Space Wolves VS Space Marines

[Wysten]

The legion of the damned probably don't come anywhere near us, probably because we stink like a wolf. Thats enough fluff for me. XD

 

But as said, our simplisty and self reliability is our strength. It's more reliable then fluff, which is a fickle thing at best. It can make the mightest threats to humanity a boring side attraction. (I typically find Chaos extremely boring. I don't know how they make the archnemisis to the entire univerce sound so dolice. If it took 10,000 years to do stuff... XD)

[Timberhawk]

Thirst, I only turn to piracy when I'm out of ale. :lol:

[The_Betrayed_Spacewolf]

and to blunder the booty

[The Thirst]

Thirst, I only turn to piracy when I'm out of ale. :)

Don't we all? :huh:

[Inquisitor Kravin]

I really like the current codex - coming to it from a background of Alpha Legion, Death Guard, Tau and Imperial Guard I think that it is probably the most powerful and versatile codex around. I would have liked a Wulfen unit in elites but other than that there's nothing specifically wolfy missing - now to look at the Codex Marines/Blood Angels things that we didn't get and whether or not I think we should have had them.

 

Command squads - I think that we should have had these. Codex marines get them for captains and and Blood Angels for every HQ. We already have to use an Elite slot to get our set of veteran sergeant equivalents. I think that a Wolf Guard Bodyguard unit allowed with each Wolf Lord would have been appropriate and we could have had a Great Company Standard and a Wolf Priest Initiate to grant Feel No Pain.

 

Ironclads - No, there needs to be codex differentiation. An option for a second DCCW would have been nice.

 

Sternguard - As a squad in their own right, no. But since Blood Angels get Sternguard too it would have been nice to give Wolf Guard some access to Special Ammunition.

 

Landspeeder Storm - No. Totally unfluffy. It is for delivering codex marine noob squads into battle and then getting them back out again. Wolf Scouts work alone and they don't need ferrying around or being forced to act in groups. They've been behind enemy lines for weeks - they gather behind enemy lines and then run onto the battlefield.

 

Scout Bikers - as above. All a Wolf Scout needs is his fenrisian upbringing, his space marine heritage and a big sharp knife.

 

Vanguard Vets - Wolf Guard belong in the heart of the battle facing an enemy head on - not lurking somewhere hoping to look cool by getting the drop on the enemy.

 

Thunderfire Cannon - An Ironpriest should stick to forging fine wargear and leave the heavy fire support in the experienced hands of the Long Fangs.

 

Did I forget anything?

 

I think that Skyclaws should have been able to have WolfGuard Pack Leaders and whether it's ten or twelve I think that Drop Pod transport capacity should be consistent. Other than that I'm very happy.

[SeanyPrawny]

Iron halo's or some other invulnerable save would of been nice. I really wanna run WGBL's but don't wanna have to give them storm shields just so they dnt get insta pwned.

[The_Betrayed_Spacewolf]

yeah what you gonna do though? you pick up offensive power in exchange for a decrease in defense

[SeanyPrawny]

Aye I know just hurts against blood angels (my main and almost only opponent) who is always striking before my guys with power weapons :-(

[The_Betrayed_Spacewolf]

thats why you get the charge first. remember your distances or stay in vehicles until hes in range.

[raptor1199]

the whine of the wolwes how ironic :P

 

seriusly wolf players have nothing to whine about your codex

you lose wargear to gain something new

 

ps: ninjas are teh best

[whitewolfmxc]

the whine of the wolwes how ironic :P

 

seriusly wolf players have nothing to whine about your codex

you lose wargear to gain something new

 

ps: ninjas are teh best

 

hah whine , no i dont think we should at all but do you play wolves ? considering the new codex is good but........

 

do you know we lost quite a lot of unique stuff compared to the old codex ? Did you know somethings in our codex dont even make fluff sense ? Those are the things most are complaining about , although the Op is saying perhaps some vanilla stuff wouldnt be bad lol

 

PS: New does not = to better or even good in this context lol

 

Then we look at BA , oh wait they got what ? something like everything from the codex book lol........well nearly anyway lol sigh

[Wysten]

Plus they have Fast stuff, seriously, you would think the blood angels invented mobile based warfare, not the White Scars, hardly any wonder no one notices the latter. XD

 

But in all honestly, we can kick the backsides of other marines as it is. We don't need that many units to prove we are hard, that aspect has probably weakened the Space Marines Codex in compersion to ours, too many specialist units when a single veteran unit, our wolf guard for example, could be tutored to handle most roles. It's unnessiary divercity which may not nessiarily be better.

