Codex Blood Angels

[Jonny]

Read the wolf lord entry, you can't take a storm shield and a thunder hammer, it says take thunder hammer or storm shield.

and there is no other weapon choices. additions, apart from the termie upgrade weapon replacements.

 

Yes you most definitely can, you can replace your bolt pistol and/ or close combat weapon with TH or SS. So bolt pistol changed with TH and CC changed with SS. You could even have two TH's or two SS's but that would be completely pointless.

 

-Jonny

[Vlk]

Read the wolf lord entry, you can't take a storm shield and a thunder hammer, it says take thunder hammer or storm shield.

and there is no other weapon choices. additions, apart from the termie upgrade weapon replacements.

 

Yes you most definitely can, you can replace your bolt pistol and/ or close combat weapon with TH or SS. So bolt pistol changed with TH and CC changed with SS. You could even have two TH's or two SS's but that would be completely pointless.

 

-Jonny

 

Nothing that's awesome is pointless.

[whitewolfmxc]

The Wolf codex is really good so I always get surprised how much hatred gets extended towards the BA

 

Yeah wolves have a good codex , but we dont have stuff like T6 I6 WS7 guys ALL over the codex , and 15 points extra for a fast rhino ? dont anyone dare say its "expensive" , and the part that pisses me the most about the dex is it has a lot of codex units to a level they have everything but better (cheaper vanguards anyone ?) , sure wolves are great but we at least retained the uniqueness of ourselves without just copy and paste everything from codex chapters sure if by fluff we should have a lot of those codex units , but its called "balance" in which phill did a great job and Mr Ward did not even try to look into

 

The hatred towards BA is mainly based on what i just said above lol

 

And i dont get why people say SW or BA are the CC win all race , hello ! BT anyone ? Thier sole purpose is too come close to you to combat , everything in that army is to do that , vows ? CC expert is in thier blood all right

 

- ) Wolves are the most flexible Sm variant , if we cant kill it up close we shoot it , if we cant out shoot it we charge it , if we cant out shoot nor out fight them up close , we bring out our different wolf PACKS (fexlible of each unit and what kind of units come in) that work very well together hence increasing the effectiveness of each unit rapidly . to sum up Wolves = have the answer to everything cause their cunning and group work increases their efforts and are good at it but are not the best at anything

 

-) BT as mentioned above , we came we saw we charged you and you die , how we get there ? we got more guys than you can shoot off and we move faster on foot if you shoot us , LRs as Dedicated transports we do have heaps (again the BA took that from them too shamelessly) , we are experts in CC , re rolls to hit and wound ? piece of cake , CC king they are

 

- ) BA (at least use to be) is we are FAST cause we're red , we might be a bit crazy (Black rage which use to have side effects , is now replaced by blood thirst is kind of disappointing) but that can swing both ways (rage but also better at CC) , we can utilize everything that increases the speed we maneuver (yes , the BA's theme is actually maneuver tactically) to gain victory , CC is just a side affect that we cant control (fluff and rules wise) but happens to help us move through enemies

 

- ) DA , elites of elites and totally change of how the army can be played , raven wing / death wing = the most extreme play styles all in one army plus having what normal SM have , plasma is our beloved weapon and we arent afraid to use it (that actually makes them anti Marine army lol) , to me DA is more of a shooty variety of SM armies (though Death wing can be assault) , and they had the first idea of taking characters to change your army list thing before anyone did , so DA = We can bring out the best of the best and FOCUS (elites) on one side of things and make it deadly , theme is Focus on how the lists is played which also makes it unpredictable on how many combos you can have

 

ps: hope they get a new codex that continues the theme

[JamesI]

I think BA got cheaper vanguards for the simple reason that GW realized no one used Vanguards so they lowered the cost slightly (5 points if I recall correctly). Codex DA/BT (assuming they have Vanguard) will get the same cost reduction when they get updated and I'm sure so will regular marines when they get updated.

 

15 points for a fast rhino (15 points more than a Space Wolf rhino, not 15 points total) is fair. If it was much more, we wouldn't use them. The ability to go 6 more inches a turn is nice, but is it really worth doubling the cost of a rhino for?

