Rune Priest Base Size

[NovaScotius]

Hi All,

 

I've just gotten myself the metal Rune Priest model to lead my army, and I'm a bit stuck with what base to put him on. I know that you should really try and put him on the base that he's supplied with, but the 25mm slot base looks a little small for him - his cloak and feet overhang the edges a bit.

 

I've tried sizing him up by eye for a 40mm base, and that looks a lot better (no crazy overhanging feet), but obviously, it's not the base that he came with.

 

If I were to take him to a local tournament, could this be regarded as 'modelling for advantage'? I shouldn't imagine so, as he's not supposed to be chopping things up in combat all the time, bit I just wanted to get your opinions.

 

Thanks ;)

[Spacefrisian]

Go ahead with it it should be fine.

[morehardcore]

from my experiance people dont care if the base is bigger but a more annoyed if it is smaller

[stinkenheim]

The official line is that the model must be used on the base it was supplied with.

However, in my experience no one will complain if you mount him on a slightly larger base unless he has rules that relate to base size. E.g, Seth's Whirlwind of Gore and Canis' ability to use the number of models in b2b contact as attacks.

If you go to a tournament you may need to ask the organiser first just in case.

[NovaScotius]

Thanks for the replies guys! I think I will put him on the larger base... it gives him a little more 'presence' on the tabletop! :)

[Taeken]

I did the same thing to my Rune / Wolf Priests. As you said, it just fits better. It also helps define that they are leaders when mixed in with a large pack of GH/BC too.

[wiplash]

i use a 40mm base for all my power armoured HQ and wolf guard :)

[Valerian]

Thanks for the replies guys! I think I will put him on the larger base... it gives him a little more 'presence' on the tabletop! :)

 

Yep, all of my heroes/HQ selections are on 40mm bases. Nobody has ever cared, so long as there is no special rule that would give you an advantage. I haven't done it for my Wolf Guard in Power Armour, but I am considering it.

 

V

[hmk17]

The problem is it gives you advantage by the standard rules... extra range for shooting phase, extra charge range, extra coherency, etc. Any time you would measure anything from that model, the out come is altered.

 

If you do want to play in official stuff, talk to the TO and try to get clearance before hand. They will probably need you have a proper based model available, as most of the competitive guys are sticklers for these sorts of things.

 

 

Typically, casual stuff has leeway, though. And the BRB does point out that you have ask your opponent if it is okay to play such a model. Just be prepared to not be offended when someone does say "no".

 

 

Artistically, I understand the desire to make a model look badass and epic. Larger scenic bases allow that. Game-wise I'm not going to object to it being on a 30mm base or a square base as those are roughly the same size. I see 25mm PA guys on 40mm Terminator bases... that's really pushing it. (Just like glued shut drop pods... grrr!)

 

 

My advice is to do something more unique that will flex your hobby muscles. Use both bases.

 

Take a larger base and cut a slot for the 25mm base to fit. Then magnetize the two together. Base, paint, and presto... epic looking scenic base, that can convert to standard size if necessary.

[PKAwolf]

I used to use an old 1st or 2nd ed Wolf Captain and back in those days, the scale was horrible. He was a whole head shorter than the current marines. So I put him on a 25mm base and glues it to a 40mm base and smothered it in snow flock. Made him taller and stand out as something special. And kinda maybe sorta counts as mounted on the base it was supplied with.... (yeah its pretty thin)

[the jeske]

obody has ever cared, so long as there is no special rule that would give you an advantage

other then A with bigger base you get extra range to charge . B you force more models in btb with your HQ that is offten harder to both hit and hurt then a normal GH C in multi unit combats it is easier to pin down a unit of you have a mixed size of bases , specialy with counter attack.

[NovaScotius]

Wow - I didn't realise basing a single model differently could have so many implications! :devil:

 

I've been cleaning all the flash and mould lines off of him this evening ready for assembly tomorrow... After reading all of the points raised here, I will probably now mount him on a 25mm base to avoid any potential conflict during a game.

 

As a bit of a remedy which seems to have worked quite well, I'm putting him on the base 'backwards' so the shallow part of the slotta-base circle is at the front of the model (Normally this is a pet hate of mine as models look as though they will fall over, but in this case it actually looks better!)

