Tactical Squad layout

[Captain Idaho]

Target saturation doesn't have to mean duplication. A Dreadnought with Lascannon, Predator and Vindicator in the same army provides the same saturation to opponents as 3 Vindicators, as it's all armour that requires similar weapons to break open.

 

At the moment I favour 2 Tactical squads, one with Missile Launcher and Melta gun and the other a Flamer and a Plasma cannon

 

I use my Tactical Marines as pure support for any other unit with a specialist roll in the army. The bolters help units assaulting opponents deal with infantry, a Melta gun in one to act as an additional melta weapon in the army (sometimes 2) and a plasma cannon in the other to act as fire support. I can switch rolls with them as required. The Flamer Tactical can also act as strategic reserve, flaming any outflanking Genestealers etc.

 

In the past I would have used Lascannons in the Tacticals to support the army from afar in my stand off list, with melta guns in them all to give options against those deepstriking Ironclads etc. Other times, I ahve put Plasma guns into stand off Tacticals, though not recently to be honest.

 

Over all, I would establish what you want your Tacticals doing. I know some people favour losts of Flamers to supplement their strong bolter-shock attack, but I enjoy the cheap anti-tank weapons and Plasma weapons, so use them as flexible platoforms for those weapons and a lessoned anti-infatntr capacity, filling the role the loss of Flamers have with other units and vehicles.

 

Or in short, I favour a jack of all trades approach rather than specifying a role they probably won't elite at anyway (there's always a bigger fish).

[Jackelope King]

Target saturation doesn't have to mean duplication. A Dreadnought with Lascannon, Predator and Vindicator in the same army provides the same saturation to opponents as 3 Vindicators, as it's all armour that requires similar weapons to break open.

In theory, no. So long as two or more units have very similar offensive output and defensive profiles with similar mobility, then they can serve as being redundant.

 

That said, these "practically the same" units are pretty mythical. The suggestions you make here don't fit it that well. The Dread is on the outside of it, but can still be completely shut down with Autocannon fire, while the Pred and Vindicator are either going to need to expose their side armor to the Autocannons or will require fast melta to deal with. Plus, the weapons systems are different enough, and their ranges are fairly different. All of this coming together means these three have very different threat profiles to different armies, and there is clear target priority.

 

But all of that is for a completely different thread.

 

...

 

As for a tactical squad, I generally prefer to keep them cheap, and usually repeat the same layout across a force.

 

1. 5x Marines in a Las/Plas Razorback. Insanely cheap. Taken in enough numbers, you have the Las/Plas squads of lore.

2. 10x Marines, 1x Meltagun, 1x Multimelta in a Rhino. My go-to loadout for holding midfield. Still fairly cheap.

3. 10x Marines, 1x Flamer, 1x Multmelta in a Rhino. Not as good as holding midfield, but cheaper, and it can smoke light infantry out of cover in a pinch.

4. 10x Marines, 1x Flamer, 1x Missile Launcher in a Rhino or Razorback. Cheap, begs to be combat squaded (especially with the Razorback), but again, you need at least a few of these guys to create the mini-Devastator squads. Luckily it's probably the easiest-to-obtain configuration.

 

Note that all of these squads are mech'd up. Tactical Squads get a ride. Period. Except at insanely low points-totals, when you can't get enough vehicles on the table to avoid stun-lock, a Marine army based on Tactical Squads needs to mech the heck up.

[chaplain belisarius]

at 1k points i take 2 tactical squads- 1 with plasma gun and lascannon, the other with plasma gun and plasma cannon. Both squads ride rhinos with h/k missiles. I used to take 2 lascannon but ive had to tweak it a bit so that i can get my captain a relic blade (and its making a massive difference!).

 

My tacticals are mostly concerned with shooting the enemy but if they have to move to contest an objective or whatever-the rhino gives them that option (or if im facing thousand sons and their scary ap3 bolters-my tacticals stay in their rhinos and fire out of the hatches with their heavy and special weapons).

 

hope this rambling has helped out..;)

[DarkGuard]

I have a couple of questions in regards to Tactical Squad load out, namely on weapons I have little experience with in a Tactical Squad.

 

The first is about lascannons. I see a few people mentioning they use lascannons, and they are cheap in Tactical Squads. However, I barely touch them as they are still 10pts, and IMO anything a lascannon do a missile launcher can do, and missile launchers can do infantry as well. Lascannons might be able to penetrate AV14 but they need luck for that, they are better suited for light armour and transports which missile launchers can do for less points.