 

And while we have several I6 characters (Mephiston, Dante, Lemartes) and WS6 (though WS6 is becoming pretty common for Marine commanders, I assume several wolves like the wolf lord, Logan, Ragnar and more got WS6) we have just the one T6 character (who really should have stayed S5, T5 and an IC like he used to be rather than what he has become).

 

One thing I think is forgotten with the whole Land Raider thing is the BA are the only chapter than can not take a Land Raider as a heavy support choice. We have to take it as a dedicated transport (which I'll admit is stupid, I don't see why Land Raiders weren't left alone).

 

I think the problem is several posters in this thread (and many others) are angry that Mat Ward didn't do a great job writing the codex but are taking it out on the players who play BA (though based on some of your stories the whole problem is you are playing players who either cheat or don't understand their codex rules)

[Brother Captain Kezef]

Every new codex gets the hate, it's a fact as old as 2nd ed.

 

I found BA codex surprisingly balanced, fluff based and fun. Took a beating the first few games I played agaist them, but i adapted and rebuilt my wolves to counter them. Now I violate them in fun and violent ways.

[Timberhawk]

What is the mask you're talking about with BA?

[JamesI]

Dante has a special item, death mask of Sanguinius. Used to lower opponents within 6 inches WS and BS by 1. Now it can target an IC before the game and lower a whole bunch of their stats by 1.

[raptor1199]

i thougth that lion was the best tactican :lol:

[whitewolfmxc]

I think the problem is several posters in this thread (and many others) are angry that Mat Ward didn't do a great job writing the codex but are taking it out on the players who play BA (though based on some of your stories the whole problem is you are playing players who either cheat or don't understand their codex rules)

 

Then these guys who blame the players are idiots , blame the game and its designers not the players.

 

But yes since the book is new , power gamers or band wagoners tend to jump ship and dues the chances of someone fighting thier BA armies is increased , hence stories like these show up . which is sad cause the older players and the genuine players take the blame all together ><

[Matt D]

i thougth that lion was the best tactican ;)

I thought it was thoes 2 loyalists Alpharius and Omegon... ;)

[fivepointedstar]

Space wolves have the best hq load-out in all of SM armies. their hq slots each have two, so that means four hq choices. c:ba only have two, and so does c:sm. imagine a c:ba with FOUR HQ!!! OMG. devistation in the form of mini's i tell you. SW are famed for individuality hence having four slots and better load outs for hq, Once i bought SW codex i was in awe for how much options i now have to choose. Now my second army is BA and after getting it i was in awe for the amount of raw JP attack and the storm raven... baal pred, and DC's put out but nothing vast in comparison to the self make style like SW.

 

C:BA has not the options to get art armor, aux gernade launchers (which by-the-way seem like a BA invention)

 

And SW with Logan you can basically field squads of terminators with custom options and wargear. dang i with Blood Angels wer that lucky!

[Prot]

In short, we are the legion killer :devil:

 

The only thing I LOATH in the BA dex is that mask nonsense, buff your army all you want, but stay away from the stats of my army, this takes away a small part of the fun in my eye, its MY army MY book, stay away from MY stats.

 

This I totally agree with. BA players will defend the book, I understand that even if I disagree with that reasoning, but one thing that I find beyond comprehension is altering the other player's stats.

[LoneSniperSG]

I can see some CEO at GW telling Matt, I want you to write a dex that sells models (period). There is a reason for codex creep and it caters to the power gamer who has to have the best and biggest, he will drop his current army and spend 100s perhaps 1000s to get it. Wait till the results are in on some major tournaments, if BA continually comes out on top soon every power gamer will be using their shaved loaded dice and brag about his easy win all over the forums. ( they just cant help themselves)

Unfortunately this is probably the biggest driver of the entire business.

 

So very simple if you think the BA codex is overpowered, exercise your right to refuse a game to them. If you like the challenge they represent and want to work toward finding their weakness, then rise to the challenge like a true Space Wolf Lord and build a list that trounces them into the ground.

Here's the only counter-point I have. If you're a dedicated Space Wolf player, why are you refusing to play against thwe biggest, baddest army around? That's just not how Space Wolves do things.

 

I for one am glad that we did not get stuck with the stigma of being "overpowered" and attracting all the power gamers to our ranks. Like it just fine!

