Learning to play: first 750 point game

[Ash Tekka]

My friends and family have been trying to learn how to play so yesterday we got together and tried a 750 point no vehicle game with me being the only wolf player.

We learned alot but I have some questions that seemed to pop up during play.

 

1) To have a Wolf guard leading each of my squads do I first have to fill an elite squad with the minimum of 3 wolf guard then pull the models from there?

EX: I had two 10 man grey hunter squads each with a wolf guard leading them. Was this not legal since I didn't have 3 wolf guard total in my list?

 

2) Also my dad and friend both took missile launchers and flamers in their tactical squads and failed to actually do anything useful against my infantry. Is this normal? With the scattering it made them seem rather useless.

 

3) Can you have two IC's attached to the same unit? ex. Rune priest and Wolf Priest?

 

4) My friend likes death company and likes fielding 5 or more with a reclusiarch to lead them. My squad did pretty good versus them: 10 grey hunters(pw, motw, 2 meltas), wolf guard(motw, combi-melta), and wolf priest (wtn,runic armor). Any suggestions to make it better since I have a feeling I will continue to have to deal with them

 

We're probably going to stick with 500 or 750 point games with no named HQs, or vehicles until we get the rules down so I'll probably be running minimum with a wolf priest and 2-5 man grey hunter packs all with upgrades unless anyone has suggestions for things I should consider.

 

ps. Motw is awesome, especially on a lone wolf with storm shield:)

[CainTheHunter]

1) To have a Wolf guard leading each of my squads do I first have to fill an elite squad with the minimum of 3 wolf guard then pull the models from there?

EX: I had two 10 man grey hunter squads each with a wolf guard leading them. Was this not legal since I didn't have 3 wolf guard total in my list?

 

You need at least three of them before distributing across other packs.

 

2) Also my dad and friend both took missile launchers and flamers in their tactical squads and failed to actually do anything useful against my infantry. Is this normal? With the scattering it made them seem rather useless.

 

Flamers don't scatter. ML scatter only if You use them in frag regime, which is quite useless against marines. In krak regime they miss on roll of 3+ and then they wound on 1+ with no saves for models in PA.

 

3) Can you have two IC's attached to the same unit? ex. Rune priest and Wolf Priest?

 

Several IC can join the same unit.

 

3)

4) My friend likes death company and likes fielding 5 or more with a reclusiarch to lead them. My squad did pretty good versus them: 10 grey hunters(pw, motw, 2 meltas), wolf guard(motw, combi-melta), and wolf priest (wtn,runic armor). Any suggestions to make it better since I have a feeling I will continue to have to deal with them

 

I would not put a second mark on WG - I'd rather give him power fist, since he already has the combi-melta and won't be using the extra attack. My pack usually is 9 GH - mark, melta, power weapon and wolf standard (awesome) + WG with power fist and combi-melta. And I agree - mark of wulfen is awesome.

[rodgers37]

One thing you may have missed with the scattering, is you - the shooters BS from the roll.... (e.g shooting from a Tactical Marine, BS4, if you roll 6, you will only scatter 2 etc etc......)

 

Are you all new players? It must be quite hard to learn if you all are, i am so glad i had so many people around to help me learn to play, its really useful....

[Ash Tekka]

Wow thanks for the quick reply.

I figured I was doing the wolf guard thing wrong after rereading the codex last night and thinking about it.

 

I should have been more clear on my flamer and missile question but you gave me the answer I was looking for. We were only using scatter for the missile not the flamer. It just seemed like both were ineffective.

The armor save always seemed to shrug off the flamer and on the rare occasion that a frag missile managed to land somewhere useful the armor saved against it again.

 

Would the missile launcher have been slightly more effective if fired as a krak? I'm asking because I am contemplating getting a long fang pack together at some point and heard that missiles are good to have in there.

[CainTheHunter]

Of course against marine equivalents frag regime is ineffective because of their high armor save. Flamer is better since You get more models covered and force them to take more saves - meaning there is bound to pop some "1,2" in them. With the small blast template You are lucky to cover 3-4 models and then You have to wound toughness 4 and then he gets to make those couple of saves - pure dice luck. With krak missiles, as I said the AP is 3, meaning marines in power armor wont get any saves and will get outright killed. Now, imagine if You had 5 such missiles per turn... :ermm:

[Chaplain-Skylax]

2) Also my dad and friend both took missile launchers and flamers in their tactical squads and failed to actually do anything useful against my infantry. Is this normal? With the scattering it made them seem rather useless.

