Wolves & Vindies

[pattison]

My question is in the title..

I own a lovely long ranged shooty Imperial Fists army but I also build Iron Knights (starting to morph into a DIY...) and would like to try something really different with them, a lot more on the assaulty side and with the SW codex (the C:SM is incapable for assault armies IMHO).

 

I always had sympathy for the good ol' Vindicator as it is so bad*ss, but they just do not fit in well with my Fists.

It's being told that the wolves cannot really work well with them, but I really want to build an army with potential to utter destruction.

And for some reason I just stubbornly think that my secondary chapter & Vindicators is something awesome. :)

 

So what would you throw in together with 2 or 3 Vindies? The whole concept should be really savage and risk taking (the opposite of the Imperial Fists approach).

 

Your ideas & comments highly appreciated!

[chaplain belisarius]

i like vindis too...:)

 

maybe tons of grey hunters in rhinos and some characters...charge as the vindis unleash hell!

[captain fabian]

Yes mounted GH would be the best choise for you. They are sure to get wherever you want them because your opponent will never try to shoot the Rhinos and let you land 2 or 3 large blasts of total anihilation on his head. That way if you lose your vindicators you have your mobile packs to do the job and that's what matters. If the oposite happens... well you can still walk and tear him to pieces. The important thing is and you probably know it, not to let your oponent make easy decisions. In short you can never be wrong with GH and if you want something better take more GH. I've also found that Fenr Wolves are quite useful. They hit like a WG and are sometimes underestimated by the oponent. In general I believe a SW list can work no matter what you have. And if it doesn't . well you can always have fun because SW are SW and we all know what that means.

 

Wow that was long considering I usually post only a sentence.

[Lord Clinto]

Wait, wait, wait...siege specialists not liking Vindicators? :)

 

Personally I love Vindicators, use them whenever possible. Also if you're into SW fluff, both Bjorn Stormwolf and Egil Iron Wolf both favor mechanized/tank filled armies (Bjorn because of the BOOM! BOOM! HUR! HUR! & Egil due to his mechanical nature?). I honestly can't think where you would have heard that Vindi's and SW don't go good together.

[Grey Mage]

It's being told that the wolves cannot really work well with them, but I really want to build an army with potential to utter destruction.

Whomever told you this doesnt know what they are talking about.

 

Vindicators are great mid range support, good for taking out hordes and enemy vehicles.

 

I wouldnt run 3, as I love my LFs and I like to have a whirlwind around, but frankly the vindicator works better in the aggressive fashion of a SW list than in the more sedentary fashion of a C:SM list.

[MaleOpener]

Vindies not good with IF? Now that's something I have trouble getting my head around ... The whole point of Imperial Fists is seige warfare, so vindicators would fit like a glove.

 

Ouch, was that a pun?

 

Anywho, vindicators would work with a SW force. I'm not sure if you could fit 2 or 3, as you want a pack of Long Fangs and maybe a LR type.

 

I plan to use at least one by 1500.

 

Having SMs before SWs, I just love the vindi. Slap on a seige shield and run through/over everything!

[Taeken]

I use 1 Vindi in most any list above 1k. Planning on 2 Vindi 1 Long Fang Pack for my up comming 2k vs Necrons. Though this might just change a bit as I got my TWC in the other day....

[pattison]

Vindies not good with IF? Now that's something I have trouble getting my head around ... The whole point of Imperial Fists is seige warfare, so vindicators would fit like a glove.

 

Okay sorry guys I think I've been misunderstandable.

 

Fluffwise Vindies & Fists are just like milk & coffee, and I always had a soft spot for the mean little mortar.

I know the typical & fluffy units for a yellow force, and they're among them.

 

One (tactical) reason why they don't fit into my IF army is that I am running a mech'd, blocking, very long ranged shooty type of list with a certain 'no pasaran' approach.

To avoid close combat at any costs and if anyone is closer than 24" than I'm getting stressed (as they should already be killed latest by plasma shots at 36").

The other reason is that my heavy support slots are occupied by my beloved Predators. I am absolutely convinced that these tanks should be ran in pairs as a minimum, and I luv my Preds too much to field only one to make space for the Vindies (which are even more in need of a pair as I see).