I don't know about you, but around my area, Thunderwolf Cavalry drove a few known powergamers up a tree of .. well.. it tickled their fancy. Didn't last very long though.

 

 

 

In short, we are the legion killer :devil:

 

The only thing I LOATH in the BA dex is that mask nonsense, buff your army all you want, but stay away from the stats of my army, this takes away a small part of the fun in my eye, its MY army MY book, stay away from MY stats.

 

This I totally agree with. BA players will defend the book, I understand that even if I disagree with that reasoning, but one thing that I find beyond comprehension is altering the other player's stats.

 

Dante's Death Mask? Oh.. fortunately for me I don't have to worry about that too much. I told my BA friend that if he breaks out Dante then he'll see Bjorn the Fell-handed moving up to take him on in an old-man duel. If that doesn't work, I happily informed him that I can spam so many Terminators that he won't be able to move. He's obliged.

 

He likes to spam Mephistion though. Thank you thank you Phil Kelly for our Rune Priests.. thank you so much..

[Grey Mage]

I think BA got cheaper vanguards for the simple reason that GW realized no one used Vanguards so they lowered the cost slightly (5 points if I recall correctly). Codex DA/BT (assuming they have Vanguard) will get the same cost reduction when they get updated and I'm sure so will regular marines when they get updated.

I think the problem here is, and particularly among SWs who waited a decade for their codex to update, the idea of waiting 5 years to get a reduction in the costs of their devastators.... it just doesnt seem likely. By that time their will be a whole new balance.

 

 

I think the problem is several posters in this thread (and many others) are angry that Mat Ward didn't do a great job writing the codex but are taking it out on the players who play BA (though based on some of your stories the whole problem is you are playing players who either cheat or don't understand their codex rules)

Thats something we can see with every codex though- half a year ago the same thing was leveled at alot of wolf players, you mention the word jaws in any thread and there was an explosion of rage, and nothing but complaints about long fang heavy weapon prices, and chaos still screams about how GHs are better- though I hate to admit it, their troops are more flexable with the ability to take marks and heavy weapons.

 

And the Ultramarines.... wow. Its not their fault that GW, and in particular Matt Ward said some rude things on 'their' behalf. Some of these players have taken it and ran with it though, others have thrown up their hands and said 'What?'.

 

When BT comes out next year, or GKs, theyll be the targetted ones- its not right, but its how the mobs mind works.

[LoneSniperSG]

I think BA got cheaper vanguards for the simple reason that GW realized no one used Vanguards so they lowered the cost slightly (5 points if I recall correctly). Codex DA/BT (assuming they have Vanguard) will get the same cost reduction when they get updated and I'm sure so will regular marines when they get updated.

I think the problem here is, and particularly among SWs who waited a decade for their codex to update, the idea of waiting 5 years to get a reduction in the costs of their devastators.... it just doesnt seem likely. By that time their will be a whole new balance.

 

I doubt the reduced price has anything to do with either of those. It probably has more to do with jump-pack spam and how much of it the BA can take. Think about it! Dante can take a jump pack, Death Company can, Honour Guard can.. there's so many jump pack options in those unit listings that I'm suprised dreadnoughts can't have them.

 

It's a simple part of flavor and fluff, just like us and beards.

[Stormbrow II]

When BT comes out next year, or GKs, theyll be the targetted ones- its not right, but its how the mobs mind works.

Another one. Less of the well thought-out coherent responses, please.

 

The new books won't change anything. It's impossible. The BA are the most broken book ever released. They're to 40k what the Daemons of Chaos are to Fantasy - its usually only luck that determines whether you beat them or not.

 

I for one am glad that we did not get stuck with the stigma of being "overpowered" and attracting all the power gamers to our ranks.

Of course we're not. Absolutely everybody else online agrees with you 100%.

 

When BT get their assault ramps as upgrades for Rhinos you'll hear the sounds of nerds whining and the world ending.

[Rokafort Stonewolf]

At least a few people here are smart enough to understand that the problem lies with :cussty design, not players who use the best stuff...

