This just in!

[Zynk Kaladin]

I'm kind of worried about what we will read when Russ finds out Magnus did a big "no no". I don't think words can explain how beyond pissed Russ will be. Probably Angron pissed. Or perhaps he'll feel a pang of sorrow and regret, too.

 

Maybe he'll shoot fire out of his eyes and lightning out of his arse...

[Captain Trivia]

Actually, reading A Thousand Sons got me back into playing 40k and brought me to playing Space Wolves. Yeah we come across as arrogant and short sighted in the novel, but we also come across as so badass. Skarrssen (or whatever his name was) getting into a verbal sparring match with a primarch, while foolhardy, just spoke to me as how badass we sons of Russ view ourselves. Loved it.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

@Marshal Wilhelm: a templar and a supporter of the red cyclops...craziness.

 

WLK

[Marshal Wilhelm]

@Marshal Wilhelm: a templar and a supporter of the red cyclops...craziness.

 

WLK

 

:P

When I got into the hobby, Chaos all seemed a bit weirdo to me. I was pre-teen.

Slaanesh - :P

Nurgle - :D

Khorne - the warrior bit was cool, but the blood and skulls was too intense.

Tzeentch - :D Magic and cool stuff. I really liked the Greater Daemons of the time. So I've been a fan of Tzeentch and of course, his Marines, for ages.

 

Chaos doesn't really do it for me ~ I still think it's weirdo stuff, but the fondness for the Cyclops remained. Magic sorcerers as per 'Realm of Chaos' was cool. I think they are a lot like Jedi Knights - another boyhood fantasy.

 

I am just reading the bit

where TS, WB and SW attack the Aerie and then they play ring-a-rosie and all fall down ~ Don't be naughty if you haven't read it yet!

So anyway, Magnus tells Lorgar and Russ to not smash the Library, and then the SW attack the Library and the TS defend it. Then Russ gets all huffy because his men got killed when it was clear that was out of bounds and agreed to at that. "I gonna get you cause my guys died because they don't comprehend what no means. I'm gonna get you good!" What an unbalanced meathead. ~ lol

 

 

My BT love was not at first sight. When they came out I rolled my eyes; Black Marines? with black in their title? plenty of thought went into that one.

I loved, and still do, Pacifics pre-HH WE. But I didn't want pre-HH. Too much hassle in my eyes. I'd never do Loyalists pre-HH, I can have them now so why bother?

It was a process of elimination between BA, SW and BT (because my previous love, DA, have Tacticals ~ I think Tacticals are unMarinelike on the TT)

BT - massive modelling potential which I think is the biggest for any Marines.

Choppy in cc.

Black is tough.

IF are portrayed well in the HH series.

I always liked IF - I like yellow and Rogal Dorn was always a favourite Primarch.

The craziness of the SoB in DoW cracks me up and I feel BT are a bit like them/Grey Knights/Chaplain all the time.

 

So they were like a conventional oven. No microwave ping, but it's really hot now ;)

 

So they are some of my 40K loves ^_^

[CainTheHunter]

Nice teaser... I am looking towards "Prospero Burns" being as much about the history of Fenris and how wolves and space wolves became what they were, as about the Prospero incident.

 

And as Mr.Abnett said, he might leak some other teasers in the meantime - to keep all us hooked up :P

 

 

Edited - nobody forgot that today at noon Abnett posted the teaser from PB in his blog, didn't ya? ;)

[Skirax]

Oh, damn, I forgot!

 

Also, Prospero wasn't an incident. It was a tragedy.

[Lord Ragnarok]

Here's an excerpt from "Prospero Burns"

 

http://theprimaryclone.blogspot.com/2010/0...ve-extract.html

[Skirax]

Just been reading it - wow. Brilliant. he even writes itt as if he were a Wolf.

[Decoy]

Also, Prospero wasn't an incident. It was a tragedy*.