 

So that's why I decided to keep the Preds yellow and build an other kind of army with vindicators. Hope my motivation is a bit clearer now. :angry:

 

I posted a triple-vindie list in the Space Wolves Army List Reviews section and that's where I'm being told that they don't run really well with SW lists.

Now I'm tending towards 2 of them to have a slot for a LR or LFs.

 

I don't have experience with the SW codex yet, and I have a maybe strange viewpoint of it. My secondary chapter has the fluff of 'slavic warriors'. Not as barbarian as the Wolves themselves, but not as refined as the Fists for example. Somewhere in between. I am using regular marine bits with some added and consolidated wolves bits for my conversions. But strategywise I'd like to make a hard hitting and generally "brave" list which may be risky but fun.

Oh and I just don't want to use Rune Priests, they are OTT in my opinion. I know I'm stupido.

 

So the main point is that I need to have time to roll up with my Vindicators. My first idea was to drop pod 2 MM&HFDCCW dreads and take away fire from the tanks.

But in a test game all of my podded units were killed turn 1 and my demolishers were still too far in turn 2 (when they got killed too...).

Okay, it was spearhead and my opponent had 2 full squads of lascannon havocs, and a couple of obliterators...

Could it be better to roll up behind rhinos/razorbacks, or a LR?

I know that GH spam in razorbacks is kind of effective, but my IF army includes tons of rhino-chassis vehicles already.... I know I'm problematic, but the purpose of this idea is to have a really different army of space marines. But if you think that that's the solution for my Vindicator list then just tell me.

 

Cheers

[IamCaboose]

I never leave home without 2 vindis. They're too scary for opponents to ignore so 1 never makes it and 3 seems like too much. 2 Vindis and you fill in the rest with GH rhinos and a pack of scouts.

 

Caboose

[wolf363839]

I actually prefer vindis more than long fangs for their blast capability and that they attract mass firepower away from my transports. I have had huge success running them.

 

Thunderwolf Lord & 2 TWC all tooled up

 

Rune Priest w/ LL and Jaws (in Rhino)

 

Redeemer w/ GHs

 

3 x Rhinos w/ GHs

 

2 x Vindis

[The_Betrayed_Spacewolf]

to those suggesting rhino rush with vindis..... ok so you got guys rushing to where scattering str 10 ap2 or 1 i forget pie plates are going to be?

 

how is this not a bad idea?

[Adarul Greystalker]

I like to run my vindicator with mechanized grey hunters. I tend to run three grey hunter squads in the spearhead with at least one in a rhino and one in a razorback (the third changes depending on the rest of the list). Vindicators complement grey hunters very well, since they can deal with most of the unit types that grey hunters may have problems with. As for the problem of charging into the demolisher cannon's field of fire, it doesn't really come with this formation in most cases. The grey hunters really only charge when they have an opportunity to hit a vulnerable target or in desperate times, and demolishers are better for breaking up strong enemy formations. If you're playing a berserker-style force with blood claws or land raiders or the like, then you'll likely be attempting to charge into the same targets that your vindicator should be shooting, and in that case, I would agree that this is a bad idea.

 

A two-vindicator list with grey hunters at its core should work quite well. I would definitely recommend mechanized troops, as the vindicators will draw fire off of your transports (or occasionally vice-versa) and mechanized hunters are just generally good anyway. Just remember to take a good number of long-range/fast units to support your armored spearhead. A rune priest would really be the best HQ option for this kind of list, but if you don't want to use one, there are a few other options. You could run a wolf guard battle leader to bolster your grey hunters, or you could use a thunderwolf wolf lord or a jump pack/biker wolf priest with an accompanying unit, such as cavalry or sky claws. Such a unit would be fast enough to keep the enemy's flanks in line or hunt down elusive units, staying out of the way of your demolisher cannons in the process. I would recommend the sky claws, since they can be quite cost effective and have better maneuvering ability with their jump packs.

[Grimtooth]

Advance GH in Rhinos under covering fire from the Vindicators.

 

Ideally, the mounted GH would serve as a counter attacking force for any enemy units able to weather the Vindi fire and get close. Otherwise just pounding them until close enough to assault at which time switch targets to second priority targets.