 

Though Thunderfire Cannons are awesomeness, it's so wrong and we should never have it, but I can dream. Hehehe

[Zynk Kaladin]

Plus they have Fast stuff, seriously, you would think the blood angels invented mobile based warfare, not the White Scars, hardly any wonder no one notices the latter. XD

 

True. I never really understood why BA get fast vehicles considering they're more of a jump pack CC army, imo. The White Scars get no love.

 

From what I've seen the Wolf dex is fine. By not having most vanilla marine stuff, your codex is more unique. Why GW gave the BAs crap tons of vanilla stuff PLUS their own unique units I'll never understand. It makes me wonder why I bothered to buy a vanilla dex if BA has everything I use anyway and more... Even with the best of both worlds, however, I am surprised the Wolves still have a more well rounded codex than the BA. This might just be my own opinion, but you should be proud of your codex!

[Wysten]

Aye, when in the end the fast stuff simply made people take tons of Rhinos that can go faster then the normal Rhino, with extra resistant squads and pretty much contibuted to the Blood Angels dropping Jetpacks anyways because that form of transport is quicker and more protective.

 

 

Really, I would it was added into the Space Marine Codex and that the codex would be expanded to a monster of a codex, starting with the basic units all Codex marine groups have, then expanding into the verious offshoot branches with their own unique units, fluff and such after picking which faction rules you wanted to follow.

 

Sure, chances are it would cost in the region of £40, but it would be one hell of a codex as a libary of information on every typical chapter and their successors could ever need. I think it would be plainly awesome to get a codex with Ultramarines setting up the base, with about 40/50 pages of fluff, unit information and a libary of the most importent unique charcters in the history of the game.

 

Which would probably result in us being disadvantaged due to less fluff and chapter flexability and getting less for our money. (We get a Codex for £18, one chapter, and they get everything else for £40/£50?!) but would be awesome for more reliable updates on the other factions (easpically those that recieve only one codex to work on. Who can't simply jump chapter if they get a bad one) and enable us to be more creative with making our own fluff behind the verious chapters, while remaining more informed on other, codex colleges.

 

Of course, all this is ramblings of a eager bloodclaw whom has yet to bloody his blade. Just I feel condencing all but the most unique down into a single, massive codex would expand the potencial for DIY and Successor chapters. Just makes me all the more proud to be part of a chapter thats different!

 

 

Ale please? XD

[The_Betrayed_Spacewolf]

would you really want to see lists like theses?

 

hqs: mephiston logan or vulkan or something?

elites: lone wolves or sword breathern (elites?) whatever is decent in other codices

troops: grey hunters or ba assault troops

fast: thunderwolf cavalry what ever is decent in the other codices

heavy: long fangs or whatever is decent in the other codices?

 

 

combining the mass of uncodex marines and codex marines together would create terrible monsters.

do i think da honestly deserve a codex of their own? no

ba? not really

bt and sws? yes they divert heavily from codex astartes unlike the other two.

[Wysten]

I already mentioned in that post that Space Wolves and Black Templars should exist as a seprate codex, due to their nature. I stated that we would probably get less flexability then BA and DA because they are always kept up to date with what the Space Marines have. While Black Templars and Space Wolves would have smaller codex as we are covering one chapter, rather then 8 founding chapters and enough info to DIY 989 successors.

 

 

Resulting in 1 mega codex for all the codex guys, and 2 codexs for us oddjobs. XD

[Timberhawk]

I looked through the BA codex yesterday and I was surprised at how it's set up. After listening to everyone at the local shop talk about playing them (Chaos player, Ultramarine player, Ork player) I expected it to be more unique. Yeah, they don't get everything vanilla marines get but they do get a lot of it with just some rules tweaks and their special characters.

 

On another note, I was pretty disappointed that White Scars really don't get anything in the SM codex to reflect their focus on bikes and such.

[Grey Mage]

I looked through the BA codex yesterday and I was surprised at how it's set up. After listening to everyone at the local shop talk about playing them (Chaos player, Ultramarine player, Ork player) I expected it to be more unique. Yeah, they don't get everything vanilla marines get but they do get a lot of it with just some rules tweaks and their special characters.

 

On another note, I was pretty disappointed that White Scars really don't get anything in the SM codex to reflect their focus on bikes and such.

You mean like being the entire reason bikes can be troops?

[The_Betrayed_Spacewolf]

that and their own character. more than can be said for the iron hands.

[PinoyC]

The army of bikers doesn't count...a captain on bike does the same thing.

 

The only thing I need is a wolf guard as an inherent option in a squad rather than an elite choice.

