Ork super Nobz

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

So there is a new player at my gaming club who is die hard Orks. He even tried telling me that fungus beer is more potent then good old Fenrisian ale :) to this i replied with a challange. A 2500 game of my Wolves vs his Orks to which he accepted.

 

Now I won the game but it was a VERY VERY close run, the reason being his unit that he called his Supa Medikaded Cybork Boyz that served as a body guard for his Warboss. Now as an Ork player I was shocked when he told me the layout of the unit not because of what was in it or of the sheer price of the unit but because I had never known anyone to field it even though I had contemplated it myself a few times for apocalypse games.

 

The unit consisted of

 

warboss armed with mega armor, attack squig, cybork body and a boss pole.

 

10 nobz all with big choppas, eavy armor, 2 waaagh banners, and a pain boy who then went on to upgrade the unit with cybork bodies.

 

Now with all the wargear and special rules combined this created an 11 man er....ork strong unit led by a warboss with 5 S10 attacks who is attacking last but at WS 6 with a 2+ armor save and a 5++ save who also would have had feel no pain from the pain boy except i pointed out that unless the character already has the rule he dosent get it when joining a unit. So this is a pretty beefy warboss

 

The Nobz themselves were at WS3 S6 with an armor save of 4+ (not that great actually) and a 5++ save that was affected by feel no pain and due to the size of the unit (12 models) the unit was fearless.

 

Now some of you are looking at that and saying where is he getting 12 from? Well the player also attached a upgraded warphead to the unit. Now as luck would have it he rolled warpath before charging into me (he got ere we go the turn before). combine this with the Furious Charge rule and you have a unit with (provided all our math is right) 57 attacks on the charge. 7 of which at strength 10 that ignore armor saves and strike last but the other 50 are S7 I4 so the Orks and my marines struck at the same time.

 

Without getting to boring I'll just sum it up that this is a monster unit and instead of trying to throw everything I had at it I just tried to hold it up while I took out the rest of his units so my Dread, Blood Claws, Lone Wolf and Wolf Priest where kind of busy :)

 

What i'm wondering is how would other members tackle this unit in this scenario? He deffinitly had luck on his side with his Weird Boy roles but he also created a fairly hard hitting unit that can withstand a good bit of punishment. So? any thoughts?

[chaplain belisarius]

vindicators? that is one nasty, nasty unit...shame on him! :)

[Possessed Marine]

Pie Plates... Vindicators are your friends

 

Edit: GRRRR.... CB beat me to it!

[chaplain belisarius]

its ok mate-great minds think alike! (i love vindis...)

 

:)

[Possessed Marine]

meh, just kiddin' around :) but yea, vindies are perfect for this situation

[chaplain belisarius]

i know mate...(its weird giving tactical advice...i normally say..take vindicators! ) :)

[greatcrusade08]

im not sure how orks works but marines apothecaries DO grant FNP to attached ICs

[Meatman]

Telion? Take out the painboy then hit then with any AP4 or better weapons you have. Whirlwinds would be good, and they would also be great against the regular boys too.

[greatcrusade08]

fast moving speeders with heavy flamers ought to do the trick, thunderfire cannons tremor shells should result in a couple of deaths too, with the added bonus of slowing the fellas down

[Grey Mage]

So there is a new player at my gaming club who is die hard Orks. He even tried telling me that fungus beer is more potent then good old Fenrisian ale :rolleyes: to this i replied with a challange. A 2500 game of my Wolves vs his Orks to which he accepted.

 

Now I won the game but it was a VERY VERY close run, the reason being his unit that he called his Supa Medikaded Cybork Boyz that served as a body guard for his Warboss. Now as an Ork player I was shocked when he told me the layout of the unit not because of what was in it or of the sheer price of the unit but because I had never known anyone to field it even though I had contemplated it myself a few times for apocalypse games.

 

The unit consisted of

 

warboss armed with mega armor, attack squig, cybork body and a boss pole.

 

10 nobz all with big choppas, eavy armor, 2 waaagh banners, and a pain boy who then went on to upgrade the unit with cybork bodies.

