Lessons learned from playing BA?

[dendrofil]

So, after playing a few games I've actually learned a thing or two (believe it or not) about what is useful and what is not equally as useful.

It certainly depends on what armies you are facing of course, but so far, against Nids, IG and CSM there are a few things that have come out very clearly.

 

(Prepare for wall of text!)

 

- Death Company Marines scare the crap out of most people.

First the opponent laugh at them for having rage and start talking about how they will be kited without any bigger problems.

Then I drop them in a Droppod in front of their precious tanks or whatnot and rejoice as they mow down more than double their own points cost regardless of what they are facing. Of course they are accompanied by the Chaplain of doom!

After that, everything in the enemy army that is in range will go after them, leaving other units unscathed.

Oh! Did I mention they are a troop choice? ;)

Oh how I love my DC.

 

- Tacticals get no love from me.

I used to be the Tactical-dude of Tactical-dudes, going with almost only them in earlier editions.

So far, the few times I have even used tacticals in 40k5, they haven't done anything sensible. This is probably more due to me not really knowing how to use them properly than them being sucky.

After these games, I have come to the conclusion that there is nothing a Tactical Squad can do, that a well equipped Rhino/Jump Pack-squad can't do better.

 

- Baal Predators are better at scaring people than actually killing their armies.

Of course, loads of feeble rolls from my Baalies play in to my opinion here. They have not really killed enough models to earn their points cost back.

However! Since I use them without sponsons, they are effectively moving their full 12" as often as I possibly can, redeploying them and breaking line of sight as much as I can and still shooting with their TL Ass.cans., and people tend to go pretty far to take them out.

 

- A fully equipped Assault Squad with Priest and Libby is a gamebreaker.

Even if this 12-man unit is almost impossible to hide it will take down whatever it charges. Be it tanks, Daemon Princes or a mob unit of Gaunts, they will go down, if not on the (furious) charge, then in their own phase.

 

 

These all makes fine points to the Blood Angels being a really tough list to beat, even if the player is still a bit new to the rules (like me).

I love my BA's. :(

 

 

Anyone else learned anything they felt a bit surprised about while playing?

(And no, the fact that Mephiston actually kicks behinds does not count.)

[Chaplain Gunzhard]

My experience has been almost exactly the same, except for the Tactical squad one.

 

All of my assault squads have jumppacks. I might try some mech version someday, but they are already modeled with jp from previous editions.

 

So I run 3 Assault squads with JP

1 - DC in a razorback HF

2 - Tactical squads (combat squad-ed) in Razorback (1 HF, 1 lascannon)... the sarg and special weapon ride in the razorback, and the heavy weapon and friends hang in high ground (hopefully).

 

It's not much in the way of range - but it does help keep some of the enemy tanks honest... as we do naturally lack long range in our typical lists.

[Quantra]

Things I've learnt fairly recently are the awesomeness of priests, power armour + fnp is same odds of passing an armour save as artificer armour (ignoring AP3 and if my maths is correct).

 

Storm Raven's aren't nearly as awesome as they look on paper. Although they have all the rules they really aren't hard to take down.

 

A furioso + frag cannon + heavy flamer is an awesome first turn drop pod unit. Those 3 templates really rip stuff up and scare the hell out of the opponent.

 

Other things I have discovered earlier on are that the DC are far more reliable and cost effective (when played properly) than it may appear from reading the forums. VVS aren't worth their points, I am still yet to make good use of them. And like you have found 10 man RAS to be the very solid backbone of my army. I kit mine out with a power fist, 2 melta guns and tag a priest along. Recently I have been taking power weapons on the priests making these units spank just that bit harder.

[dendrofil]

A furioso + frag cannon + heavy flamer is an awesome first turn drop pod unit. Those 3 templates really rip stuff up and scare the hell out of the opponent.

 

Ahh. I really need to try that out next time.

 

Other things I have discovered earlier on are that the DC are far more reliable and cost effective (when played properly) than it may appear from reading the forums. VVS aren't worth their points, I am still yet to make good use of them. And like you have found 10 man RAS to be the very solid backbone of my army. I kit mine out with a power fist, 2 melta guns and tag a priest along. Recently I have been taking power weapons on the priests making these units spank just that bit harder.

