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[AngelsOfSalvation]

Go Down till you find the inquisition icon

[Leonaides]

Briefly, and I'm really not trying to get 2 cries of troll in 24 hrs:

 

Humid tropical planet - Fine, not a problem at all, but no need for your human tribals to have antural anti-freeze in them. Not to mention that this could only be as a result of genetic modification, so not exactly natural either.

 

Primitive shields are not going to help against starship grade ordinance - these weapons are presumably designed to be launched at a planet from orbit, not by crashing the ship into the ground, so they will be big, unsubtle and effective. The chances of outrunning a forest fire are relatively slim as well, so if this was such a big fire, I doubt the inital search parties would be able to survive long enough to get back to their tribes even if they did survive the inital blasts. Also, 1 scouting ship is unlikely to carry enough ordinance to set light to the entire continent. Humid forests are actually fairly good at putting out fires - thats why it takes men to burn down rainforests afer all...

 

And how has this serf survived? In a broken starship in the middle of a continent-wide firestorm? Even if the flames didnt get in (though the ship itself must have big holes in it), the heat and lack of air would have finished him off. Then how does this language specialist happen to know so much about technology? I have met several language specialists (incl Oxbridge graduates) - and most of them I wouldnt trust to turn on a plug socket!

 

How ould the tribals even know that the weapons were weapons? If they are at the levels of spears and shields, they wont understand projectile weapons at all. Armour is possible, if they happen to see it on dead bodies (that havent been burnt to ash), but I really doubt weapons.

 

There is more, but I have to go make some food. Others will be along shortly I'm sure.

 

I do like the accidental catastrophy idea though, I just feel it needs a bit less "its the end of everything - suddenly the perfect society appears" kind of thing, and there needs to be a bit more logic behind it.

 

Good luck.

[Brother Sevrance]

They speak English

 

The only language spoken in the Imperium is Gothic, wether it be High (aristocrats, governors, inquisitors people of a higher status) and low Gothic (normal people- hab workers, servents, bondsman). Now to go back a ways, like before the Emperor even made himself known. Earth had go thru many changes many political and pretty much ceased to be what we know of it today. Even if America or England where to survive the political changes the language wouldn't have. I can understand an older version of Gothic but English is stretching it. The language American's speak is on the opposite side of the spectrum that Medieval England spoke.

 

Because there is no known way of making fire on the humid planet constantly blitzed by monsoon rains, these people have adapted to the harsh conditions in which they carve out a living, possessing a natural antifreeze in their blood preventing them from freezing.

 

Now why would they worry about freezing living in the jungle? If It's humid and tropical even with rain they wouldn't have to worry about dieing of exposure. Now what they would have to worry about is the effects of the hot, humid and wet climate they have to live in. Not only is it a warren for diseases and bacteria, it would have been hell on their internal systems. An environment like that I could understand their bodies adapting over time as they see their technology breaking down, but a natural anti-freeze would be the exact opposite to what they needed. Maybe like some type of waxy skin to keep from taking in to much moisture to protect against skin rot or maybe a evolved immune system that could fight off what this planets air would do to them maybe.

 

Besides that I couldn't really read thru anymore of it. Keep at it bud! The Lexicanum and the Librarium are invaluable resources to use when writing IA's and even narratives about Asartes Chapters.

[AngelsOfSalvation]

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[AngelsOfSalvation]

Leonaides:

 

"Primitive shields are not going to help against starship grade ordinance - these weapons are presumably designed to be launched at a planet from orbit, not by crashing the ship into the ground, so they will be big, unsubtle and effective."

 

I relaised this when i wrote the passage, as they would still carry some protection for themselves, regradless of its usefulness. do you think they were expecting something to fall from the sky and kill them all?

 

sorry if that sounded harsh.

 

Also:

 

"And how has this serf survived? In a broken starship in the middle of a continent-wide firestorm? Even if the flames didnt get in (though the ship itself must have big holes in it), the heat and lack of air would have finished him off"

 

Valid point, but i still need someone to survive. help me with this peice please.