 

* If by Tragedy, you mean hilarity, good times, and well-deserved. :D

[Hfran Morkai]

Deliberately not reading the teaser...

 

And Russ was merely destroying heretical works, doing his job in allowing humanity to rule. Magnus shouldn't ave wanted to read that stuff...

[Zynk Kaladin]

Also, Prospero wasn't an incident. It was a tragedy*.

 

* If by Tragedy, you mean hilarity, good times, and well-deserved. :)

 

Daddy's words fall on deaf ears brings the squeaky hammer of retribution :D *raises ale*

 

But seriously, it was a tragedy because I'm 100% sure the Emperor thinks so.

[TiguriusX]

As long as I get my Space Wolf fix they can write the books with Khorne's bloody entrails for all I care!!!!

 

Bad part about being a quick reader is that books just dont hold up around me for long.

 

I feel your pain brother. I am the same way when it comes to pleasure reading

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

@marshal wilhelm: if magnus used sorcery against dorn or any other primarch to protect XENO artifacts of a soon to be destroyed race, i think you would be singing a different tune.

 

@skirax: the only tradegy i see with prospero is so many of the oath-breakers survived.

 

WLK

[Spazmonkey]

I really don’t see how it was a Tragedy.

 

Magnus was an arrogant idiot.

Obsessed with gaining knowledge and power, convinced that nothing was beyond him and that he was the master second only to his father.

He had no humility, and no restraint.

He doomed himself with his self-obsessed arrogance long ago....

 

He only has himself to blame..... you reap what you sow... I have no sympathy for him.

[CainTheHunter]

Deliberately not reading the teaser...

 

Actually You could read it - no spoilers there, no space marines or Russ ever mentioned. I think he pasted it to show that the book will be much deeper than we expected in terms of Fenris history during the Dark Age.

[Max_Dammit]

Magnus was an arrogant idiot.

Obsessed with gaining knowledge and power, convinced that nothing was beyond him and that he was the master second only to his father.

 

 

He thought he was better than his father, he thought he was so great that he only could see the warpgates of the eldar and smart enough to smash a hole in one using the power of your friendly warp entity he thought was good and still drained his life force for all it was worth.

:P

 

That alone is enough to know that he went to far and was beyond saving, and he knew it to after this.

[Hfran Morkai]

Deliberately not reading the teaser...

 

Actually You could read it - no spoilers there, no space marines or Russ ever mentioned. I think he pasted it to show that the book will be much deeper than we expected in terms of Fenris history during the Dark Age.

 

Sounds interesting, problem is I'll read it and want the book now, I need some more literature to read for entertainment. (Origin of Species and research papers are not recreation...)

[Lord Russ]

I read and loved Thousand Sons as a book and it showed Russ exactly as he is.....The Emperors Pit Bull he does as his master tells him with ruthless efficiency.

 

I thought the book was excellent and it showed the wolves acting (as they do in all the space wolf books) as a pack of wolves all backed up by one another. Yes they may argue at times as wolf packs do and you may challenge someone one rank above you at times BUT they were excellently well written.

 

The Thousand Son's were also painted well and full of life - I am looking forward to the next installment.

 

I do however find it odd that people are less keen on the Horus Heresy books as I think they have been excellent (save for the dark angels one) which was nothing to do with the Horus Heresy so far. It is so I am told a set of 3 now to attone for their error.

 

They may say this was intended but the book alone has nothing to do with the Heresy and having a mini set of books inside a set of books is daft.

[Marshal Wilhelm]

@marshal wilhelm: if magnus used sorcery against dorn or any other primarch to protect XENO artifacts of a soon to be destroyed race, i think you would be singing a different tune.

 

WLK

:lol: Do I come across as that big a hypocrite? :lol:

DON'T ANSWER THAT QUESTION!! :P

 

I don't recall Magnus using sorcery against Russ in that circumstance....? :woot:

 

So this is what I think;

 

Russ, Lorgar and Magnus sat down. Though Russ + Lorgar wanted to burn it all, Magnus said no.