 

What would be nice and/or make more sense is the lone wolf not being an elite choice either...maybe a troop choice that's unable to capture nor count as minimum force org selections OR at the very least as a 1-X per elite slot. They're fluffy and I'd like to take one but it's just too difficult to pick him over the other options.

 

Last thing...it actually applies to all SM Dex's (minus the HQ and Cannon operator)...the Iron Priest should be an IC and an add-on rather than take up a slot. I play as Egil's Iron wolves, but, as in the case for lone wolves, taking one sacrifices a dread, wolf scouts, or wolf guard selection. I mean, what's their purpose...fixing stuff or having servitors as weapons platforms. Well for fixing stuff they have to keep up with something to fix...a tank, more than likely, moves further away than he can keep up or the asset is being overly static or we can go to a dreadnought who's just as slow but between both of them it takes up two Elt slots...not worth it. As for fire support, there are better options...nuff said. Because of this I've never seen one of them used, I've tried personally but it was pointless.

 

-PC

[Grey Mage]

The army of bikers doesn't count...a captain on bike does the same thing.

 

The only thing I need is a wolf guard as an inherent option in a squad rather than an elite choice.

 

What would be nice and/or make more sense is the lone wolf not being an elite choice either...maybe a troop choice that's unable to capture nor count as minimum force org selections OR at the very least as a 1-X per elite slot. They're fluffy and I'd like to take one but it's just too difficult to pick him over the other options.

 

Last thing...it actually applies to all SM Dex's (minus the HQ and Cannon operator)...the Iron Priest should be an IC and an add-on rather than take up a slot. I play as Egil's Iron wolves, but, as in the case for lone wolves, taking one sacrifices a dread, wolf scouts, or wolf guard selection. I mean, what's their purpose...fixing stuff or having servitors as weapons platforms. Well for fixing stuff they have to keep up with something to fix...a tank, more than likely, moves further away than he can keep up or the asset is being overly static or we can go to a dreadnought who's just as slow but between both of them it takes up two Elt slots...not worth it. As for fire support, there are better options...nuff said. Because of this I've never seen one of them used, I've tried personally but it was pointless.

 

-PC

1) The only reason captains can do that is because of the whitescars. No other reason to.

2) I agree, 1 elite slot for up to three would be cool, but Im not sure it wouldnt be unbalancing.

3) I agree strongly- techmarines are almost never taken as an elites choice, and SWs arguably have the most useful one.

[phoenix1787]

And calm down we're just poking fun at the blue-boy.

all i can think of here is 'im blue yabadee yabadii' lol

[Blitzkreig]

Ok, here are the things I want, but am perfectly happy without.

 

Cheaper Bikes and Jump Packs for Wolf Guard......... seriously they cost the same as they do for a HQ.

2 DCCW Dreadnought or Space Wolf specific Dreadnought.

Wolf Priests that grant Fell No Pain.

Wulfen Squad.

Scouts that can ride Blackmaned Wolves instead of Bikes..... not Thunderwolves as they are about as subtle as a Squiggoth but smaller wolves that let them move faster and still infiltrate/outflank/operate behind enemy lines.

And now that it has been mentioned Special Ammo for Wolf Guard with Bolters.

 

That said, if I was to get any of those things it would completely demolish my list as it is now as I would revert to the military intelligence of an unpotty trained labradoodle.... wetting myself everytime I looked at the awesomeness that is our codex (hell I only just got over it from how awesome our codex is now).

[Timberhawk]

My point with the White Scars was that bikes are their gimmick and it's not unique to them. Sure Khan has the ability but so does a generic captain. There's nothing special about his ability with bikes over the generic captain's ability other than that he needs to be riding Moondrakken to get that ability. To top it off it costs ten more points for his bike than for a SM captain to have a bike.

[Blitzkreig]

My point with the White Scars was that bikes are their gimmick and it's not unique to them. Sure Khan has the ability but so does a generic captain. There's nothing special about his ability with bikes over the generic captain's ability other than that he needs to be riding Moondrakken to get that ability. To top it off it costs ten more points for his bike than for a SM captain to have a bike.

 

Thats because that is the only real difference between White Scars and a Codex Marine Chapter. The White Scars are a codex chapter with a single real variation. What if Khan was the only way to get Bikes as troops? Then you would have to take Khan for a fluffy White Scars army. What if you wanted to play a DiY chapter? Then you would have to use Khan as a Counts-as if you wanted Biker Troops.

 

Look at the Iron Hands, a first founding chapter who didn't get any love in Codex: Space Marines. They are probably divergent enough to allow their own codex but don't have one. The point is that unless a chapter is divergent enough to allow a seperate codex it falls under the category of Codex Marines, like the White Scars.