Techmarine close-combat unit.

[the_forgefather]

So a Techmarine with a Power Weapon/ Servo-Harness and 5 Servitors w/ Servo-Arms is 160pts, this is a pretty cheep close-combat unit that could be put in another unit's Rhino or Land Raider with a Captain. They can dish out 7 Power Fist attacks, assuming they haven't been previously killed, 3 Power Weapon attacks, and 10 attacks at str. 3. For a cheep close-combat unit, is this tactical or impractical? Also do the Servo-Arms get the bonus attack for charging? The Codex states: Each Servo-arm grants the model a single extra close combat attack, made seperately... Maybe this means you only get one attack from the Servo-arm regardless... Anyone?

[greatcrusade08]

you dont get the extra attack for the servo arm, any bonus attacks are at the serviotors regular rules, the servo arm is a wargear gifted bonus and NOT his regular attacks...

[the_forgefather]

Ok, so what about the unit I suggested?

[Ryjak]

I haven't actually fielded this unit, but Theory Hammer tells me it's a decent close-combat unit. It'll fall to any close-combat specialists, but it should do well enough against anything else. It's best used against vehicles, thanks to all the Servo-Arms.

 

I have this idea for building an army around two MotF with Servitors, 2-4 Dreadnoughts, and 2 Tactical Terminator Squads, along with two cheap Tac Squads. In theory, the army can plod across the table, with the Terminators blasting infantry and the Dreads blasting the heavy stuff, and the Repair Crews keeping the Dreadnoughts going. Any Assault will first break on the Terminators, which are then counter-charged by the Repair Crews and Tac Squads.

 

It's a slow-plodding Earth army, but I don't know how effective it would be, or fun to play.

[Frosty the Pyro]

Techmarines are pretty decent close combat guys (and the harness comes with a flamer and twin linked plasma pistol, both of which may be fired), however as IC's they can be targeted individualy and considering their wound score, well its kinda risky. This is why the space wolf version is clearly superior, even without bolster deffences and the option for a harnesss, they are not IC and thus can be hidden in their squad. They come with free thunder hammers too.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Don't get attached to the servitors; T3 and a 4+ save means they go away very fast -- and since their majority strength comes at I1, you're going to lose a bunch if you get stuck in with anything other than a tank. I'm a Techmarine advocate, but I would never say that this is a GOOD close combat unit -- we have other things that do so much more, and do it way better.

[Captain Idaho]

I've had a unit of CC Servitors against me once, supporting a Master of the Forge. It was surprisingly nasty, though it was used walking behind a trio of Dreadnoughts and engaged me combined with them. When units are hit by multiple units they become very resilient, as alot of people forget that you have to direct attacks from your models against models they are in base to base contact with 1st, so combining a charge (or a counter charge) with this unit in support of one your units will be surprisingly effective.

[Jackelope King]

The points-cost is one thing... but you're blowing an elites slot on it. For just 40 points more, you have TH/SS termies. Worse, this unit has 0 durability (no invuln save, T3 Sv4+ for the servitors... oh, and the whole unit shuts down when the W1 Techmarine buys the farm). The unit will suffer a lot of wounds in close combat (2/3 of attacks from an average unit like a Tactical Squad will hit it instead of 1/2, and same with wounds). And no dedicated transport means this unit will need to steal a ride from someone else.

 

Sorry... looks like it won't make the grade.

[Captain Idaho]

Yeah, those poor Techmarines. Space Wolves can create a reasonably sized unit mind.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Iron Priests can also take Cyberwolves to buttress the servitors. They might not have a Servitor's power fist, but they still hit like Space Marines.

[Koremu]

The Space Wolves can make the Majority of the unit T5.

[Brother-Captain Isaac]

Well, I would use it as a tank-busting unit but if I'm looking for a centerpiece assault unit, I'd leave those sevitors at home.