 

Exactly like I use my RAS. 2 MG + Fist + Power Weapon is just devastating, especially on the charge.

And yes, DC is definatly underrated. The only time I got "kited" was when everything in range was already killed, so I didn't really mind them running through a building trying to reach something that was out of reach.

[wookielips]

1. DC are awesome, long as you give em a ride. almost every time ive charged with them, my opponent just removes whatever their target is. i dont even get to roll the dice!

 

2. yeah, VV are over-priced. too many points to take 8+, and 5 just don't get the job done.

 

3. as much fun as it seems to be, lists that rely on dropping in your opponents backfield just don't work. ive tried mass DP, mass dread DP, tons of DoA jumpers, you name it, and the fact is that everything that can arrive in your opponents deployment has to have a JP (increasing its cost) and will NEVER arrive exactly when you want it, even with the DoA re-roll. sad, but true. i wish it wasn't, cause i have a sweet list with dante, sanginor, and tons of SG/VV, and it just does NOT work.

 

4. speaking of dante....... yes, he is worth every penny. give him a SP, maybe a chappie or libbie, and let him roll with his SG homies, and you won't be sorry. i never, ever, ever leave home without dante + SG (2xIP, 1xPF, chapter banner) and SP w JP & PW and they are always my mvp. always.

 

5. don't take PW on characters that have the same init as a squad they are with. the wounds they do get allocated to 1 or 2 models in your target squad and you end up being much less effective with that 15 points than it could have been elsewhere.

 

6. Sanginor, while hard to justify prior to a game, is friggin awesome. yes, he's expensive. but how do you put a cost on:

1.his buff to your sgt (making him a nice HQ model for zero more points),

2. his re-roll against a tough enemy and

3. his attack bubble. when played right, that +1 attack bubble can turn RAS into vets and DC/SG/VV into MONSTERS. remember, only 1 model out of a squad has to be within 6" for the squad to get the buff (same as the SP bubble). stretch coherency so you can get 3+ units with that buff, and then come back to BnC and tell me how happy you are that you read this. just try him. trust me.

 

7. SPs are vital, and a lot more workable than i first thought. pay very close attention to coherency and disembarking with them, along with how and where you move them, you never know when that 6" bubble can feel like its 1', and other times when it feels like its only .006"

[Andrew_Beck]

mine.

 

1) almost never DS with full JP list

2) DENDROFIL is completely right with the RAS+SP+LIB, its total scything.

3) RAS+SP+RECLUS also another nice unit. especialy if in same army as the "combo" above.

4) one unit of SG+SP can and will down 2times its cost.

5) muss try DC

[Sanguinarian]

So, after playing a few games I've actually learned a thing or two (believe it or not) about what is useful and what is not equally as useful.

It certainly depends on what armies you are facing of course, but so far, against Nids, IG and CSM there are a few things that have come out very clearly.

 

(Prepare for wall of text!)

 

- Death Company Marines scare the crap out of most people.

First the opponent laugh at them for having rage and start talking about how they will be kited without any bigger problems.

Then I drop them in a Droppod in front of their precious tanks or whatnot and rejoice as they mow down more than double their own points cost regardless of what they are facing. Of course they are accompanied by the Chaplain of doom!

After that, everything in the enemy army that is in range will go after them, leaving other units unscathed.

Oh! Did I mention they are a troop choice? :lol:

Oh how I love my DC. You do know they are a non-scoring Troop choice right?

 

- Tacticals get no love from me.

I used to be the Tactical-dude of Tactical-dudes, going with almost only them in earlier editions.

So far, the few times I have even used tacticals in 40k5, they haven't done anything sensible. This is probably more due to me not really knowing how to use them properly than them being sucky.

After these games, I have come to the conclusion that there is nothing a Tactical Squad can do, that a well equipped Rhino/Jump Pack-squad can't do better.

Tacticals get the long-range heavy weapon if you take 10, but I'm starting to think a 5-man RAS in a TLLC Razor for 50pts less would be better.

