Anti MEq/horde unit

[Brother_Fatiswon]

i was thinking about using a Devastator squad, in a Non standard fasion

10 strong+Plasma Cannon+x1+Plasma Pistol+Power weapon+Melta bomb+Rhino

wieghts in at about 260-270ish..

Tactics would be along the lines of Flanking/MEq hunting/SC+spec wep sniping w/ BS 5 template...

too far out of the box?

 

maybe run two in a more bare bones fasion... x10+PC+Rhino (x2) 230 x2... supporting each other, with a Whirl wind in the backhalf for pinning units down...

[Koremu]

Only one Heavy weapon in a ten man squad? Why not use a Tactical Squad and be scoring and have a special weapon.

 

Also, BS does little for the template in most circumstances.

[Giga]

My primary MEQ/horde killers are tactical squads, sternguard, speeders, th/ss terminators, command squad, and HQs. Here's how & why:

 

Tactical Squad with flamer & combiflamer, in a rhino - tons of wounds from templates & rapid fire that are great against hordes, and will force saves on MEQ

 

Tactical Squad with flamer & plasmacannon, with a razorback - the plasma cannon is very effective against MEQ, and pretty darn good against hordes, too, though they'll prolly get cover saves

 

Sternguard - take a big unit, with two heavy flamers, and watch as they kill a whole lot of hordes, or spam MEQ with wounds that will inevitably cause some to die

 

Vulkan He'Stan - is generally awesome against both hordes & MEQ, though watch out for power fists

 

Pedro Cantor - won't kill much on his own, but his +attack aura really means your tacticals are going to be far better in close combat against the likes of orks or other marines, orbital bombardment can also do a number on big units out of cover

 

Speeders - with multimelta & heavy flamer they do excellent job at killing hordes or throwing tons of wounds on MEQ

 

Librarian - THE AVENGER means you can slaughter both hordes and MEQ effectively

 

5 th/ss termies - excellent MEQ killers

 

Command Squads with 4 plasmaguns - will kill lots of marines

 

 

 

Other options that I don't use much, but that are still great against both MEQ & hordes are: Redeemer, Crusader, typhoon speeders, dakkapredators, and thunderfire cannons.

[Brother_Fatiswon]

giga-i just copies and pasted that... goin look and ponder that later...thank you.

 

koremu: Idea was NON scoring..means not as much of the target for killhammer tactics. "expendable" was the idea.. 2nd only one inch can win a confilct or entire campaign: also provides that cannon that many more layers of protection... "keeps, oh it's just a single Plasma cannon firing all 6+ turns, as well as using the unit to tarpiting/rhino to tank shock. this were a few.. not all the ideas i was pondering...

[Brother_Fatiswon]

Tactical Squad with flamer & combiflamer, in a rhino - tons of wounds from templates & rapid fire that are great against hordes, and will force saves on MEQ : 215*

 

Tactical Squad with flamer & plasmacannon, with a razorback - the plasma cannon is very effective against MEQ, and pretty darn good against hordes, too, though they'll prolly get cover saves 215*

 

Sternguard - take a big unit, with two heavy flamers, and watch as they kill a whole lot of hordes, or spam MEQ with wounds that will inevitably cause some to die:270*** (keeping them alive, and in range.. maybe if you put them in reverse..)***

 

Vulkan He'Stan - is generally awesome against both hordes & MEQ, though watch out for power fists 190*

 

Pedro Cantor - won't kill much on his own, but his +attack aura really means your tacticals are going to be far better in close combat against the likes of orks or other marines, orbital bombardment can also do a number on big units out of cover 175*

 

Speeders - with multimelta & heavy flamer they do excellent job at killing hordes or throwing tons of wounds on MEQ 140x2 210x3...*

 

Librarian - THE AVENGER means you can slaughter both hordes and MEQ effectively 100*!(how bout x2 libbys on bikes attacted to a x3m scout bike unit with a homing beacon with X7/x3 TH/SS|LC waiting on deck to beam down.. hmmmm)

 

5 th/ss termies - excellent MEQ killers 200*

 

Command Squads with 4 plasmaguns - will kill lots of marines 175*

 

* mine at 10x w/rhino+pC only runs 240....i can see all these units, doing better at raw number of dead marines..

