pull them all. Otherwise I give the tie to the codex.

[SeattleDV8]

A casualty in 40K is caused by unsaved wounds. BRB pg. 15 The Shooting Sequence Bullet point 6, also in the Instant Death rules on pg. 26.

Sweeping Advance does not cause casualties, it destroys and removes units from play.

WWB does not meet the requirement to over rule Sweeping Advance as it does not mention SA.

ATSKNF does meet this requirement and so can over-rule SA.

As Mezkh and I have mentioned counting the downed Necrons as unit-free causes problems with other rules, counting them as still with the unit does not.

[Mezkh]

The addendum for the 4th ed rule was to mean that the necrons are removed if caught by sweeping advance, and do not get laid down by it. It was not a shooting or CC attack, but a special ruling. But either way, not even then did it address the issue of Necrons already being on the ground from shooting, and thus had no part in the CC or it resolution. Oh, and that was 4th ed, welcome to 5th ed! B)

 

I am not arguing that the unit caught is removed, quite the contrary I agree. But that is not answering the OP. Say you have a unit of ten marines and I have a unit of ten warriors. You shoot your pistols, causing 5 wounds, of which I save 2. Now at this point 3 necrons are laid on their side to represent the WBB roll next turn. *At this point you charge, and all things said, I lose the combat, and then fail my Ld test. We roll off and find that you catch me, destroying whats left of my unit of warriors. The question is what happens to the 3 warriors on the ground.

 

Now, at the point in time that I placed the *, the 3 warriors were out of the fight, and according to the WBB rules, are ignored for ALL game purposes(not sure on the exact wording, just got home from work and my brain pan hurts). Are they a part of the parent unit, and thus removed as well from SA, or are they separate from the unit.

 

In this scenario, If there are no other units in range for WBB, then the models are removed as they have no chance to get back up due to a break in the WBB requirements. However, if there happens to be another unit of warriors within 6" of the fallen, or a Tomb Spider within 12" and a unit of warriors elsewhere on the field, the requirements for WBB are still in place, and at this point the fallen would consider them to be their unit. The chain for WBB is still in place, and they would get their rolls and re rolls for teleporting.

 

This is how I read it, and interpret how it would happen. Think of the fallen as opportunists, latching onto whichever unit has the best bet of getting them back up. The Codex also doesn't expressly say that they ARE part of the unit still either, it just lays out how WBB works. and according to the wording, as long as the factors line up, they stay to get their chance. I keep going back to it, no where does it say that the fallen have to use the original unit they came from. All that matters is whichever units closest.

 

I think I had another point to make, but I just caught myself reading my own stuff over and over again. Hopefully what I said made sense, if not, maybe I can fix it later....

 

The whole unit is destroyed and removed, taking no further part in the game; which translates to the 3 warriors on the ground in the unit who were killed from previous shooting being removed from the game along with what is left of the squad that was run down in the Sweeping advance. Even if their is a Tomb Spyder nearby, or a Resurrection Orb, whatever the situation might be, it doesn't matter. You can't use any part of the Necron WBB rules to prevent models that are part of a unit that was caught in a Sweeping advance from being removed from the tabletop when that unit is.

 

Or in other words, you can't use your special rules to save your models and have them take further part in the game when they are subjected to a rule that says 'remove your models from the table, they take no further part in the game, and no special rules can save them unless otherwise specified'.

 

It can be tricky to understand, but once you get your head around that when you lie down Necrons they haven't left their unit (even though they could change units on passing a WBB roll!), that Sweeping Advance calls for the entire unit to be removed from play and not models caught in it, and that no rules can prevent the removal of a unit or part of in this case, it flows together.

 

 

I find it "interesting" when people trot out old rulebooks and FAQs like they mean something. Each new edition of a game is like the "director's cut" of a movie: things get added, things are taken out--sometimes it makes the movie better and sometimes Greedo shoots first. It sucks, but that's the product that's out there. You can tell your kids that "back in the day" Han totally shot first, but it doesn't mean anything now.

 

But to the point: how, then, does one define "normal game purposes"? Sweeping advances seem pretty "normal" to me. The rule isn't in a codex, it's in the main book (unlike WBB or ATSKNF). Any unit that isn't specifically prohibited from performing one can do so. SAs happen in any game with any army.