- Baal Predators are better at scaring people than actually killing their armies.

Of course, loads of feeble rolls from my Baalies play in to my opinion here. They have not really killed enough models to earn their points cost back.

However! Since I use them without sponsons, they are effectively moving their full 12" as often as I possibly can, redeploying them and breaking line of sight as much as I can and still shooting with their TL Ass.cans., and people tend to go pretty far to take them out. You must take sponsons to be UBER SCARRIER!!!

 

- A fully equipped Assault Squad with Priest and Libby is a gamebreaker.

Even if this 12-man unit is almost impossible to hide, it will take down whatever it charges. Be it tanks, Daemon Princes or a mob unit of Gaunts, they will go down, if not on the (furious) charge, then in their own phase.

 

 

These all makes fine points to the Blood Angels being a really tough list to beat, even if the player is still a bit new to the rules (like me).

I love my BA's. :D

 

 

Anyone else learned anything they felt a bit surprised about while playing?

(And no, the fact that Mephiston actually kicks behinds does not count.)

I learned that Deep Striking my 10-man DC with Reclusiarch in an LRR 6" from my DC Dreadnaught's Drop Pod in my opponent's deployment zone makes me giddy!!! Can you say, BAR-B-QUE? I KNEW THAT YOU COULD.

[wookielips]

i need to try DC in a pod. without packs they are very reasonable, and not jumping means they cant rage a long way out of your planned use for them

[dendrofil]

2. yeah, VV are over-priced. too many points to take 8+, and 5 just don't get the job done.

Noted. Was thinking of either a HG or VV, just for the cool factor.

 

3. as much fun as it seems to be, lists that rely on dropping in your opponents backfield just don't work. ive tried mass DP, mass dread DP, tons of DoA jumpers, you name it, and the fact is that everything that can arrive in your opponents deployment has to have a JP (increasing its cost) and will NEVER arrive exactly when you want it, even with the DoA re-roll. sad, but true. i wish it wasn't, cause i have a sweet list with dante, sanginor, and tons of SG/VV, and it just does NOT work.

Noted as well, never really liked the idea of DS'ing your whole army. The single-pod DC is great since it gives headache to the opponent from turn one, keeping a Dread in a pod as well might mean that it doesn't show up in time. :/

 

4. speaking of dante....... yes, he is worth every penny. give him a SP, maybe a chappie or libbie, and let him roll with his SG homies, and you won't be sorry. i never, ever, ever leave home without dante + SG (2xIP, 1xPF, chapter banner) and SP w JP & PW and they are always my mvp. always.

In my "club" we have agreed not to use Special Characters so I haven't tried anyone yet. :/

 

5. don't take PW on characters that have the same init as a squad they are with. the wounds they do get allocated to 1 or 2 models in your target squad and you end up being much less effective with that 15 points than it could have been elsewhere.

 

Since the unit the Priest is in, is usally the really hardhitting unit/s, I tend to give him a PW and it has so far worked out great for me. :tu:

 

6. Sanginor, while hard to justify prior to a game, is friggin awesome. yes, he's expensive. but how do you put a cost on:

1.his buff to your sgt (making him a nice HQ model for zero more points),

2. his re-roll against a tough enemy and

3. his attack bubble. when played right, that +1 attack bubble can turn RAS into vets and DC/SG/VV into MONSTERS. remember, only 1 model out of a squad has to be within 6" for the squad to get the buff (same as the SP bubble). stretch coherency so you can get 3+ units with that buff, and then come back to BnC and tell me how happy you are that you read this. just try him. trust me.

 

Same goes here for as for Dante, have yet to try the SC's. Would like to try all of them actually. Hopefully I will some day. :)

[wookielips]

2. yeah, VV are over-priced. too many points to take 8+, and 5 just don't get the job done.

Noted. Was thinking of either a HG or VV, just for the cool factor.

