Astorath

[JamesI]

I tried Astorath briefly right after our codex came out, and am considering trying him again.

 

What are people's opinions of Astorath for a non-DC heavy army (obviously he's essential for the pure DC army, but that's not the style I'm looking for right now).

 

I was figuring he'd be best with lots of units to take advantage of his improved red thirst, so more things like Devs and attack bikes and less predators/land speeders who gain no potential bonus from him.

[Sanguinarian]

Sorry, I have only tried him once, and that was with 2 DC squads. His 5-man squad + Lemartes chewed thru a couple squads and vehicles, but nothing impressive.

 

I've read that despite having a 50% chance of gaining Red Thirst, many haven't benefited much army-wide. However, whichever squad he gets attached to will definitely reap huge benefits with re-rolls to Hits & Wounds 1st round.

[Deus_Sanguinius]

Well, after the new FAQ I will definetly think about Astorath because of his ability regarding the red thirst. That's the only way, if a unit gets the red thirst, to have really reliable furious charge. A priest is fine but he could be killed. I like Astorath as a chracter as well but unfortunately I haven't tested him yet. But I am seriously thinking about him now and as I am not running a heavy mech army I am supposing he could be worth. But no tests so far.

[Isryion]

I love Astorath and think he his well worth his points, but...he does present a couple of army construction issues in my experience.

 

First, priests become a little bit redundant and not as cost effective because they're really just supplying feel no pain. On the flip, you still can't rely on getting the red thirst every time, so I still take one SP. Usually I take two, but if I'm doing that already I can pretty much get FC and FNP where I want it, so then the Grim becomes less cost effective (I hope that makes sense).

 

The other army construction problem is as you mention. Astorath lends himself to taking units with the red thirst, so you want to maximize this. I find this also means splitting up squads where you can, but also trying to take fewer vehicles than you might otherwise take. The more redundancy you have the better, so any squad that gets the red thirst can take advantage of it. I still take a couple of outflanking Baals.

 

I'd really like to drop priests altogether in my Astorath army, but FNP has become a bit like a drug...I think in the long run I'd be better off for it, but then there would be games where poor red thirst rolls would make the game especially challenging.

 

On the other hand, if you're willing to go without a priest or two, you can now add a chaplain or two instead to the list and basically give a big portion of your army a different kind of buff. I always add at least one vanilla chaplain when I bring Astorath. Where the priests become less cost effective with the Grim, the chaplain buff becomes more useful.

 

I hope that helps. In terms of W/L, Astorath doesn't really change my chances, but that may be because I haven't fully committed to building my whole army around him (like maybe giving up all priests).

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I run with him (when I use him) with a tooled out Honor Guard in a Stormraven with a Furioso in tow. They are very killy. You can take a really tooled out HG for around 300 points (banner). They pretty much kill anything they charge.

 

0b ;)

[Burningblood]

I run astorath frequently- and when he doesn't die from an epic deepstriking fail he is a beast when paired with either DC or even a plain ol assault squad. I think he's worth the points. His axe is fun and good for killing enemy ICs with invuln saves. The other day i tested Astorath +5 DC with power weapons against 5 assault terminators with stormshields and thunderhammers and a Termie Reclusiarch, and Astorath was the MVP. Forcing the opponent to reroll invulnerable saves is priceless.

I wish he had more attacks though.

[Isryion]

JamesI,

 

Am I right that you are more asking about army construction tips with Astro as it's pretty clear he's excellent in CC?

[JamesI]

JamesI,

 

Am I right that you are more asking about army construction tips with Astro as it's pretty clear he's excellent in CC?

I'm looking for peoples experience to justify the cost over a Reclusiarch.

 

Is the fact that he has artificer armor/strenght 6 (with forced rerolls of invuls) worth the cost difference (and loss of the attack for a second ccw) or does he need to be in an army focused around the red thirst to make him worth while?

 

I'm looking to do something different with my BAs (the current list is winning about 60% of the time, but I feel like something is missing). Looking at my figure case, my chapter master figure (counts as Astorath) intrigued me so I'm considering throwing him back out there.

 

I run with him (when I use him) with a tooled out Honor Guard in a Stormraven with a Furioso in tow. They are very killy. You can take a really tooled out HG for around 300 points (banner). They pretty much kill anything they charge.

 

0b :unsure:

Would you still use this same unit without the Stormraven? Astorath, nasty HG with jump packs or not worth it without the raven?

[Leardinal]

I have been looking into him but have never actually fielded him. I was planning on taking him because I have recently discovered the might of BA vanguards, and since you can't put an IC into their squad and let them use heroic intervention, I was looking to astroreth to buff their red thirst roll. I was planning on putting him in a 5 man DC with a PF in a storm raven for a couple of reasons, but mainly because I can't put astroreth in a LRC and I spent the time making the storm raven conversion.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

James I am very much a proponent of the Stormraven and that is how I have been playing. The unit could work with DoA but then I would probably switch over to Sanguinary Guard and add a Priest... overall this would save you some points for sure.