 

Now, if you can convince me that the Necron wouldn't be removed as a casualty (a term which doesn't have a good definition in the rules), then pull them all. Otherwise I give the tie to the codex.

 

Hence why I said 'for interest'. The 5th ed rule for Sweeping advance is exactly the same as the 4th ed one, except they've left out the example of a special rule in parentheses that can't save a unit from a sweeping advance. It doesn't change that the rule is written to state that no special rules can save a unit caught in a sweeping advance unless otherwise specified, and that WBB is a special rule that doesn't specify protection against sweeping advance (reference ATSKNF).

 

Maybe they should put WBB back in as the example of a special rule so that it's harder to say it isn't a special rule

[thade]

No one has addressed my previous post regarding them not being a part of any unit pre-WBB while they are lying down and "being ignored for all game purposes" as one of you said. Did that sound so implausible a path that it warranted being ignored? :devil:

 

That Ard Boyz used the INAT is both a surprise and pretty frustrating to me; the Ard Boyz tournies I played in did NOT use it...but then, they aren't RUN by GW, they're RUN by the local game store guys. Perhaps the finals are "overseen" but some GW people but I no longer see that as a basis for anything. If it were, this ruleset wouldn't be so full of holes. Why on earth are they using a 3rd party FAQ?! Why can't they just fix their freakin ruleset?!? AAAAHHH!

 

Sorry, had to get that out. Back to the point.

 

Since they are ignored until the WBB, and join the closest unit (which by their codex is not necessarily their original unit), it stands to reason that they are part of no unit while downed pre-WBB. Given that, removing them with Sweeping Advance falls out of bounds.

[SeattleDV8]

No one has addressed my previous post regarding them not being a part of any unit pre-WBB while they are lying down and "being ignored for all game purposes" as one of you said. Did that sound so implausible a path that it warranted being ignored? :P

I believe both Mezkh and I answered that, we did not ignore you or your point.

 

That Ard Boyz used the INAT is both a surprise and pretty frustrating to me; the Ard Boyz tournies I played in did NOT use it...but then, they aren't RUN by GW, they're RUN by the local game store guys. Perhaps the finals are "overseen" but some GW people but I no longer see that as a basis for anything. If it were, this ruleset wouldn't be so full of holes. Why on earth are they using a 3rd party FAQ?! Why can't they just fix their freakin ruleset?!? AAAAHHH!

I know I was quite surprised too. The final was the only part of that 'Ard Boys that was run by GW.

I share your pain. I don't understand GW's can't take this part of the game a little more seriously.

[thade]

I am now cleanly and neatly set into halves with regards to this debate. I see both sides well supported now, all coming down to this:

 

How is it they join another unit when they stand up and their original unit is out of range? Their rules say so. Well, do their rules say when they leave the previous unit? They do not specify this, and that is where I feel the real issue lies. There are two possibilities:

 

1. They leave their original unit when they are taken casualties...just like every other model in the game. The difference - which is specified in WBB - is that they are laid down on the table and ignored there until the WBB rolls take place. (Let's leave whether they "ignore" Sweep based on this rule out of our discussion for now.)

2. They leave when - after the WBB roll has been made - their original unit is not in range and they are forced to join another unit.

 

What sucks here is that these both seem equally plausible to me.

 

And we've got several army rules that STRONGLY imply that downed Necrons are still a part of their unit, to the point of being broken/not working if it wasn't the case they were.

 

I don't buy this. Let's assume they are no longer part of the unit when downed. That would mean we're going with interpretation 1, as I just outlined. Let's say all of them make their WBB rolls. Now, they stand up and join the unit that's closest to them. Whether it's their original unit or not is irrelevant, as they are abiding by the writing of the rules either way.

 

The only issue here is Sweeping Advance, which is the crux of this thread. By my first interpretation, they remain on the table. By my second interpretation, they are removed. Again, both make equal amounts of sense within the rules.

[Mezkh]

What sucks here is that these both seem equally plausible to me.

 

Yeah it's not the clearest ruleset GW has by far written. I find the 'reductio ad absurdum' type of Monolith argument (and also the GW FAQ stuff) the most convincing evidence that option two is the correct one, but -

 

Consider it this way, that you have to be given permission by a rule to do something or change a status in the 40K permissive ruleset, and that you're not given permission to change your unit affiliation up until you pass a WBB roll, whereby a rule is introduced that allows you to do so. So by default you're still a part of the unit because you haven't been told to leave it.