 

Again:

 

"I have met several language specialists (incl Oxbridge graduates) - and most of them I wouldnt trust to turn on a plug socket"

 

Science fiction, not realism. And he was meant to be incredibly good at languages, so that he could parley with the occupants of the planet, or if they declined, blow them to the hell.

 

those were my thoughts anyhows.

 

That is all, and thanks for your help once again, much appreciated. ;)

[Brother Sevrance]

I won't...I can't give a C&C to this. I'm sorry brother read the resources... I just...ya.....

[Espada Azul]

I think what Brother Severance is saying is that, since you decided on the Lost Legion route of Chapter lineage, things are going to get... complicated.

 

While GW itself left the details on the two Lost Legions deliberately scarce to give players wriggle room with regards to army-building, it's not an idea that's very popular among people who are conscious of the background (which Liberites tend to be). Much like female Marines, it's something that requires a lot of thought and work to even begin to suspend the disbelief of people, and in the universe of Warhammer 40000 where pretty much anything can happen, that's saying a lot.

[Leonaides]

Those who hid behind shields fled back to the tribes, warning them of the unknown monster that was simple Imperial Ordinance

Implies rather strongly that a simple primitive shelf will protect vs starship ordinance.

 

But on to the new stuff:

 

as they were not governed by the Codex Astares

Even assuming your chapter was/is one of the missing 2 legions. Every legion was broken up into chapters. And wehre is your Primarch when the cahpter Master gives your marines up to chaos. Or if thats him, why didnt the loyalists go with him?

 

thanks to the sacrifices made by many initiates, who were used to house Progenoids (often several hundred).

Quite simply, all wrong. It takes about 90 years to get 1000 sets of geneseed gronw, and acceptable hosts are far too rare to be wasted in such a way as to sacrifice them needlessly. Also, only ever 2 progenoid glands in one marine. not hundreds.

 

operations that remove the Progenoids are fatal

No, actually they are not. The marine suffers no loss of anything by the removal of the progenoids after they have matured. The only reason they arent all automatically removed as soon as they'r emature is basically a 'dont keep all your eggs in one basket' thing. If they were all removed and stored, and something happened to that store, the chapter would be wiped out with no way to make new marines. So they do a half-and-half deal instead. Consider that apparently the Blood Angels were reduced to 50 living marines, and took much less than 650 years to be back at full strength.

 

There was still the problem, however, of choosing a new Legionmaster .It was deemed "Insane" by those who had survived the downfall, that one man should control the entire might of one space marine Legion. Despite this, the decision was taken forward: There would be a new Legionmaster.

Eh? So the surviving marines decided that it would be insane to appoint a new legion master, then went ahead and appointed a legion master? No-one else would appoint a legion master for them, so it must be the marines who'd just said that they didnt want a legion master who decided that they should have a legion master, who they had already decided that they didnt want. If you understood that, then you should understand whats wrong with that piece, if you didnt understand it then you ought to realise that that piece needs to go because it creates confusion.

 

Round about now I suspect you're realising how hard it will be to make your chapter one of the lost legions... I'd really suggest not doing it, myself, as it only makes your job far far harder, with many more hoops to jump through and problems to solve, and doesnt actually add anything to your chpater as people who will read it will get as far as "The Imperial Angels are a First Founding Legion..." and switch off. Sorry, but they will. But if you really want to go for it then I suggest you read up a lot on the background, have a look through other DIY's, and all the resources on the B&C to help you.

 

Oh yeah, and prepare to have a lot of nit-picking...

 

Good luck,

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Round about now I suspect you're realising how hard it will be to make your chapter one of the lost legions... I'd really suggest not doing it, myself, as it only makes your job far far harder, with many more hoops to jump through and problems to solve, and doesnt actually add anything to your chpater as people who will read it will get as far as "The Imperial Angels are a First Founding Legion..." and switch off. Sorry, but they will. But if you really want to go for it then I suggest you read up a lot on the background, have a look through other DIY's, and all the resources on the B&C to help you.

 

Oh yeah, and prepare to have a lot of nit-picking...