 

then go SG. they are awesome

 

3. as much fun as it seems to be, lists that rely on dropping in your opponents backfield just don't work. ive tried mass DP, mass dread DP, tons of DoA jumpers, you name it, and the fact is that everything that can arrive in your opponents deployment has to have a JP (increasing its cost) and will NEVER arrive exactly when you want it, even with the DoA re-roll. sad, but true. i wish it wasn't, cause i have a sweet list with dante, sanginor, and tons of SG/VV, and it just does NOT work.

Noted as well, never really liked the idea of DS'ing your whole army. The single-pod DC is great since it gives headache to the opponent from turn one, keeping a Dread in a pod as well might mean that it doesn't show up in time. :/

 

expect that dread to get popped, and fast. its nigh-impossible to keep it alive past turn one. so you better make reaaaaaaaaaal sure it kills its points

 

4. speaking of dante....... yes, he is worth every penny. give him a SP, maybe a chappie or libbie, and let him roll with his SG homies, and you won't be sorry. i never, ever, ever leave home without dante + SG (2xIP, 1xPF, chapter banner) and SP w JP & PW and they are always my mvp. always.

In my "club" we have agreed not to use Special Characters so I haven't tried anyone yet. :/

 

so then do a JP reclusiarch with IP. or a libbie for back-field blood lance + shield. same principle works, just run the risk of problems dropping in or being out of IP range. either would do tho, and they are cheaper....

 

5. don't take PW on characters that have the same init as a squad they are with. the wounds they do get allocated to 1 or 2 models in your target squad and you end up being much less effective with that 15 points than it could have been elsewhere.

 

Since the unit the Priest is in, is usally the really hardhitting unit/s, I tend to give him a PW and it has so far worked out great for me. :tu:

 

but if they are with a hard-hitting unit, your opponent is spreading the 2-3 power wounds onto 1 model, maybe 2, instead of a full spread because it is at a different initiative. i'd still suggest saving the points and putting them on a different I model's PW, or getting IPs somewhere, or somefin.

 

6. Sanginor, while hard to justify prior to a game, is friggin awesome. yes, he's expensive. but how do you put a cost on:

1.his buff to your sgt (making him a nice HQ model for zero more points),

2. his re-roll against a tough enemy and

3. his attack bubble. when played right, that +1 attack bubble can turn RAS into vets and DC/SG/VV into MONSTERS. remember, only 1 model out of a squad has to be within 6" for the squad to get the buff (same as the SP bubble). stretch coherency so you can get 3+ units with that buff, and then come back to BnC and tell me how happy you are that you read this. just try him. trust me.

 

Same goes here for as for Dante, have yet to try the SC's. Would like to try all of them actually. Hopefully I will some day. :)

 

they are great in situations. in others, you just shake your head and wonder why you brought him.

 

a friend of mine runs 60 RAS w 2 libbies and preds to back it, and got deep into 'ard boyz with that list. i personally hate it, way way too unfun and vanilla. but to each their own.

 

since your club is limiting the use of special characters, may i suggest an inducted grey knights termi master, with retinue? provide your own fluff, get a massively hard-hitting "character" and an unlimited range psychic hood. worth its weight in gold, for the cost of one of the BA doods.

[Quantra]

It's true dropping anything close to the enemy DZ is likely to get the brave soul trashed and this is why I like the frag cannon furioso. It can still chew up a lot of troops on the turn it arrives and even if it doesn't win it's points cost back this tactic has proven to be worth the extra points 'lost'. Something I have done to good effect is if deploying second and my opponent has stretched out across the table is to deploy in one corner then drop the pod in the opposite corner meaning anything there will likely have to spend a turn dealing with the pod and it's contents before beginning the trek across the board to the rest of the action. So long as you realise whatever you pod into the front lines will die I feel this tactic is a viable one. That's why I try to keep the dread as cheap as possible, no extra armour or magna grapple just enough to get those templates down.

 

On the front of priests with power weapons striking at the same initiative, I used to take plain priests with as few upgrades as possible to keep them cheap and expect them to get picked out. However the amount of times my opponents have actually taken the priests out is not that great so I started trying them with power weapons and I was pleased with the results, so I kept them. On the other hand Lemartes in a DC with his higher initiative is what I consider to make him a beast, however I do feel you have to have a storm raven to transport him and non JP DC in so it is a lot of points to go that route but is pretty devastating.