 

0b :huh:

[Zid]

Fielded him once, and heres my exp:

1) No EW, insta-gibbed by PF's

2) No anti-tank ability

3) benefits opponent if they're BA as well

4) The list needs to be built around him (much like The Sanguinor) to get full benefit from em

 

Basically, for the points, theres far better things to buy that are far more effective

[Isryion]

JamesI,

 

Am I right that you are more asking about army construction tips with Astro as it's pretty clear he's excellent in CC?

I'm looking for peoples experience to justify the cost over a Reclusiarch.

 

Is the fact that he has artificer armor/strenght 6 (with forced rerolls of invuls) worth the cost difference (and loss of the attack for a second ccw) or does he need to be in an army focused around the red thirst to make him worth while?

 

 

I think I did the numbers somewhere else, but iirc, in terms of cost,, he's pretty well pointed out and that's before Red Thirst. Here are my calculations:

 

His basic statline (reclusiarch) + articicer armor (C:SM) + relic blade (C:SM)+ jump pack = 200

 

So, IF you could give a reclusiarch these items he's 20 points cheaper than Astorath. However, Astorath also forces rerolls of invulnerable saves and has an extra weapon skill point, which probably more than makes up for that 20 points. Again that's not including the SotP, so I don't actually think you have to build the list around him if you don't want. He's more cost effective if you do, but he's probably pointed appropriately even without SotP.

 

Basically it comes down to whether you are able and willing to spend 220 on a single model and that's my difficulty. I love the guy, but I don't use him as much as I would like. I start out building lists with him, but then sometimes cut him for a reclusiarch to fit in a complete squad or an extra transport somewhere else.

[Zeller]

I haven't used him yet but I must say his 3 attacks, though at str 6, are a big turn off.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

That is one reason to run him with a banner and possibly keep Sanguinor closeby.

 

0b :P

[Firedrake28]

The low number of Attacks isn't really a big deal when you're re-rolling your misses and hitting at S6. His WS is high enough that you can pretty much bank on inflicting 3 wounds against basic infantry with him which is pretty good. He can also character hunt better than normal Chaplains.

[Isryion]

The low number of Attacks isn't really a big deal when you're re-rolling your misses and hitting at S6. His WS is high enough that you can pretty much bank on inflicting 3 wounds against basic infantry with him which is pretty good. He can also character hunt better than normal Chaplains.

 

Exactly. Not to mention WS 6, which means he's hitting, most of the time, on 3s and then forcing opponents to reroll invuln saves. He's more likely to wound, statistically, than a reclusiarch with 4 attacks.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Forcing opponents to reroll invulnerable saves is huge with the prevalence of stormshields.

 

0b

[Firedrake28]

Forcing opponents to reroll invulnerable saves is huge with the prevalence of stormshields.

 

0b

 

That and how everyone and their brother seems to be packing an Iron Halo, or is a Daemon Prince and so on.

[Sanguinarian]

3) benefits opponent if they're BA as well

Should only be friendly BA.

[Burningblood]

I like it the way it is. I mean, he's there because guys are going nuts left and right. Sounds like a good backdrop for a BA vs BA game.

[JamesI]

3) benefits opponent if they're BA as well

Should only be friendly BA.

actually Astorath states he affects opponents BA too.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

He is a very bad man.

 

0b :)

[mercury]

Because of the way his Shadow of the Primarch ability works, it is easiest to justify Astorath in larger games (larger army = more targets to benefit from the ability). Personally I'd take him in an army with a couple of units of Vanguard with jump packs. 4 attacks each on the charge, with Descent of Angels and Heroic Intervention is a truly nasty combination. The main downside of such units is their reduced likelihood of gaining Furious Charge (Priests cannot join a unit if you want to use Intervention). Astorath mitigates this by giving them a 50% chance of Heroically squishing MEQs without reprise, due to the initiative bonus of Furious Charge.

[JamesI]

I've been considering running him in a list with a jumpy Vanguard, 2 large RAS, a Tac squad, some attack bikes and a small Dev squad (or Sternguard) (the Furious Charge might not help them much, but the fearless could be useful for both the devs and bikes). Astorath can join an RAS, or attach to the Vanguard if they don't HI.

 

Much lighter on the fast tanks than I've been running lately, but heavier on bodies. I'll try to post an actual list once I work out the points (probably tomorrow)

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

The only vehicle I am currently running is one Stormraven. I know mech is quite prevalent now but the ability to field multiple units that are fast & dripping meltas is a great counter to the meta. It will probably take you awhile to make the adjustment if you switch over but I think if you stick with it then you'll do very well. It's lots of fun a good change of pace.

 

0b :)