[Fatuous]

Over all I'm not a big fan of servitors full stop, their 'benefits' make any attached MOF or TM less than Space Marines, which I just do not like. Plus their other main benefit of increasing the odds of fixing anything, while nice, just don't seem worth it when there are only 2 of the 6 damage results that they can do anything about. I much prefer to keep my MOFs T as it should be, and will just hope for a bit of luck on the Mr Fixit role should I have the chance to use it. Most things that KO my dreads are AP1 anyway, so 50% that penetrate destroy them. Based on this, I'll accept a 50% chance of fixing anything, in the 1/3 of the time they get damaged.

 

The MOF or tehcmarine can be useful in an assult, but not really as a killy unit.

 

I attach mine to a Tac squad, and use that to seriously buff the shooting of that unit instead, if and when they do get in to assualt, with no INV save, they are going to drop quite quickly, so those fist attacks may not ever hit home. But on that note, being targetable, as an IC can be used as part of the stratergy, rather than against it. Your opponent will have to direct attacks away from the attached squad in order to get rid of him, and not take the PF attacks, leaving more tac marines around, increasing survivbility of the scoring unit.

 

If you want to add in MOFs or TMs, I would consider it on something like this. Give em a power weapon and perhaps a plasma pistol

 

10 man Tac squad. Power fist, combi weapon (I'd prob take flamer), flamer, Missile launcher.

 

Or this

 

10 man Tac squad. Power fist, combi weapon (I'd prob take still take a flamer, but maybe a plasma), Plasma Gun, Missile launcher.

 

Throw in your favourite transport to taste, I'd prob got with a pod for late game DS, so other pods would have to be included, but it'd work ok from a rhino. With a Plasma pistol, you could still do drive bys with 4 plasma shots without getting out. If you are taking a MOF for FOC reasons, this set up is practically free.............

 

I have a knock about list in the list board, slightly amended for points reasons.

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=207293

[chapter master 454]

The unit itself is good however techmarines and their servitors are not meant for CC in the agressive manner. You roll them along with your tanks and dreadnoughts so that anyone thinks about being a smarty and trying to assault them then you can repair them after the combat washes over or if it's a tank throw your techmarine and servitors at it. Yes the techmarine can be targetted but so what? just means he can join another unit after his servitors bite it (many a victory has been had from a TFC techmarine joining a tactical squad who was later assaulted and won thanks to the techmarine). The main thing is servitors are cheap power fists: 10/15 points for a power fist attack? Heck a techmarine virtually gets a veteran sarge with a power fist strapped to his back with a full servo-harness! I have even thrown my servitors that have lost their techmarine into fights and people get surprised by their hitting power: one servitor won me the game, passing his mind lock, climbing two levels and assaulting a remaining marine scout to contest the objective while I held mine.

 

One note is while the terminators are 40 points more, I may want to point out that 40 points is a difference in that TH/SS terminators actually cost 440 at min (land raider is required for those guys unfortunately). The best note here though is that some people charge the techmarine and servitors more to remove the repair ability and don't expect field repair crews to be tough: many a squad has lost their power fist or melta bomb (or SC!) from a servitors power fist or techmarines. However they are not meant for attacking, they are a defence and not offence. If you want CC power go with terminators in land raiders, more expensive but it will do far better for the CC power.

 

Also: MotF with power weapon = bargain HQ choice for points. 2+ save, 3 power weapon attacks, 2 further power fist attacks, a twin-linked plasma pistol and flamer? Sorry but not even a chaplin can cope with such gear for such little points. (yeah, no invunerable save but the 2+ will see good mileage!)

[mowglie]

One note is while the terminators are 40 points more, I may want to point out that 40 points is a difference in that TH/SS terminators actually cost 440 at min (land raider is required for those guys unfortunately).

 

Why is a transport required for the terminators, but not for the techmarine?

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Because the Techmarine (intended for repair jobs) can walk behind a maneuvering dreadnought or Predator and keep up if the vehicle is doing any shooting. The bulk of the tank can even be used as blocking terrain to keep the servitors out of LOS of enemy guns.

[mowglie]

But since we're evaluating the suitability of the Techmarine as a close-combat unit, what's to stop the assault terminators running behind the tanks?

 

If you're restricting its role to tank support (repair + countercharge) then sure. I just don't get the logic of "160 points of footslogging powerfist is ok, yet 200 points of footslogging terminator is not" - especially since the terminators are far less vulnerable to shooting.