*** i hvae issue with razorgunshields, and/or running combat squads. does match my inturp of the Codex...IMO

[Giga]

Actually, this is how I run them pointswise:

 

Tactical squad with rhino, flamer, combiflamer, missile launcher - 240 pts

 

Tactical squad with razorback, flamer, plasmacannon - 215 pts

 

5 th/ss termies - 200 pts (if I'm running lysander or calgar, I'll take a unit of 2x LC and 3x th/ss instead)

 

Command squad with 4 plasmaguns & razorback - 215 pts

 

9 Sternguard with powerfist and two meltaguns, in rhino - 295 pts

 

8 Sternguard with powerfist, two meltaguns, 5 combimeltas, in rhino - 295 pts

 

9 Sternguard with powerfist and two heavy flamers, in rhino - 305 pts

 

(I prefer units of 9 sternguard because I usually have either pedro or a libby riding with them, the unit of 8 is there because in the list I usually run I don't have enough points to buy that 9nth guy)

 

2x MM/HF speeders - 140 pts, I find they work best in squadrons of two, getting two such squadrons ain't a bad idea, either, but that depends on list and playstyle

 

 

(how bout x2 libbys on bikes attacted to a x3m scout bike unit with a homing beacon with X7/x3 TH/SS|LC waiting on deck to beam down.. hmmmm)

Scout bikes suck. Deep striking assault terminators get easily killed by bad reserve rolls or simply getting shot up for a full turn. If you take assault terminators, then either take Shrike + two units of 10 terminators and infiltrate them, or get them a land raider transport.

 

Also, you don't need more then one libby. Nullzone + the avenger are the best powers combo, IMHO.

[DarkGuard]

giga-i just copies and pasted that... goin look and ponder that later...thank you.

 

koremu: Idea was NON scoring..means not as much of the target for killhammer tactics. "expendable" was the idea.. 2nd only one inch can win a confilct or entire campaign: also provides that cannon that many more layers of protection... "keeps, oh it's just a single Plasma cannon firing all 6+ turns, as well as using the unit to tarpiting/rhino to tank shock. this were a few.. not all the ideas i was pondering...

 

And all of a sudden that scoring Tact with the plasma cannon becomes a lesser target when two Vindicators hit the table. Or when you roll that Redeemer with TH/SS Termies in it up the table. And if it is shot you have one or two other Tactical Squads can do similar roles for less points than that Devy Squad and still score.

 

Seriously, that Tactical Squad can do the same as that Dev Squad and more besides, and for a cheaper cost, so use the Tact Squad.

[Giga]

The problem with having a pair of vindicators is that, while they sure will provide some nice target saturation, they are really too unreliable when it comes to damage dealing. Hence, I feel those 230-250 points could be better spent elsewhere.

[Praesul]

Vindi's are pretty random in their damage dealing, but people still focus everything they can on them.

[DarkGuard]

The problem with having a pair of vindicators is that, while they sure will provide some nice target saturation, they are really too unreliable when it comes to damage dealing. Hence, I feel those 230-250 points could be better spent elsewhere.

 

Where else can you find two AV13 tanks with huge destructive potential that can easily get in the opponent's face and force him to shoot at them? Preds, though more reliable at popping tanks or killing infantry just don't have the same threat value as Vindy. People fear Vindicators for the damage they can do, they don't fear Preds.

[Giga]

Where else can you find two AV13 tanks with huge destructive potential that can easily get in the opponent's face and force him to shoot at them?

Getting into an opponent's face isn't such a hot idea, to be honest, seeing as that usually means getting in range of all the meltas.

 

That being said, I'd much rather take 3 dakkapreds, or a couple dreadnoughts, or a bunch of speeders, or a LR redeemer, or the whole lot of other units one can get that will improve your target saturation while at the same time doing their job better.