 

Now with all the wargear and special rules combined this created an 11 man er....ork strong unit led by a warboss with 5 S10 attacks who is attacking last but at WS 6 with a 2+ armor save and a 5++ save who also would have had feel no pain from the pain boy except i pointed out that unless the character already has the rule he dosent get it when joining a unit. So this is a pretty beefy warboss

 

The Nobz themselves were at WS3 S6 with an armor save of 4+ (not that great actually) and a 5++ save that was affected by feel no pain and due to the size of the unit (12 models) the unit was fearless.

 

Now some of you are looking at that and saying where is he getting 12 from? Well the player also attached a upgraded warphead to the unit. Now as luck would have it he rolled warpath before charging into me (he got ere we go the turn before). combine this with the Furious Charge rule and you have a unit with (provided all our math is right) 57 attacks on the charge. 7 of which at strength 10 that ignore armor saves and strike last but the other 50 are S7 I4 so the Orks and my marines struck at the same time.

 

Without getting to boring I'll just sum it up that this is a monster unit and instead of trying to throw everything I had at it I just tried to hold it up while I took out the rest of his units so my Dread, Blood Claws, Lone Wolf and Wolf Priest where kind of busy ;)

 

What i'm wondering is how would other members tackle this unit in this scenario? He deffinitly had luck on his side with his Weird Boy roles but he also created a fairly hard hitting unit that can withstand a good bit of punishment. So? any thoughts?

To big to go into a truck... hit with a whirlwind for a few turns and then assault it once it gets close.

 

Especially because the whole thing has to move at the slow and purposeful speed of the warboss.

[Hellios]

Khârn the Betrayer and 20 Berzerkers... why... because I always like seeing the crimson wave and the green tide clash with each other...

[greatcrusade08]

Khan chaplain and ten assault marines with lightening claws and a couple of plasmas

 

S5, I5 on the charge with 30+attacks that re-roll, make sure khan goes against the warboss, with 5 attacks on the charge with re-rolls he stands a good chance of killing the big fella at I6.. if all those nobs are armed the same he cant play wound allocation shenanigans, every two wounds means a dead nob.

without Pks armour saves are going to save alot of the wounds he causes too...

[Captain Idaho]

Throw Calgar at them, along with a decent sized unit of Honour Guard. Weaken them with shooting for a turn and then counter charge.

 

Seriously, Honour Guard have a mountain of attacks that strike before the Orks. At equal numbers you can win this fight, though you won't win if they are the full 12.

 

Throw in a Chaplain and you are golden.

 

Don't believe the hate against Honour Guard.

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

Any suggestions for Space Wolves? Many of those suggestions are great but I rarely play my normal SM

 

As for Vindis I do have one in my list but my list is based around footslogging infantry but before I could blast the unit he took out my Vindi and Predator with Kommandos and Stik Bommas. Also as far as his mobility he put the Weird boy in the unit and upgraded him to a warphead which is how he got ere we go effectivly teleporting his unit across the field and avoiding the Warbosses mobility issues. I think it was just luck though, I still came out on top in the game I would just like to wipe that nit out next time he uses it :)

[KhorneHunter57x]

If I had to deal with that unit, I would use two squads of Devastators with Missile Launchers. The long range allows them to start shooting the Orks from turn 1, and the Krak Missiles punch through the armor of the Nobz and each wound insta-kills, making the FNP from the Painboy useless. The Nobs will be forced to rely on the 5++, and after a couple turns of shooting the unit should be down to a much smaller size.

 

You Wolves can take 5 heavy weapons in a Long Fang squad, right? Then I would consider two squads of Long Fangs with 5 Missile Launchers each. The Krak missile salvos will make short work of the Nobs, as well as any light supporting vehicles (with the Fang's ability to split fire, you could potentially kill 4 Trukks a turn with these two squads) and you can switch to Frag missiles for wiping out masses of Boyz. And when you don't fight Orks, the Fangs will still be a brutal firebase.

[amberclad87]

I've played against that unit plenty of times. Use a rune priest with Jaws of the world wolf to snipe the painboy so your shooting will actually do some stuff. If they ride in a transport use some long fangs to take that down (obviously before using the JAWS). Try hitting the unit with some instant death shots seeing as nobz have 2 wounds each, small arms fire won't do much. Then if you have them, A wolf lord on thunder mount with saga of the bear, thunder hammer and storm shield, riding with some thunder wolves. The wolf lord tooled this way can easily deal with the warboss and the thunder cav can do well enough to win combat. That would be the killing blow. Thats a lot to kill that unit, but it usually takes a lot to kill a death star unit.