 

This, plus what esteemed Brother Azul said.

 

 

There are so many hoops to go through when creating a Chapter on a sound, firm, basis that making them a Lost Legion or a Chapter of Female Marines is asking for a healthy does of very critical comments.

 

Many of us in the Liber Astartes have struggled with Chapters, multiples of Chapters in some case, and it is not an easy thing to do.. I've spent almost three months - maybe more - away from this site and my own IAs because it's harder than you think.

 

Take a look at the Rift Lords, the Stonebound or anything by Grey Hunter Ydalir to see the kind of effort required and the time frames you need to think about in terms of how long it will take.*

 

 

*Not to say no one else is good or anything, but these guys are prime examples :D

[AngelsOfSalvation]

Go Down!

[AngelsOfSalvation]

right then.

i am giving up on the imperial angels, as it seems too difficult to create the right fluff.

so i am making a legio divinatus legion with CSM rules as they would probably be deemed heratics, however they still fight for the emeperor.

the chaos rules also allow for space marines, but with extra awesomeness, i have made little/no fluff for them, but have a colour scheme in mind.

it goes like this

Chaos black basecoat

2:1 Chaos black/Boltgun metal

Devlan mud wash

2:1 Chaos Black/Basecoat Brown in patches

Shining Gold brush on Patches

Devlan mud wash

i will post a model marine like this when i get the chance

the wash helps them to appear dirty and battleworn, whilst the gold parts make the armour seem as if it is in a state of disrepiar, their armour being once gilded with gold, the patches painted gold on the image being blotchy/flaking. :P .

Unit types, i have this:

Legion Divinatus Unit Types ( Alternates For CSM Codex )

Much as the worshippers of chaos worship Slaanesh, Khorne, Nurgle and Tzeench, the Members of Legion Divinatus find certain traits within their warriors to be worth appraisal. Namely, Excessive Courage, Faith, Wisdom or Zeal. As such, warriors who show such traits are often gathered together into squads where their abilities can be of use.

After all, what use is a crazy zealous axe- weilder in a squad of Ballistics specialists?

Chaos Marines-CCW + BP= Divinatus Valkarian ( loyal marine bodies with chaos combat weapons + BP )

Chaos Marines- Bolter =Divinatus Ballisticam ( loyal marines with sprinkling of chaos bits ( faces on guns like gargoyles on churches )

Chaos Raptors- CCW + BP + Jump Pack= Angels ( loyal marines with sanguine wings and some chaos bits )

Khorne Berzerkers- CCW + BP + Special Rules= The Visionaries ( khorne berzerkers + chaos Warriors )

Plague Marines- CCW + BP + Special Rules = The Faith Brethren ( heavily armoured marines )

Noise Marines- Blastmaster, Sound Guns + Special rules= The Choral Saints ( loayal marines with converted boltguns and backpacks ( necron bits )

Thousand Sons- Speical Bolter, Armor, Rules = The Sprits Reborn ( loyal marines painted like ghosts )

Cultists- =The Beleivers ( flaggelants with guns )

Obliterators- = His Divine Might ( teminator with lots of guns built in)

Defiler- = Will Of The Loyal ( bipedal version )

Chaos Terminators- Power Fists, Storm Bolters= Truth Preachers ( normal terminators with combi weapons )

Marks, Powers, Etc:

Khorne= Zeal

Tzeench= Wisdom

Slaanesh= Courage

Nurgle= Faith

Lesser Deamons:

Cherubim?

Eagles?

Deamon Princes:

Machines with Men inside-?

Giant Angels?

Warriors with excessive powers, over-embellished armor and things that make him, her different

Iacton Qruze- Ressurected Spirit?

Any Comments Please Post! Thanx once again!