[DarkGuard]

Where else can you find two AV13 tanks with huge destructive potential that can easily get in the opponent's face and force him to shoot at them?

Getting into an opponent's face isn't such a hot idea, to be honest, seeing as that usually means getting in range of all the meltas.

 

That being said, I'd much rather take 3 dakkapreds, or a couple dreadnoughts, or a bunch of speeders, or a LR redeemer, or the whole lot of other units one can get that will improve your target saturation while at the same time doing their job better.

 

And then they draw away the melta fire which would have otherwise attacked your scoring units and so forth.

 

Dakkapreds, Dreads or Speeders just don't carry the same threat factor for me. The LRR does however, but I imagine you'd be chucking in some TH/SS Termies and a HQ in it, raising the cost of your threat unit designed to protect valuable transports from firepower by double that of two Vindicators, and you only need one melta for that Land Raider, you need two for two Vindys. I will admit that despite it's cost it would be preferable, but I prefer to spread the power of my list over many units rather than confining it to a LRR and Termys. Preds could also so this, especially dakka preds or combi-preds, but like I said while their firepower is more reliable it is also more limited, and so doesn't have the same threat as a Vindicator.

[Warp Angel]

giga-i just copies and pasted that... goin look and ponder that later...thank you.

 

koremu: Idea was NON scoring..means not as much of the target for killhammer tactics. "expendable" was the idea.. 2nd only one inch can win a confilct or entire campaign: also provides that cannon that many more layers of protection... "keeps, oh it's just a single Plasma cannon firing all 6+ turns, as well as using the unit to tarpiting/rhino to tank shock. this were a few.. not all the ideas i was pondering...

 

Killhammer is a two sided coin. You aren't giving your troops much S by being scoring, but you aren't getting nearly as much out of them from an S perspective because they aren't scoring.

 

Go with a tactical squad if you want that sort of loadout. If you want dense anti-horde capability and anti-MEQ, a 6 or 7 man dev squad with 4x ML is probably your best bet.

 

But at that points cost, I'd probably buy two land speeder typhoons. :unsure:

[chapter master 454]

Get a TFC: glass canon but trust me, I've halfed the numbers of a 30 strong boyz squad and near on annilated entire squads of marines with it. Doesn't matter if you don't ignore armour saves, heck it's better actually because it then shows a fine case of 'How many dice can you roll before you roll a 1 or 2!'

 

As for Anti-horde/MEQ I would say your devs aren't worth it, Get the tacticals with plasma for a quarter the cost and in all cases your wasting a precious HS slot that could contain TFCs, predators and land raiders. If you were spammng 4 plasma cannons though in them, I would say do it: I can say that 2 plasma cannons firing in sync are deadly enough (on servitors which cost 40-45 points a pop with plasma cannon and remember, devs cost 90 base without gear!). Nothing says 'get your rear in cover or your gonna be BBQ tonight!' than several plasma blasts (I sometimes wonder if I should get a warhound with two plasma blastguns...can't have too much plasma :) )

[Warp Angel]

Get a TFC: glass canon but trust me, I've halfed the numbers of a 30 strong boyz squad and near on annilated entire squads of marines with it. Doesn't matter if you don't ignore armour saves, heck it's better actually because it then shows a fine case of 'How many dice can you roll before you roll a 1 or 2!'

 

As for Anti-horde/MEQ I would say your devs aren't worth it, Get the tacticals with plasma for a quarter the cost and in all cases your wasting a precious HS slot that could contain TFCs, predators and land raiders. If you were spammng 4 plasma cannons though in them, I would say do it: I can say that 2 plasma cannons firing in sync are deadly enough (on servitors which cost 40-45 points a pop with plasma cannon and remember, devs cost 90 base without gear!). Nothing says 'get your rear in cover or your gonna be BBQ tonight!' than several plasma blasts (I sometimes wonder if I should get a warhound with two plasma blastguns...can't have too much plasma :P )

 

I've seriously thought about investing in two more so I can run three and watch the enemy cry.