 

I have tried the SG once and I thought they were pretty cool but I don't have my own models, I'd definitely like to try them again but I can't help but think yet another RAS/Priest combo would work out better xD

[wookielips]

try the SG. they each re-roll one die, and with a SP with a PW (and/or dante) you get a unit that is easy to hide, strikes hard as nails, can pop tanks and mow infantry, and as long as you don't charge termis, banshees or other things that have PW or ignore armor, their 2+/4+ makes them very rough to deal with.

 

ps. stay away from plas or other ap2 guns. it makes you sad watching them go off the table.

 

pps. you will never find cheaper IP/PP/PF that can move 12". ever.

[Einholt]

I love the look of sanguinary guard but their to expensive and vulnerable to be a true threat, now honour guard on the other hand...

A 5 man honour guard with jump pack, 3 or 4 meltaguns, 4 storm shields and 1 with twin lightning claws, attach dante to this squad and oh boy, you can deepstrike behind a tank, pop it then the next turn take a lot of shooting and take on the uber unit that raider etc was hiding and tarpit it until you can get the charge on it with a RaS or DC.

If your enemy does divert all its attention to wiping out this unit they have to shoot / assault through 3+/4+ FNP with 3+ invulnerable save.

[daboarder]

VVS aren't worth their points, I am still yet to make good use of them. And like you have found 10 man RAS to be the very solid backbone of my army. I kit mine out with a power fist, 2 melta guns and tag a priest along. Recently I have been taking power weapons on the priests making these units spank just that bit harder.

This one I have to disagree with, VAS with DoA's and HI are absolutely GODLY!! seriously in an all JP force at the very least they allow me to pin down fast annoying units such as bikes, I have found that you need to be agressive with you're deepstrike and not be too affraid of losing them on the drop. Squad size helps with this alot, at 6 men total I can place the first and then I have enought room to "lean" the squad out of a close mishap OR into a slightly to far assualt range. Also make sure to drop them as a support element, that means keep them near the SP's that should be with your RAS.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

It's great to hear so much positive feedback about our new codex from fellow BA players. I am definitely still in the honeymoon phase.

 

So here are my thoughts:

 

1. Assault marines are much better now, what a vast improvement over the PDF! Here are my current configurations:

 

10 man squad (jump packs)/power fist, meltabombs & infernus pistol (sergeant), meltagun & flamer

+ Sanguinary Priest (jump pack)/power sword

 

Having both a power fist & power sword (WS5) in the same unit is very powerful. This unit can take out it's MEQ equivalents - Plague Marines, Berzerkers, Grey Hunters, etc. I like to run one flamer for horde control since I also have a meltagun & an infernus pistol.

 

5-7 man squad (jump packs)/power fist & infernus pistol (sergeant), meltagun

+ Sanguinary Priest (jump pack)/power sword

+ Chaplain (jump pack)/infernus pistol

 

The Chaplain is optional for this squad but if you can afford him & have a spot in your FOC he is a huge buff to the unit. I equip him with the pistol over the Priest since he has 2 wounds & the 4++.

 

If I am running the Sanguinor then my sergeants all have a thunder hammer, stormshield & meltabombs. Whichever one gets the buff from the Sanguinor is basically a flying Arjac minus Eternal Warrior.

 

The smaller unit is more smashy in assault but eats up more of your FOC. Luckily we can take the Chaplain as an elite choice so it hasn't been a problem for me.

 

2. Death Company

Here is how I like to run mine:

Lemartes

+ 5 Death Company Marines (jump pack)/infernus pistol, 3x power sword, power fist

+ Death Company dreadnaught/Blood Talons & heavy flamer

+ Stormraven/extra armor, TL lascannon & TL multi-melta

 

This is my favorite unit by far. To me a Stormraven is a must have to get the DC dreadnaught into assault. Combined with Lemartes & the DC they can wipe out anything including a full unit of 8 Bloodcrushers. The main drawback is Lemartes & his DC Marines are small in number so it can be a bit tricky protecting them after their initial assault.