[Hotspur]

When BT get their assault ramps as upgrades for Rhinos you'll hear the sounds of nerds whining and the world ending.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[LoneSniperSG]

When BT get their assault ramps as upgrades for Rhinos you'll hear the sounds of nerds whining and the world ending.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

 

Then after that you'll hear wolf howls and thunderhammers banging on the rhino trying to break it open so we can get the charge. XD

[KiltedMarine]

The new books won't change anything. It's impossible. The BA are the most broken book ever released. They're to 40k what the Daemons of Chaos are to Fantasy - its usually only luck that determines whether you beat them or not.

 

I can't agree. I once played Eldar in Dark Millennium days. Way more broken. :lol:

 

That said, yes, Mephiston and Dante are both horrific. But what I've seen at my own LGS is that the army is a see-saw one. It either wins big or loses just as big. BA right now have psychology on their side- everybody's afraid of the power of their rules, and their invincibility becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy as a result.

 

Once they're shown to be flesh and (lots of) blood, they get beaten just like any other army.

 

Except the Sons of Russ, that is. :lol:

[Timberhawk]

That mask sounds pretty annoying.

 

I'm interested in seeing what they do for Witchhunters/Deamonhunters and Black Templar. If our codex and C:BA are any indication it should be interesting.

[Valerian]

The new books won't change anything. It's impossible. The BA are the most broken book ever released. They're to 40k what the Daemons of Chaos are to Fantasy - its usually only luck that determines whether you beat them or not.

 

I can't agree.

 

I don't agree either; I played several games against Blood Angels (different opponents with vastly different lists and styles), and didn't have a problem in any of the games. I think they are pretty well balanced overall. In fact, I've even got a BA based DIY army that I've been collecting since 3rd, and I haven't played with it yet with the 5th Edition codex, because I like what I can do with my Wolves better (and more reliably).

 

V

[Brother-Chaplain Gaius]

good evening brothers

okay, so im a Wolves player and my girlfriend has just recently bought Blood Angels

i had my army a little while before she took up the game and i got rather familiar with my codex

so, the Wolves are supposed to be an army based upon mighty heroes, yes? among the greatest warriors ever to live, Logan, Ragnar, Bjorn etc etc

were also supposed to be beer drinking, close combat seeking, finger flipping nutters right?

so then why on the emperors throne, do the Blood Angels heroes totally eclipse anything ive ever seen?

i read through the section on the Sanguinor and seriously... what did the chump ever actually do? his stats are insane

then i came across Mephiston and couldnt believe my eyes, he costs roughly the same as Ragnar Blackmane and although ive not actually play tested it, i think if they met each other on the field, Ragnar would eat it practically every time.

also, to say the Space Wolves are supposed to value heroes more than anyone else, we really dont have that many unique models to choose from i dont think, especially not compared to the BA's. it seems to me that for all intents and purposes the Blood Angels have stolen all of the thunder the wolves have to offer

i think personally, GW went a little bit mental with them and got slightly over excited, i mean Arjac Rockfist, nicknamed 'The Anvil of Fenris' has S5... but Mephiston, regular sized dude... rather large mind has S6?? dosnt seem right to me

 

whats your views on this?

 

and apologies if this is in the wrong place, i wasn't really sure where to put it

 

the new BA codex should be burned. not only did wolves get the shaft everyone else did too. BAs do everything better than everybody else!

 

I feel your pain brothers!

[Grey Mage]

the new BA codex should be burned. not only did wolves get the shaft everyone else did too. BAs do everything better than everybody else!

 

I feel your pain brothers!

Its really not that bad- sure, 1 on 1 comparisons it doesnt seem like those extra points they pay mean much, but they add up fast in function.

 

And its not like you can have an army of solid devastators.

[Stormbrow II]

I don't agree either; I played several games against Blood Angels (different opponents with vastly different lists and styles), and didn't have a problem in any of the games. I think they are pretty well balanced overall. In fact, I've even got a BA based DIY army that I've been collecting since 3rd, and I haven't played with it yet with the 5th Edition codex, because I like what I can do with my Wolves better (and more reliably).

 

V

In case you couldn't tell from my faux-hysterical ranting, I'm actually in the group of people that believe that the BA book *isn't* overpowered. They're just different which is a good thing.

 

They are the flavour of the month and when the mass hysteria that follows any new release dies down everyone will realise that its just another army that can be beaten.