 

And thanks to hmk17... I really like the idea of magnetising the bases so I can have the 25mm mounted on the 40mm... the bonus to doing this way is that he gets even taller, giving him more presence on the battlefield... and if someone gets uppity, I can reduce him to regular base size :)

[Warhorse47]

Glue a small magnet under the 25mm base and a washer under the 40mm base. That way you can use whichever you want/need to.

[VorpalDoom]

I base all my Wolf Guard on 40mm bases, as well as my HQ choices in power armor.

 

Advantages:

 

When the 40mm based model is in base-to-base contact, it's far easier for models within the unit to get that 2" attack range deal.

 

When disembarking from a vehicle, the 40mm base can be placed just as far away from the exit point as a 25mm, but you gain that extra 15mm of distance, thus making it easier to shoot, move and assault. It's a game of inches, and every mm counts!

 

Templates have a harder time hitting more models if the bases are larger (assuming models are still kept at 1.5-2 inches away from one another), as the unit is spread out more. At the same time, this makes it easier for the template to hit in general, as there is a larger area being covered by legit targets. So, in essence, you make it harder to hit more, easier to hit less.

 

Psychic powers that eminate directly from the rune priest (aside from shooting) gain that little bit of extra distance. Tempest's wrath for example.

Keep in mind, it works similarly from a vehicle, you use the vehicle for said ability, which is a much larger change in distance than a 15mm larger base.

 

Eaiser to stay within range of an objective, namely for shooting. Similar idea to that of disembarking to fullest advantage.

 

There are disadvantages as well.

 

As the previously mentioned template issue, easier to hit less, harder to hit more, this goes both ways.

 

Larger based models have more trouble squeezing into small areas. This includes getting into combat (namely for ICs), as well as avoiding difficult/dangerous terrain. We've all seen a Rhino traffic jam in the middle of the board, every toothpick-width of space matters!

 

As the large base may make it easier for your unit to get into combat, it also makes it easier for your opponent. Large based ICs are more vulnerable to being picked out in a combat.

 

Disembarking in a cramped space can sometimes be near impossible due to a large base, always take care with placement.

 

 

 

Most of the changes due to a large base go both ways. All in all, it's very, very, very minimal.

 

I've been playing with my Heroic dudes on 40mm bases for years (in tournaments and friendly games). I have only ever gotten one complaint, and that was because my opponent thought my battle leader was in terminator armor with his lightning claws, and that I couldn't sweeping advance. His fault, I always mention it to my opponents. i rarely, if ever, use terminators.

 

I'm a fan of 40mm bases, providing the model suits it. All of my wolf guard are in dramatic poses, loaded with pelts and big weapons, they all take up the space, and 99% of people I play love the idea, and love the fact that my "special dude" is on a noticeable base.

[hmk17]

Wow - I didn't realise basing a single model differently could have so many implications! :lol:

 

I've been cleaning all the flash and mould lines off of him this evening ready for assembly tomorrow... After reading all of the points raised here, I will probably now mount him on a 25mm base to avoid any potential conflict during a game.

 

As a bit of a remedy which seems to have worked quite well, I'm putting him on the base 'backwards' so the shallow part of the slotta-base circle is at the front of the model (Normally this is a pet hate of mine as models look as though they will fall over, but in this case it actually looks better!)

 

And thanks to hmk17... I really like the idea of magnetising the bases so I can have the 25mm mounted on the 40mm... the bonus to doing this way is that he gets even taller, giving him more presence on the battlefield... and if someone gets uppity, I can reduce him to regular base size ;)

 

 

No problem. As warhorse pointed out, simple disc magnet from hobby stores / interweb and a cheap metal washer from a hardware store. Easy stuff.

[Grey Mage]

The problem is it gives you advantage by the standard rules... extra range for shooting phase, extra charge range, extra coherency, etc. Any time you would measure anything from that model, the out come is altered.

While I agree with you in some respects I must disagree with you here. The drawbacks of a large base more than outweigh any potential benefits- more vulnerability to templates, easier to get range on you, easier to be out classed by sheer numbers in assault on your IC, issues getting out of transport vehicles with a full squad....