There is no record of them rebuking him for it, nor denying his request.

So they have agreed with his request.

Then the WB hang back and take a long time (as noticed by Ahriman, though he could not understand the whys and wherefores) which I assume is to give Russ and Magnus a chance to fight (boo sneaky Lorgar!)

The SW get carried away in battle-lust and try to destroy the Library.

That means either Russ did not tell them to not attack the Library ~ which makes Russ a jerk and/or completely disrespectful of Magnus or a promise breaker,

or the SW disobeyed Russ ~ which makes the SW guilty.

Either way, Russ + SW (as a single entity) transgressed what Russ agreed to.

Magnus is dismayed to find the SW attacking the Library.

We do not know if the deaths occurred then (which I guess was when Ahriman heard the Psychic Boom from Russ?) or when the SW made the attack on the TS, which was when Ahriman had joined the TS.

 

It does not matter if the things were Xenos or not - Russ and Lorgar did not put Magnus in his place during the "negotiations" meeting pre-assault.

They agreed the Library was for Magnus.

 

That the TS responded violently to SW attack on the Library is just them responding in kind to what the SW started.

Russ getting sooky because his men died is his spilt milk to cry over ~ if Russ and/or the SW hadn't violated a promise, the situation would not have arisen.

Magnus only defended what Russ and Lorgar ceded to him.

 

 

That is the only fair conclusion in my eyes. Russ had his chance to make it clear. Getting sooky-lah after is being a poor loser.

Of course, this is from the Thousand Sons accounts of the happenings ;)

 

My evaluation, given only the TS account, would not changed had it been Dorn or another. Unless I have forgotten or misread the account.... :pinch:

[Hellios]

Magnus was an arrogant idiot.

Obsessed with gaining knowledge and power, convinced that nothing was beyond him and that he was the master second only to his father.

 

 

He thought he was better than his father, he thought he was so great that he only could see the warpgates of the eldar and smart enough to smash a hole in one using the power of your friendly warp entity he thought was good and still drained his life force for all it was worth.

:woot:

 

That alone is enough to know that he went to far and was beyond saving, and he knew it to after this.

 

Even is Magnus was running in the sunlight unknown of its dangers... it is better to be that man than the men who hack him apart for bring sunlight to them... especially when the space wolves have their own kind of sunlight anyway...

 

Magnus was an optimist, ambitious and wanted a better world... he was also loyal... Unlike Mortarion who argued who was pesimistic, gloomy and a traitor...

 

Russ again was a different case... and while I guess he cared, he was arrogant in his own way, stubborn in his own way and limited to his view of the world... he served hte Warmasters purpose far more than the Thousand Sons and Magnus ever did...

 

In the End everything may have gone as the Emperor wanted it to go... maybe Magnus and Russ played their roles well and even the traitors were just doing what the Emperor wanted... then again maybe not... who knows...

 

If Magnus was arrogant, then that is the Emperors fault... he should never have taught him or he should have taught him far better... In the end it wasn't magnus' arrogance that damned him... he knew is few used his powers to warn the emperor that the emperors dogs would be set upon him... and he new when the space wolves were comming but did little to defend himself... similiar to the way Curze let the assassin kill him but for different reasons... Magnus was willing to accept his fate and punishment, while Curze was vindicating himself. I say this isn't the act of an arrogant man... the arrogant man would assume that his actions would be seen as right and that no dogs would be set on him, and if attacked he would know he was in the right and defend himself... No the arrogance that damned the thousand sons came from another Primarch who shows more Arrogance in the book than magnus and the thousand sons even though it is about Magnus and the thousand sons... I don't think you need my gift to know the name of who I speak....

 

 

Yes it was Russ :pinch:... here have a chew toy.

 

No the biggest mistake Magnus made was wanting to save the sons he loved, to have hope they might live on and in doing so dooming them to the service of Tzeentch.