[Brother-Captain Isaac]

What if the tank blows up? The Terminators will have their cover blown while the Techies will have lost their purpose anyway since their main purpose is to repair and bust tanks. Besides, the Techmarine has bolster defenses, Termies do not.

[mowglie]

What if the tank blows up? The Terminators will have their cover blown while the Techies will have lost their purpose anyway since their main purpose is to repair and bust tanks.

 

I don't understand. It's ok for the 160-point T3/mostly 4+ unit to be purposeless (other than Bolster Defense), but not ok for the T4 2+/3++ unit to not be in cover? That doesn't even make sense!

 

I'd consider the MotF as a solo-HQ to save 100 points if I knew I didn't need a libby, but I don't think I'd play the Elite techmarine for this purpose. If he could take his own transport, maybe.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Don't get me wrong, I think its a crap unit. I take servitors as a meat shield for my not-ever-going-to-move MOTF with a Beamer, and that's it. But if you WANT to take a mechanic Techmarine, servitors are not a bad choice because they help out his primary function -- repairing tanks. Bad news is that with the melta-spam of the current metagame, most tanks don't get damaged -- they get destroyed. There's no repairing a steaming pile of wreckage spread across half the battlefield.

[chapter master 454]

Don't get me wrong, I think its a crap unit. I take servitors as a meat shield for my not-ever-going-to-move MOTF with a Beamer, and that's it. But if you WANT to take a mechanic Techmarine, servitors are not a bad choice because they help out his primary function -- repairing tanks. Bad news is that with the melta-spam of the current metagame, most tanks don't get damaged -- they get destroyed. There's no repairing a steaming pile of wreckage spread across half the battlefield.

 

Yeah, it's why I pack lascannons and missle launchers along with plasma cannons and plasma guns with flamers as last resort: I don't let the :whistling: get close enough to fire. Trust me, so far my land raiders see melta and drive past without concern.

 

As for the techmarines: you want to ask my opponent who lost his demolisher leman russ to tech servitors? yeah, they aren't crap but aren't good. They are basicly imperial guard with carapace and power fists for 10-15 points a pop. Gonna argue the bargain there? Never under estimate a techmarine and his servitors, many a terminator squad has been foiled when I force their chain-fists to have to chew through my servitors who can easily knock them down to low enough numbers for dreads/tanks to finish off.

 

On a note: cant see why people praise melta, it's so easily predicted that it's not even funny. 'I have vulkan, guess what I have' '9 drop pods all armed in some way with melta weapons to the gunnils'. Not my weapon because you need to get to a range where it's suicide, the only melta I mount is MMs on tanks and Melta bombs on sarges (nothing more funny than watching an eldar players falcon go bye bye from a melta bomb when it trys the last turn shunt! Sorry, double 6, pick one you filthy eldar cheese bag!)

[Brother-Captain Isaac]

I don't understand. It's ok for the 160-point T3/mostly 4+ unit to be purposeless (other than Bolster Defense), but not ok for the T4 2+/3++ unit to not be in cover? That doesn't even make sense!

 

I'd consider the MotF as a solo-HQ to save 100 points if I knew I didn't need a libby, but I don't think I'd play the Elite techmarine for this purpose. If he could take his own transport, maybe.

 

The problem with Termies is that they attract every single AP2 template on the board, while the techies can still attempt to hijack a Rhino, whisk to the other side of the board, and do their job, Termies can't do this, and will be consistently outran by enemy mech, which in turn, means that they'll be purposeless and exposed.

 

According to above points, Termies require transport, and the only transport available is an LR, which will push their price up quite a bit.

[werewolf_nr]

The Techmarine provides a decent amount of killy power, but in a very squishy shell. He will go down if people look at him cross-eyed. Being an IC he is probably going to get singled out in close combat, but you might be able to twist that into your favor by convincing your opponent that he is more dangerous than the rest of the squad.

[Captain Idaho]

@ chapter master 454: I've under estimated them once before and lost a game for it. I won't again!

[Iron Father Ferrum]

You know, if occurred to me that I posted a Techmarine Tactica around here somewhere that talked about this a little.

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...hmarine+tactica