[AngelsOfSalvation]

First, this isn't the Army List forum it is about the background and building of a DIY force. Secondly, don't bump your own threads unless you have added new details to it. - Ferrata

[Leonaides]

Dead after 3 days? Thats a bit harsh... But given the lack of stuff to comment on, what are we supposed to write? You appear to have come up with a colour scheme (which is just that, a colour scheme so is down to personal preference). And you've gone and given funny names to all the units in the Chaos Dex. You do realise that you'll still end up talking about them to your opponents as 'plague marines' or 'bezerkers' during games dont you, becuase your opponent probably isnt going to care waht they are called if its different to the codex. That may sound harsh, but its true. So again, what are we supposed to comment on?

 

So lets start with this (the only bit which I can think of commenting on):

so i am making a legio divinatus legion with CSM rules as they would probably be deemed heratics, however they still fight for the emeperor.

Why would they be considered heretics?

 

I'll also point out that there is no Legio Divinatus in any of the HH novels. There is a Lectitio Divinatus, but thats a completely different thing.

[AngelsOfSalvation]

Thnx Leonaides.

 

I thought that a legion THEMED on the lectitio divinatus would be good, as something that the empeoror could rely wholly upon in case of another betrayal, because they would not, or so i beleive, betray their god-emperor. i thought of it a a better equipped and more radical, early inquisition. ( CSM codex has more special WEPS and Oblits, which represent the pinnacle of mankinds technical advancement in this case ) I know CSM codex says they mutated and stuf but thats what they would be for me.

 

 

i thought they would be deemed heretics by other space marine legions because they beleive in the emperor as a GOD. as far as i know, Space Marines do not beleive this.

[Leonaides]

Not neccessarily. Some marine chapters probably do worship the Emperor as a God, but they're most likely to be more recent ones without close ties to any 1st-3rd founding chapters during their formative years (basically ruling out contact with people who are most likely to rever the Emperor as the ultimate man, but not a God). Even if they are the only ones who believe him a God, I dont think other chapters would deem them Heretics, but they may believe that your chapters beliefs are heretical (note - there is a difference).

 

And the Emperor can already rely just as much on other marines who 'only' believe that he's the ultimate man - every chapter bar the Grey Knights has had marines fall to chaos in some manner or other, so unless your chapter are still wet behind the ears (proverbially) they will have had a marine or two turn.

 

a better equipped and more radical, early inquisition

. This dates your chapter to the second founding then. Or are they one of the missing legions? Both paths are fraught with controversy - especially as all the marines then will have believed that the Emperor wasnt a God. Let alone you'll have to decide where they come from, and what happened to change their views from the norm.

 

You may find it easier to say that "Chapter X was founded to guard the Y region, during a period of unrest and open rebellion agains the Imperium. At the same time, Adeptus Ministorum adepts were sent to re-dedicate an old shrine-world to remind the populace of the Emperors Light. After many centuries, the shrine-world has grown due to safer pilgrimage routes and the improved prosperity brought by the protective influence of the Chapter X. The resultant increase in the faithful has had an effect on the marines in the chapter, as new brothers are inducted with stronger beliefs in the divinity of the Emperor. This gradual change in the doctrine of the chapter has been noticed by the Sector Ecclesiarcy, who have endeavoured to gift the chapter with significant bounties and ancient war-materiel in recognition of their duties and responsibility in the defence of the Emperors domain. The masters of Chapter X see this as nothing more than their right, and a proper reward for theri unceasing efforts to defend the region, but amongst the higher ranks of their closest marine allies some dismay has been noted at the thought of a brother chapter being 'bought' by the Ecclesiarchy, and as time goes by this disquiet is sure to reach the ears of the Inquisition..." for example. Bunch of well equipped marines, with excessive piety, with access to rare equipment, and the potential for rather 'questionable' relations with other arms of the Imperium. Sounds roughly the sort of thing you're after, without too many large plot problems.

 

If you wish to use the Chaos Codex, then I'd suggest not using Cultists, Lesser or greater Daemons, Daemon Princes, Defilers or Obliterators. All of which are quite definately Chaos Traitors only. The Defiler, for example, is a design that was born in the Eye of Terra, fusing Daemon to metal. - The only peple who would know how to make/use/repair one are quite definately Traitors and you said your chapter wants to be the 'misunderstood good guys' so they wouldnt associate with them.