[chapter master 454]

lemartes lead death-company with a good 50/50 mix of power weapons and CCWs. Depending on unit cost I would roll it at about 10-13 death company dudes with lemartes leading them. I charge, re-roll to hit, wounds and 50% of my attacks will ignore FNP. I also attack at strength 5. Let lemartes take one wound prior to the fight and he enters at S6 with 7 attacks. If that doesn't wipe them out then I don't know what will, Oh I know, 30 death company with thunder hammers lead by lemartes (ok over 1000 points but 60 re-roll to hit and wound attacks at str9 will destroy anything! instant death for most to boot, not even the nightbringer would face this would without getting killed quickly!).

 

However if I face it I would volley it with plasma shots after plasma shots with thunderfire cannons laying down diffilcult terrain then follow up with a charge of terminators. Fail that, throw lysander at it!

 

The warphead is also a chance to go BANG on his friends which could be funny. I personally would see my linebreakers taking it on, that means captain Finn and his 5 terminators would be at it with corryvreakan (faithful transport of Finns squad, redeemer). Rapid fire some combi-plasma into it the charge, aim of the fight, bring the war boss down a notch or two while the terminators also try to remove a few more orks. Fail that have Kayvaan and Ventris (my two ever loyal venerable dreads who are yet to let me down) take on the rabble with plasma cannon and DCCW. My only concern would be the warboss, try and nail him quickly as I can then hide in my land raider and let it rip with guns! (and even then, it took 3 nobs with power klaws 3 turns of CCing my land raider to just make it unable to do anything. My land raiders fight til the very end!).

 

Could just see what happens when 12 plasma cannons from 3 dev squads target one unit!

[Grey Mage]

Any suggestions for Space Wolves? Many of those suggestions are great but I rarely play my normal SM

 

As for Vindis I do have one in my list but my list is based around footslogging infantry but before I could blast the unit he took out my Vindi and Predator with Kommandos and Stik Bommas. Also as far as his mobility he put the Weird boy in the unit and upgraded him to a warphead which is how he got ere we go effectivly teleporting his unit across the field and avoiding the Warbosses mobility issues. I think it was just luck though, I still came out on top in the game I would just like to wipe that nit out next time he uses it ;)

Yeah, hit them with a whirlwind a few times since hes not making use of wound allocation games, and then either finish him off with a good Bloodclaw assault or rapid fire him to death with some plasma packing Grey Hunters, wholl then set to receive the charge of his supporting units.

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

So shoot to kill then finish off the unit with good ol brawln and Fenrisian steal or....whatever is used on Fenris these days ;) I really want to beat him at his own game and make a death star unit from wolves and really the only thing I can think of are Thunder Wolf Cavalry led by the same mounted Wolf Lord as was suggested earlier.

 

I'm a traditional son of Russ so I think glory is earned in the chaos of battle over the thunder of guns (thats why I sold my Tau.....well kinda) and so I usually have cc centered armies. I'll try out the TWC idea and if it fails I'll go to shooting, but i'll give my Blood Claws a chance to earn some glory first :)

[Grey Mage]

So shoot to kill then finish off the unit with good ol brawln and Fenrisian steal or....whatever is used on Fenris these days ;) I really want to beat him at his own game and make a death star unit from wolves and really the only thing I can think of are Thunder Wolf Cavalry led by the same mounted Wolf Lord as was suggested earlier.

 

I'm a traditional son of Russ so I think glory is earned in the chaos of battle over the thunder of guns (thats why I sold my Tau.....well kinda) and so I usually have cc centered armies. I'll try out the TWC idea and if it fails I'll go to shooting, but i'll give my Blood Claws a chance to earn some glory first :)

Why play his own game?

 

I mean, if you really want to- sure, 10 WG with 8 Powerweapons and a pair of Fists runs at 300pts, and could take those orks in their sleep.