 

But yeah, Ive got alot of the old termies who have double bases. In general I find the 25mm just fine for my PA stuff- but Id probly do exactly what you described if I ever felt it wasnt.

[hmk17]

More vunerabilty, maybe for the individual model; but not for massed units. That scenario has unit guys living at a potential cost to an IC. (Variables aside, there is sometime when unit is the greater threat than the IC.)

 

Legal Ex:

 

Wolfguard in TDA w/ Cyclone Missile Launcher is split to head a pack of Long Fangs. You now have a 40mm model in a unit of 25mm models. Should your opponent drop a Vindicator shell, the 40mm will soak up more space under the template thus "saving" more of the unit from the template.

 

 

Besides, quoting problems with disembarking hardly makes up for the fact that it boils down to extending barrels in the end.

[stinkenheim]

i have never had any complaints about me 'extendingthe range os my weapons' by putting models on a 40mm base.

I do it for all my wolf guard and characters, i have even modified a 40mm base to make a wider bike base for my wolf gaurd biker.

At the end of the day, no one really thinks that adding a couple of millimeters onto a bolt pistol shot is cheating and I would be very suprised if it ever came up in a game, even in tournaments.

 

I do it for two reasons, firstly it looks cool. Thats the main factor in my decision. If it looks better i will do it.

Secondly, and not far behind, it stops my models overlapping their bases to stupid levels. This is important to me because i convert my things quite heavily and I don't want them getting bashed up as you try and get them in base contact. The bigger base helps with this as it means there is more space around the model so less chance of stray bits getting caught or scraping the paint off of it.

 

Also, the amount of 'range' you gain is minimal. Certainly not enough to kick up a fuss about. its not like i'm putting a guy on a bike base to enable me to get an extra couple of inches in charge. Or putting him on the Trygon base for example. Also, most of the time if i'm advancing towards something i measure from the front of the base. The front will still be in the same place whether the model is on a 25, 40 or 60mm base. Its not like I'm suddenly gaining extra movement. If i move sideways, then i need to move further to get out of sight of the enemy, I am also more likely to remian in terrain than with a smaller base. Liekwise if the terrain is dangerous I am more likely to remain in it, thus forcing more dangerous terrain tests.

 

I would be disappoined if someone tried to call me out as a cheat because I wanted my models to stand out, I certainly wouldn't say that to someone who had true-scaled (gain more LOS) and are also usually on larger bases. As I say, if it looks cool then do it. Rule of cool outways most things imo.

[Whitefireinferno]

Yes but would you complain If I wanted Canis or Seth to "stand out" ? and most of what has been said basicly putting something on a 40mm base that should have been on a 25 is Bending the rules eg any power that requires to be measured from the base outwards like say I mount My sang preists on 40's 6 inchs from the 40 is ALOT more that 6 inchs from a 25mm base so yeah Id not make a fuss about it during the game Id just make dicky comments like care to take a CM off that range? wouldnt enforce it but yeah Kinda bad play but wouldnt stop me.

[Grey Mage]

Yes but would you complain If I wanted Canis or Seth to "stand out" ? and most of what has been said basicly putting something on a 40mm base that should have been on a 25 is Bending the rules eg any power that requires to be measured from the base outwards like say I mount My sang preists on 40's 6 inchs from the 40 is ALOT more that 6 inchs from a 25mm base so yeah Id not make a fuss about it during the game Id just make dicky comments like care to take a CM off that range? wouldnt enforce it but yeah Kinda bad play but wouldnt stop me.

I would complain about Canis, unless you put him on a smaller base, because the rules specificly say otherwise.

 

As for your Priest, I really wouldnt care, the half an inch of difference doesnt figure into my plans, and the drawbacks are as big as the benefits.

 

Though I would expect it to be a nicely done base, not just a partially painted peice of standardized plastic.