 

I think the biggest point of confusion is the 'debris' line, which is pretty poorly written. But it's not enough by itself in how it's worded to build an argument on that Necrons that would otherwise become casualties leave the unit, or so the story goes.

 

Not convinced? I don't really blame you! But what seals the deal for me is the other rules presented in the codex and FAQ that seem to presume option 2 is the case.

 

Here's how the Monolith thing works. A Monolith portal can teleport a unit of at least one 'alive' Necrons in the movement phase, and by doing so, grants a reroll to any Necrons (in that unit) that failed their WBB roll. If 'debris' Necrons which are lying in wait for WBB rolls aren't a part of any unit, then how would one of them that failed it's WBB roll ever get a reroll option? A model that was lying down and failed once can't ever go through because how could it ever justify hooking along onto a teleport for a unit that it isn't a part of because it's debris? The Monolith rule would infact be entirely pointless text, as it could never find itself in a situation where it's reroll ablity could be bestowed on anything: You can't teleport debris Necrons.

 

The other FAQ example isn't as strong but it states something like: 'a unit of Necrons is beaten in combat by a unit with powerweapons and falls back. To help keep a track of casualties and Res orb, lie the models down and move them with the unit.'

 

Which unit? Their unit? The one they aren't a part of? How strange!

 

So as you see, it's option two when viewed in the context of the rest of the codex is fairly compelling. Unfortunately for the Necrons, they can't have their cake and eat it too, so while playing option two with Necrons lying down still being in their unit and get the benefit of Monolith rerolls and falling back with their unit if they actually get to escape an initiative roll-off, they get penalised by their fellow bots who are still standing being caught by a sweeping advance that triggers the penalty of removing the whole unit, no special rules and takesy-backsies.

 

--------------

 

I will however point out I played a tournament game with someone where this issue came up and he had tombspyders on hand and thus wanted to leave the debris Necrons after a sweeping advance for a chance at the res. As an experienced Necron player myself I felt somewhat obligated to go over some of the above stuff for couple of minutes + the sweeping advance rule states no special rules can save them, this includes WBB, which was a bit of a contentious point in itself for some reason? But in the end I relented simply to get the game moving again, and I was winning anyway :tu:

 

But I will say goodluck trying to explain it to any new Necron players who aren't as familiar with how their armies work if it ever comes up in an actual game- it's easy to do on these discussion boards, but probably not worth your time arguing it in an actual game, and unless the Judge/TO is familiar with how WBB works you could get given any answer if you ask.

[Arnil]

Okay so this is how i see it.

 

WWB states, i am be wrong on this so please correct me, that the laid units do not participate in the assault phase right? Or something to that effect?

 

Well, SA is part of the assault phase as per the 5th Ed. rules.

 

Also this should all be cleared up when Necrons get their much needed updated codex! It not, i will say Ni!

[Arnil]

Here's how the Monolith thing works. A Monolith portal can teleport a unit of at least one 'alive' Necrons in the movement phase, and by doing so, grants a reroll to any Necrons (in that unit) that failed their WBB roll.

 

If 'debris' Necrons which are lying in wait for WBB rolls aren't a part of any unit, then how would one of them that failed it's WBB roll ever get a reroll option?

 

A model that was lying down and failed once can't ever go through because how could it ever justify hooking along onto a teleport for a unit that it isn't a part of because it's debris?

 

The Monolith rule would infact be entirely pointless text, as it could never find itself in a situation where it's reroll ablity could be bestowed on anything: You can't teleport debris Necrons.

 

If i am hearing this right then you are correct. Er reading..whatever... the necrons fail their WWB roll and die die for real. Then the monolith decides to teleport that unit back to base. Thus the reroll is representative of new necrons replacing the lost ones. Ill reference the Endless Swarm Tyranid rules. This grants a unit that died back! But it isn't the same unit it is a new one for all intents and purposes. Obviously this isn't the same thing but it is an example of a similar mindset.

 

The other FAQ example isn't as strong but it states something like: 'a unit of Necrons is beaten in combat by a unit with powerweapons and falls back. To help keep a track of casualties and Res orb, lie the models down and move them with the unit.'

 

Well this seems like a break in the rules to me. I would perfer to discount this FAQ, cause it hurts my argument ;) hehe and, because it doesn't sound right as per the rest of the rules involved!