 

3. Honorguard & Vanguard veterans

I like to run the HG with a Recluisarch so they can reroll hits on the charge. I run this unit in another Stormraven with a Furioso (extra armor & heavy flamer). This is another small unit and I will either charge them straight in as soon as possible or hold them back and use them to mop up towards the end of the game.

 

Pointswise I can only afford to run either the HG or VV in my FOC. Its been a toss up between the two units. If I run with the Vanguard veterans then I attach typically will attach a Priest if they ride in the 2nd Stormraven... Otherwise I will deepstrike them & try to make use of their Heroic Intervention.

 

Here are my current builds:

 

Honor Guard jump packs)/Blood Champion, pair of lightning claws, Chapter Banner+power sword+infernus pistol, power sword+infernus pistol, Novitiate (meltabombs, optional)

 

Vanguard veterans/power fist & stormshield (sergeant), 4x lightning claw + stormshield (meltabombs - optional)

 

4. The Sanguinor & Dante

These are my two favorite special characters. I have not used Mephiston as yet. Dante to me is a sleeper choice, he doesn't look that good on paper but on the table he gives some big buffs. The ability to Hit & Run is very strong. The Sanguinor takes a lot of skill to play well or he'll die to lots of small arms fire.

 

5. Baal predators

I typically take two when I run them and equip them with the TL assault cannon & HB sponsons. They've always been good & the ability to outflank plus how their fast movement works now are two big improvements. I am currently focusing on an airforce army so I typically don't run them that often but I still love them dearly. :lol:

 

0b :lol:

[JamesI]

VVS aren't worth their points, I am still yet to make good use of them.

 

I have to disagree.

 

Vanguard have been my best unit. Use them as if they were an old VAS and give that a try. 8 of them aren't that expensive (assuming you don't load them out with power weapons on every guy, like the Old VAS rules, I use 3 power weapons and the rest are normal vets to keep cost down).

 

Now, I am considering dropping them to test SG, but the 5 man limit for SG scares me.

 

 

To add in my other lessons learned:

 

Reclusiarch is just great. My favorite HQ in the dex, I've run him with both Vanguard and regular RAS and ripped anything apart.

 

Twin-Lascannon Razorbacks are great. I know everyone seems to prefer the assault cannon version, but its so easy to stay hidden then fly out and pop an enemy tank with the lascannon razor.

 

Predators seem good on paper, not as great on the table. I still use one, but am considering turning it into attack bikes.

 

Vindicators are the best anti-anything unit. Only way I ever kill Land Raiders anymore is Vindicator shells.

[TrentL]

Vindicators are the best anti-anything unit. Only way I ever kill Land Raiders anymore is Vindicator shells.

 

This one I don't get ... isn't the Vindicator a ordinance which means it scatters? Which if it scatters and the "hole" in the center of the blast marker isn't over the land raider its half strength? Are you just hoping that you scatter small / don't scatter at all in order to use the full Strength 10 to get a pen?

[JamesI]

Vindicators are the best anti-anything unit. Only way I ever kill Land Raiders anymore is Vindicator shells.

 

This one I don't get ... isn't the Vindicator a ordinance which means it scatters? Which if it scatters and the "hole" in the center of the blast marker isn't over the land raider its half strength? Are you just hoping that you scatter small / don't scatter at all in order to use the full Strength 10 to get a pen?

Yep.

 

There is a lot of luck involved in killing vehicles with Vindicators. Heck, there's a lot of luck in killing anything with Vindicators. But lately I've played games where they didn't have much else to shoot (due to either facing pure mech army or the assault squads already beating down the other stuff).

 

In a recent game, I faced a Land Raider with a rhino on each flank. First Vindicator fires at the Raider. Scatters onto the Rhino out of LOS. Kills it. Second Vindicator fires on the raider. No scatter kills it.