 

 

 

We're probably going to stick with 500 or 750 point games with no named HQs, or vehicles until we get the rules down so I'll probably be running minimum with a wolf priest and 2-5 man grey hunter packs all with upgrades unless anyone has suggestions for things I should consider.

 

 

Sticking with 500-750 games is very usefull for getting to know Unamed Ic's and and your regular troop qualities strengths and weaknesses, however as your not playing with vehicles you might find it a bit confusing when i comes to vehicles and such however it's easy after a while.

 

Now onto the buisiness of the flamers and Ml's, your father and his friend could use frag type but on marines it wounds on four's so it basically firing bolters at them which could be more effective. Now if they used krak missiles it may be one shot hitting on 3's but it kills outright on 2's (1's are always misses!) unless your in cover or have a Inv (Invunerable save) Now Onto Flamers they can do some serious havoc to your enemies and yourself (if the enemy has them) for its a template (Make sure your men are seprted 2" away from each other thus keeping unit coherancy and stopping template weapons from doing serious damage.) The flamer wounds on 4's and as long as your rollsa re good and theirs bad, likewise for them you'll be fine.

[Skirnir Ragefang]

1) Yes you need atleast three, but you can distribute those three to Squads as you see fit.

 

2) Flamers don't scatter. But Missile Launchers in Frag mode in small games may hit nothing at all if you are unlucky. Though krak missiles are a lot better against Marines.

 

3) Yes.

 

4)A Wolf Standard is very nice, also a Power Fist on the Wolfguard helps, since you don't lose attacks through the Combimelta and in fact gain one attack over the Grey Hunter with Power Fist.

 

Wolf priests and some Grey Hunters are a great Way to start of as a Space Wolf, so nothing to add to your list. I am a Fan of 9 Grey Hunters with Melta, Motw, and Wolf Standard with a Wolf Guard with Power fist and Combimelta in a Rhino. Since you Footslog feel free to include another Hunter and a Special Weapon. It is a very versatile unit on its own. Another nice Wolf Guard setup is a Wolfclaw and a Combi Weapon.

[Ash Tekka]

I knew fellow wolves wouldn't let me down.

We completely missed the whole AP thing. We didn't even look at it figuring that related to vehicle and penetration roles only.

Yeah we're all basically new to playing. My dad and I have been building and painting the models since around 3rd edition but never sat down and really tried to play.

We got Space Hulk for Christmas and had been playing that and really enjoying that so we figured we should take a stab at normal 40k to see what happens.

We know we're missing rules here and there but every time we run a game we learn something new, the trouble is remembering it all:)

[CainTheHunter]

I knew fellow wolves wouldn't let me down.

We completely missed the whole AP thing. We didn't even look at it figuring that related to vehicle and penetration roles only.

Yeah we're all basically new to playing. My dad and I have been building and painting the models since around 3rd edition but never sat down and really tried to play.

 

 

I wonder how You were making armor saves then :ermm:. The idea is You look at the weapon's AP and if it is equal or lower than the target's armor save, that model won't get any armor save (but it may use invulnerable or cover save). So if the marine in power armor (AS 3) is hit by krak missile (AP 3), he get's no armor saves. But if the marine is wearing terminator armor (AS 2), he get's to save as normal.

[Ash Tekka]

1) Yes you need atleast three, but you can distribute those three to Squads as you see fit.

 

So if I took 3 wolf guard and two grey hunter packs, does that mean I could distribute them as 2 grey hunter packs with one wolf guard each and then just have a single wolf guard wandering around by himself?

[CainTheHunter]

1) Yes you need atleast three, but you can distribute those three to Squads as you see fit.

 

So if I took 3 wolf guard and two grey hunter packs, does that mean I could distribute them as 2 grey hunter packs with one wolf guard each and then just have a single wolf guard wandering around by himself?

 

Yes, it works this way. But be warned - if You play for killpoints and that lone WG gets killed, he immediately concedes a killpoint to the oponent - it counts like the whole WG pack has been killed.

[Ash Tekka]

I wonder how You were making armor saves then :). The idea is You look at the weapon's AP and if it is equal or lower than the target's armor save, that model won't get any armor save (but it may use invulnerable or cover save). So if the marine in power armor (AS 3) is hit by krak missile (AP 3), he get's no armor saves. But if the marine is wearing terminator armor (AS 2), he get's to save as normal.

 

Power armor guys were saving on a 3+ and terminators on a 2+ unless the wound was from a power weapon. In that case the power armor guy died unless he had a invuln save he could roll and the terminators used their invuln save.

 

My grey hunters died off pretty quick when my dad rolled up with his power weapon equipped squad.