[Hfran Morkai]

Magnus made a pact with something he didn't understand, yet he must have understood how powerful it was.

 

His Legion got what it deserved for delving too deep into things that should have been kept from humanity.

[Max_Dammit]

Magnus was an arrogant idiot.

Obsessed with gaining knowledge and power, convinced that nothing was beyond him and that he was the master second only to his father.

 

 

He thought he was better than his father, he thought he was so great that he only could see the warpgates of the eldar and smart enough to smash a hole in one using the power of your friendly warp entity he thought was good and still drained his life force for all it was worth.

:(

 

That alone is enough to know that he went to far and was beyond saving, and he knew it to after this.

 

Even is Magnus was running in the sunlight unknown of its dangers... it is better to be that man than the men who hack him apart for bring sunlight to them... especially when the space wolves have their own kind of sunlight anyway...

 

Magnus was an optimist, ambitious and wanted a better world... he was also loyal... Unlike Mortarion who argued who was pesimistic, gloomy and a traitor...

 

Russ again was a different case... and while I guess he cared, he was arrogant in his own way, stubborn in his own way and limited to his view of the world... he served hte Warmasters purpose far more than the Thousand Sons and Magnus ever did...

 

In the End everything may have gone as the Emperor wanted it to go... maybe Magnus and Russ played their roles well and even the traitors were just doing what the Emperor wanted... then again maybe not... who knows...

 

If Magnus was arrogant, then that is the Emperors fault... he should never have taught him or he should have taught him far better... In the end it wasn't magnus' arrogance that damned him... he knew is few used his powers to warn the emperor that the emperors dogs would be set upon him... and he new when the space wolves were comming but did little to defend himself... similiar to the way Curze let the assassin kill him but for different reasons... Magnus was willing to accept his fate and punishment, while Curze was vindicating himself. I say this isn't the act of an arrogant man... the arrogant man would assume that his actions would be seen as right and that no dogs would be set on him, and if attacked he would know he was in the right and defend himself... No the arrogance that damned the thousand sons came from another Primarch who shows more Arrogance in the book than magnus and the thousand sons even though it is about Magnus and the thousand sons... I don't think you need my gift to know the name of who I speak....

 

 

Yes it was Russ :D... here have a chew toy.

 

No the biggest mistake Magnus made was wanting to save the sons he loved, to have hope they might live on and in doing so dooming them to the service of Tzeentch.

 

 

Magnes was warned not to delve deeper by the emperor, and for good reason, he would not have and did not have the restraint not deal with Chaos, not even the Emperor was that dumb, Magnus was, against the warnings. And not defending, he was a broken man, knowing what he did at that point and knowing he legion only survived thanx to the Chaos gods, so he had 2 choices. Receive a mercy shot from the sons of Russ, or fall to Chaos. At first he went with the first, but at the end chose the second.

 

Russ may be portrayed as Arrogant, but hated Chaos more than he loved his brother. And as serving the Warmaster more than Magnus, sure open an attack on 2 fronts is not helping the Warmaster in any way :lol:

The Emperor lost more troops before Horus ever got to Terra than the whole 1000 sons could ever have brought in to the fray and Magnus would only have served as a energy source for the golden throne.

[Max_Dammit]

I am just reading the bit

where TS, WB and SW attack the Aerie and then they play ring-a-rosie and all fall down ~ Don't be naughty if you haven't read it yet!

So anyway, Magnus tells Lorgar and Russ to not smash the Library, and then the SW attack the Library and the TS defend it. Then Russ gets all huffy because his men got killed when it was clear that was out of bounds and agreed to at that. "I gonna get you cause my guys died because they don't comprehend what no means. I'm gonna get you good!" What an unbalanced meathead. ~ lol

 

And what if Russ felt and smelt the taint of Chaos in that place, SW have a distinct feeling and hatred for Chaos. The Emperor might have programmed it in them for these kind things, thus being forced by design to destroy it.