[Mattsama]

Lets not forget that our Vindys are fast, making them well worth their points. And Ordnance into transports makes me happy! <_<

[Isryion]

Here are my thoughts, a lot of which has already been mentioned:

 

Death Company work for me. They are essentially our most cost effective "veteran" unit, provided you go without jump packs. As mentioned many times, they need a ride. DC can be effective in small units or large with a chaplain. I've gotten what I pay for with regard to these guys many times over. They either draw a lot of fire, hold up superior units, or kill whatever they touch (and sometimes all of these things).

 

Baal Predators are really only effective when outflanking. I've had too many get killed turn 1 when I left them on the table. While rending is good, I haven't rolled well enough. I still think they are flexible and a solid choice, I can see why some have turned to the vindicators. On a flamestorm Baal, I only go with the cannon and no sponsons.

 

Low model count. Our armies seem to have a low model count, especially when taking multiple sang. priests, elite chaplains, or one of our expensive characters. A couple of fast vehicles drops us a down a few marines on most lists. I can never fit enough in.

 

Not a blitz list. In most cases, I've had better success with combined arms rather than just an all out assault army. A tactical squad or two, vehicles, and maybe a dev squad put pressure on the enemy to move or get out of their comfort zone while my assault squads get set to clean up.

[Quantra]

VVS aren't worth their points, I am still yet to make good use of them.

 

I have to disagree.

 

Vanguard have been my best unit. Use them as if they were an old VAS and give that a try. 8 of them aren't that expensive (assuming you don't load them out with power weapons on every guy, like the Old VAS rules, I use 3 power weapons and the rest are normal vets to keep cost down).

 

I really will have to give this a go since everytime I mention on this forum how the VVS have been bad for me you suggest this to me but I never try it. I guess when I'm sat in my room writing lists they just never seem to fit or get dropped for something else, next opportunity I will start a list off with this unit (but will probably go power fist + 1/2 power weapons)

 

 

Also want to say what an awesome thread this is, I'm loving reading how everyone finds their own awesomeness in the Blood Angels!

 

 

Also a quick note on the Baal Pred, I have used one from time to time and always outflanking, it's amazing the amount of armour this thing has popped by arriving in a position where it is possible to shoot the rear armour. I'm yet to try a flamestorm Baal but I do have the parts to convert one now. From someone who generally doesn't do the tank thing or really like tanks the Baal Pred can be a lot of fun to play with.

[Mattsama]

I face quite a few other power armor armies. I think in my next game I'm goin to outflank a Template Baal and see what I can't flush out!

[JamesI]

VVS aren't worth their points, I am still yet to make good use of them.

 

I have to disagree.

 

Vanguard have been my best unit. Use them as if they were an old VAS and give that a try. 8 of them aren't that expensive (assuming you don't load them out with power weapons on every guy, like the Old VAS rules, I use 3 power weapons and the rest are normal vets to keep cost down).

 

I really will have to give this a go since everytime I mention on this forum how the VVS have been bad for me you suggest this to me but I never try it. I guess when I'm sat in my room writing lists they just never seem to fit or get dropped for something else, next opportunity I will start a list off with this unit (but will probably go power fist + 1/2 power weapons)

I run mine with a thunderhammer, powerfist, power weapon.

 

Basically for similiar cost to the old VAS, but without a free DC involved and no meltaguns.

 

Heroic intervention is really best saved for rare opportunities, some particular enemy vehicle you need to kill or some nasty shooty unit you will have trouble getting to normally.

 

 

As for the Baal, I still like them, but Vindicators have definitely become my preferred tank.

 

I keep thinking I could drop the Vanguard for an Honor Guard or Sanguinary Guard, but the problem is the games where I face really nasty CC stuff, I need a good unit to stomp them down. And the other units are just too small to provide what I need.

[SamaNagol]

Land Raiders are huge. Any scatter of 3" or less will *usually* still hit.

 

/

 

Sanguinary Guard with a Priest are in fact far better than they look initially. And are HORRIFIC when they get the charge against anything, including Stormshield Terminators.

[JamesI]

Land Raiders are huge. Any scatter of 3" or less will *usually* still hit.

Yep. And those 2 inch scatter sometimes let you kill the raider and some guys near it.