[stinkenheim]

Yes but would you complain If I wanted Canis or Seth to "stand out" ? and most of what has been said basicly putting something on a 40mm base that should have been on a 25 is Bending the rules eg any power that requires to be measured from the base outwards like say I mount My sang preists on 40's 6 inchs from the 40 is ALOT more that 6 inchs from a 25mm base so yeah Id not make a fuss about it during the game Id just make dicky comments like care to take a CM off that range? wouldnt enforce it but yeah Kinda bad play but wouldnt stop me.

 

You obviously didn't read my first post about not doing it to models that have specific abilities relating to enemies in abse contact etc.

And seriously dude, complaining that maybe an extra marine or two got FNP? I know i sure as heck wouldn't bother. To me the game is just as much about the aesthetics as it i the rules, but more imortantly its about having fun.

If something looks cool then i'll let it slide, especially if the only difference is an extra 30mm in the width of a sphere regardless of what that sphere was for (FNP, TW etc)

[Valerian]

Yes but would you complain If I wanted Canis or Seth to "stand out" ? and most of what has been said basicly putting something on a 40mm base that should have been on a 25 is Bending the rules eg any power that requires to be measured from the base outwards like say I mount My sang preists on 40's 6 inchs from the 40 is ALOT more that 6 inchs from a 25mm base so yeah Id not make a fuss about it during the game Id just make dicky comments like care to take a CM off that range? wouldnt enforce it but yeah Kinda bad play but wouldnt stop me.

 

Having the larger bases has some in-game effect, but it goes both ways (as pointed out by several) with some that are beneficial and some that are harmful, and the overall impact is really negligible either way. The guidance to use the bases that models were supplied with isn't even two years old, and guess what 5th Edition, I was modeling my heroes on 40mm bases before you were even a twinkle in Jervis' eye.

 

If you wanted to put a Sanguinary Priest on a 40mm base, I wouldn't have a problem with it whatsoever. For one, he would look cooler and it would really help that Independent Character stand out. For another, you could put him in Terminator Armour and he would be on a 40mm base anyway. The difference is only 7.5mm in any specific direction - do you really care that much?

 

 

V

[the jeske]

For another, you could put him in Terminator Armour and he would be on a 40mm base anyway.

only why would he do that as it makes 0 sense for a SP.

. The difference is only 7.5mm in any specific direction - do you really care that much?

well it is against the rules. the bad sides of big bases can be countered[your placing your models in the movment phase not me] , but there is nothing I can do with you getting a longer charge . If I made a true scale LR [lets say I call play counts as Iron Hands and I call them mini brother hood fortresses] 1/2 half bigger put them side ways[doesnt matter LR are 14 everywhere] and after move use the free pivot to gain 1/2 the LR range as extra compering to "normal" LR would it be fair ?

[stinkenheim]

You do not get extra assault/move range because of a larger base. I don't know how you paly but i measure from the front of the base. If there is a limit for my deployment zone and i place the front of the base touching it, then regardless of the size of the base it is still in the same position and so it would still be moved the same distance. Its nt like i'm magically moving it an extra 1" or 2.

Same goes with the weapons, i'm still measuring from the front of the base, it'sgoing to be in the same position regardless of the size.

As for your example, yes it would be legal. But i could do something similar with a normal land raider. It isn't cheating, and if you ahd gone to the effort of making something like that people would likely be more relaxed in their approach. You might get asked why its moving sideways but there is nothing preventing you from doing that in the ruebook (to my knowledge anyway)

[the jeske]

You do not get extra assault/move range because of a larger base. I don't know how you paly but i measure from the front of the base.

when you get out of a transport a part of your base has to be within 2" of a door/ramp etc . a bigger base will be further[because it is bigger ] . If I put an assault squad on cavalery bases I would gain almost 2" move.

 

As for your example, yes it would be legal. But i could do something similar with a normal land raider.

but a LR has its normal GW made size, If I make the Lr 3 times as long I can do first turn charges. the same [in spirit not in range] is using bigger bases for models supplied with smaller ones.

 

 

If there is a limit for my deployment zone and i place the front of the base touching it, then regardless of the size of the base it is still in the same position and so it would still be moved the same distance. Its nt like i'm magically moving it an extra 1" or 2.

take two rhinos move both 12" get out with a normal base out of one and with a dread base out of the other and check if the range is the same.