[Prot]

Sorry, but even as a Wolves fan, I gotta disagree with the lot of you.

 

It was the Emperor's fault.

 

Why on earth did he keep "Chaos" secret from his sons? It's like not warning your children about drugs and then getting angry at them for getting addicted to crack. A simple 'birds and the bees' sort of discussion over kool-aid and cookies would have sufficed, but no. He kept it a dark secret, and that secret is ultimately the Emperor's undoing.

 

For a time I considered Russ a total fool, and Ahriman a thinking man, capable of understanding what's 'really' going on. But I realized that Chaos is plenty manipulative.

 

So Magnus is a victim in my opinion (like all great villains are). He is a victim of his own -ego- which is massively stroked by Chaos.

 

What do tell a guy who is powerful, incredibly gifted (with the warp) , and nearly omnipotent already? Well, you offer him more power, a dabbling of invincibility, a false sense of control, and top it off with a bit more self serving power.

 

How do you get him to kill himself? Take the blinders off. Let him see he is just another cog in the machine that has been dancing to someone (or some thing) else's tune. He was totally manipulated.

[Hellios]

Magnes was warned not to delve deeper by the emperor, and for good reason, he would not have and did not have the restraint not deal with Chaos, not even the Emperor was that dumb, Magnus was, against the warnings. And not defending, he was a broken man, knowing what he did at that point and knowing he legion only survived thanx to the Chaos gods, so he had 2 choices. Receive a mercy shot from the sons of Russ, or fall to Chaos. At first he went with the first, but at the end chose the second.

 

Russ may be portrayed as Arrogant, but hated Chaos more than he loved his brother. And as serving the Warmaster more than Magnus, sure open an attack on 2 fronts is not helping the Warmaster in any way B)

The Emperor lost more troops before Horus ever got to Terra than the whole 1000 sons could ever have brought in to the fray and Magnus would only have served as a energy source for the golden throne.

 

The problem is the warnings always seem vague and lack content... to use the example of drugs... since they have been used already... the emperor effectivly found magnus with a bit of weak pot... sat him down and told him to try this reefer with him as it will knock his socks off... Magnus then goes off and starts trying all sorts of junk... Later on the emperor goes don't do harder drugs man they will mess you up... However magnus already taking harder drugs is like meh I can take em and I'll know when to stop... now some people can stop with drugs... others can't... the biggest difference here is the drugs arn't trying to trick you. But seriously that is Magnus' fault? Nah Looks Like the Emperors fault to me... first he took him further down that path... rather than stopping it if it was a danger... then he let him experiment without supervision... and finally he told him not to try harder stuff but without explaining why... not a great idea with someone who is naturally curious no?

 

Yer except he didn't open it for the Warmaster he himself was manipulated by the (or a) chaos god to serve its purpose... while Russ was manipulated by a man... The effect may have been the same... and then you have to look at what if it had worked... what is magnus had saved the imperium either by stopping Horus or by warning the Emperor? Would he be the villian? Sure he might still be escorted back to terra for a telling off... and russ might be used again... and as far as we know in this alternative version russ might lose it again... as he seems to have self control issues as well as a great ego (although since almost all the primarchs did... not such a huge issue...)/ Also in our current reality what if russ hadn't gone in guns blazing... what if he and the thousand sons had returned to the emperors palace... the siege of terra takes place and now you have the wolves and the 1ksons their rather than the wolves and white scars dancing with the Alpha Legion and the thousand sons on the side of chaos (although they didn't really do much in the heresy).

 

When at least three primarchs new of Horus' betrayal of the Emperor before it happened... and all of them ended up on the side of chaos... either all is not as it seems (very likely I will admit) or you must admit the emperor was a fool. Just in case you don't know which Primarchs I refer to... Curze, Alpharius and Magnus... Sanginius obviously had some visions but I guess they were very limited... It also seems Russ has some power (although if he had any control or is even aware of it is unknown) and It would seem likely other primarchs may have gifts...