 

Drop them in via DP, Rhino, or LR as you please- and enjoy 36 PW attacks and a half dozen insta-deaths to finish them off as need be.

[Jarl Bloodwolf]

So shoot to kill then finish off the unit with good ol brawln and Fenrisian steal or....whatever is used on Fenris these days :) I really want to beat him at his own game and make a death star unit from wolves and really the only thing I can think of are Thunder Wolf Cavalry led by the same mounted Wolf Lord as was suggested earlier.

 

I'm a traditional son of Russ so I think glory is earned in the chaos of battle over the thunder of guns (thats why I sold my Tau.....well kinda) and so I usually have cc centered armies. I'll try out the TWC idea and if it fails I'll go to shooting, but i'll give my Blood Claws a chance to earn some glory first :)

Why play his own game?

 

Because it's fun ;)

[Grey Mage]

Because it's fun ;)

It is hard to argue with such a straightforward point.

[Blitzkreig]

Crusader with Ragnar, a Wolf Priest, a Wolf Guard Pack Leader (mandatory power fist) and 13 Blood Claws (with Power Weapon). Expensive but will chew through the unit.

 

6-8 S6, I6, Power Weapon Attacks coming from Ragnar with Preferred Enemy.

4-6 S5, I5, Power Weapon Attacks coming from the Wolf Priest with Preferred Enemy.

4-5 S5, I5, Power Weapon Attacks coming from the Blood Claw with Preferred Enemy.

48-60 S5, I5 Attacks coming from the Blood Claws with Preffered Enemy.

Orks swing.

3-5 Power Fist Attacks coming from the Wolf Guard with Preferred Enemy.

 

Comes in at 838 Points for the lot, but you are getting a Crusader which can tear chunks from the Orks on the way over as well as Ragnar who can, if he is in the zone, slaughter entire units alone. I don't know how much his units runs but I imagine it would be sort of close (like within 250 points).

[Tau_Guardian]

To tell you the truth you can get rid of this in the same way that you can try and get rid of any other huge unit of this type, including the dreaded nob bikers. First you find out what is actually defending them. Basically the 4+ armor, 5+ invulnerable, 2 wounds, and FNP. Well what can break those? Anything AP1 or 2 or ignores armor or ignores armor saves in melee, or instant kills. That means if we want to get around that well then the best choices are weapons that instant kill because they tend to drop armor, FNP, and 2 wounds all in one go. That is 3 of his four defenses gone before he has ever gotten to make a roll. So how to do this?

 

Terminators of any sort can take large chunks out of this squad. Either thunder hammers or power fists carve through the guys in this squad and with all of the upgrades his orcs are more expensive than your terminators. Since you wanted SW the wolf guard can do the same thing though the thunder hammers are prohibativly expensive so power fist can pull it off. An again he should be paying so much for those orcs that it ends up being worth it and you don't have to bring something so massive like his that you normally wouldn't bring.

 

As said before the vindicator can eat large chunks out of that unit, ignoring almost all of their bounuses.

 

Long fang squads with either missle launchers (the best choice), or multimelta or lascannon.

 

Several squads of grey hunters with their double melta can eat many of them.

 

Also remember that the warboss is going to be striking last and he will probably only touch 2 or 3 models or maybe only one. If they kill some models with the nobs and you don't care about what is touching the war boss, kill the models touchign him before he can go. He is an independent character which means he has to be in base to base contact in order to swing his weapon. If he is only touching one marine and the nobs kill one, then kill that guy. You just saved yourself a bunch of armor save ignoring power claw attacks. This is a normal tactic for any independdent character with a slow weapon. Don't let them swing it.

[KhorneHunter57x]

Also remember that the warboss is going to be striking last and he will probably only touch 2 or 3 models or maybe only one. If they kill some models with the nobs and you don't care about what is touching the war boss, kill the models touchign him before he can go. He is an independent character which means he has to be in base to base contact in order to swing his weapon. If he is only touching one marine and the nobs kill one, then kill that guy. You just saved yourself a bunch of armor save ignoring power claw attacks. This is a normal tactic for any independdent character with a slow weapon. Don't let them swing it.

This doesn't work in 5th ed. Units get to determine how many attacks they get to make before they swing.