Aramis_the_Red Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 The other day I played against my friends guard army. He heavily relies on psyker battle squads to break units by using their leadership reducing psychic power and then shooting a unit till it has to take a leadership test. How does this work w/ tycho's leadership buff rule? The way we ruled it, the unit would use tycho's ld, and them subtract the modifier from the psyker battle squads power. Did we do this right? What are your thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 This is a very hairy situation. Lemme give you the quick answer first. No. This is not the case (however you'll come into disagreement on some levels I'll tell you about it later). The wording on the battle squads power does not affect any leadership. It affects the target units Ld. Rites of Battle very clearly states that you "use his leadership" (Tychos). His Ld has not been effected by the power, the unit in question has. Therefore the unit in question is still at LD whatever minus whatever- but Tycho is at his standard Ld. Now for a longer more convoluted story. INAT FAQ has ruled the Battle Squad power to be a modifier - and as a result would effect all rites of battle powers (DA/BA/BT). I have NO idea how they came to that and last time I tried to discuss it, the thread got quickly shut down. Personally, I have seen no decent argument for that interpretation. On another side note....conversely -> Tycho has a (strange) newer version (wording wise) of Rites of Battle which forces us to use his LD. (The change from the "may use" to "all blah blah blah use tychos..." ) This means if Tycho gets hit with that power, all the angels are at the modified LD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Remember that the INAT is house rules. 0b :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Long story short, use the Psyker power on Tycho, then shoot his entire army and watch it run away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 I don't think it will work if he has a Chaplain in tow. 0b :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 I don't think it will work if he has a Chaplain in tow. 0b Def. will. The chappy wont make a different to him. He'll still be at LD10 minus whatever and therefore the rest of the BA will be at Ld10-whatever. Astorath to make them fearless however...now thats another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 There is always a way. ;) 0b :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguinarian Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 I don't use Tycho, but instead Psycho, so I'm not arguing this ruling. I have to say I didn't interpret RoB that way. I assumed it to be very cut and dry as worded, and would have played it exactly like the OP did. I believed it to mean that "everyone" on the battlefield under his command used his Ld10 for any and all morale and pinning tests. What more is there? And why wouldn't an attached Chaplain who makes his unit fearless negate this power? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Sang, I may be wrong- but i dont think you understood either the situation, or the question asked. It wasnt in reference to Tycho, but in reference to how Tycho interacts with the Battle Psykers ability to reduce leadership of a targetted unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattsama Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 I'm going to have to agree with Morticon. RoB says they use his Ld and the power doesn't effect him. In fact that's a brilliant situation, at least until it's FAQed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 My interpretation of RoB are the same as the OP... In fact I FAQd it as such for an Indy GT I helped run in Florida earlier this month. This is one of the issues I have with the INAT FAQ. On another note the INAT FAQ has been updated for the new BA codex, certainly worth taking a look at. 0b :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 I'm with Mort on this one, you can nerf the target units leadership but its still going to use tycho's LD for all tests as it doesn't replace their leadership its instead of. Adversely if you hit Tycho with the nerf then the entire army would be forced to use the lower leadership as per tycho's rules. This one really is cut and dry with not ambiguity, to rule otherwise is to change the rules themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 Okay rereading this thread I agree with Mort, any unit can use Tycho's leadership & is not affected by the PSB unless it targets Tycho. Sorry for any confusion. 0b :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 one more point bo. its not can it is must, sounds small but plays quite differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 No problem there. :P 0b :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattsama Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 one more point bo. its not can it is must, sounds small but plays quite differently. Yeah. It's really a terrifingly double eged sword. Leafblower lists could focus just on one unit and gogo shooty across our whole lines with little worry. On a side note, and this may be FAQed somewhere (I don't know, I've never faced IG nor looked into them), but can a unit take multiple leadership hits to grind the leadership down to 'gaunt levels? Or Is it the best nerf wins?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 i dont see why you couldnt do multiple LD hits, for example in apoc hit a squad with the battle squad and then us a Librarian to FoD them away. or how bout combining a battle squad and a celulux (sp) assasin, that would be a really really cool use of tactics right there. The game really needs more combination manuevers like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Droofus Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 i dont see why you couldnt do multiple LD hits, for example in apoc hit a squad with the battle squad and then us a Librarian to FoD them away. or how bout combining a battle squad and a celulux (sp) assasin, that would be a really really cool use of tactics right there. The game really needs more combination manuevers like this. I dunno. That doesn't really seem like tactics to me. More like the 40k equivelant of button mashing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted June 23, 2010 Share Posted June 23, 2010 well it requires forward planing, positioning, timing and a bit of luck to pull off, that right there is tactics. Especialy if its done using the assasin as you would need to postion it just right in order to not affect youre own squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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