 

So how do you guys use your lascannons? Combat squads with Razorbacks? Use lots of them in a static gunline? Or just a handy weapon to try and keep tanks off of objectives? Have you ever thought that those points could have been better spent elsewhere and you should have used the missile launcher instead?

 

Also, the heavy bolter. Does anyone use this weapon with their Tactical Squad? I'd imagine not because the missile launcher can be similar in effectiveness and the plasma cannon is very cheap and much better. Is there any scope for a heavy bolter in a Tactical Squad? Or do we leave them to the Typhoons and Devs?

[Koremu]

If I really wanted a Scoring Lascannon I'd take a 5 man Tactical Squad in a Razorback with Twin-Linked Lascannon. 15 points cheaper, mobile and immune to Bolter fire.

[Captain Idaho]

I go the handy weapon route, but also use it early game to take snap shots at enemy vehicles early game. I don't think anything a Lascannon can do a Missile Launcher can also. Against AV12 a Lascannon get's a penetrating hit on a 4+, or has a 50% chance, where as the Missile Launcher has a poor 33%. Basically the Lascannon does something on a 3+, whilst the Missile Launcher on a 4+. It's like a guardsman shooting compared to a Marines.

 

Against those lighter vehicles, Lascannons excel! All you have to do is hit a AV10 vehicle with a Lascannon and you do something, a 2+ is a penetrate. A Missile Launcher can fail to do anything, a needs a 3+ to penetrate.

[DarkGuard]

I go the handy weapon route, but also use it early game to take snap shots at enemy vehicles early game. I don't think anything a Lascannon can do a Missile Launcher can also. Against AV12 a Lascannon get's a penetrating hit on a 4+, or has a 50% chance, where as the Missile Launcher has a poor 33%. Basically the Lascannon does something on a 3+, whilst the Missile Launcher on a 4+. It's like a guardsman shooting compared to a Marines.

 

Against those lighter vehicles, Lascannons excel! All you have to do is hit a AV10 vehicle with a Lascannon and you do something, a 2+ is a penetrate. A Missile Launcher can fail to do anything, a needs a 3+ to penetrate.

 

I understand what you're saying here, and the truth is a lascannon if better at taking out vehicles than a missile launcher. However, what I meant was that the lascannon isn't really a anti-AV13/14 weapon anymore, being more effective at light tanks and transports, which is something the missile launcher can also do. However, the ML is cheaper and can do anti-infantry. That was the point I was trying to make.

 

And I should have figured you'd go for the small squad in a Razorback Koremu, that's what I'd do if I was all mech. Of course at the moment I do have a TL-lascannon Razorback for my holding squad, they just happen to be 10 man and deploy outside with a plasma cannon :D.

[Captain Idaho]

Yeah, I found Lascannons in Tacticals are for those lists that have many Lascannons in it, otherwise a single Lascannon in the army inside a Tactical squad is a little lack lustre. So yes I would go for the Missile Launcher over the Lacannon unless you plan your army differently.

[Gothical]

I'm experimenting with a Tactical Squad set-up:

 

Combi-Flamer, Plasma Gun, Multi-Melta, Rhino.

 

It's mobile, it packs a lot of 12-24" range firepower and can take a pop at just about any target in the game.

 

Obviously it's not ideal for any one particular role, as it's a flexible generalist unit (as I feel Tactical Squads are supposed to be) but this means that the enemy will struggle to exploit it's weaknesses.

 

Usually it's backed up by another Squad of the same and a close-combat Command Squad to keep the gribblies at bay too. So the whole "section" has no real weakness and can take on a whole variety of threats - and thanks to the Command Squad I can avoid taking any sort of Combat weapon (which are either ineffective or expensive) in favour of boosting the shooting power of the squad.

[chaplain belisarius]

thats a really good idea...i like that!

 

lately ive been not taking a powerfist for my tactical sergeants and using them purely for shooting (2 plasma guns, lascannon and a plasma cannon, in rhinos with h/k missiles). Anything tries to assault my 2 squads...my captain (with relic blade, thanks for recommending it to me guys!) and command squad jump on them!

 

works a lot better now that it has an assigned tactical role rather than trying (and failing!) to do everything...

[Palorrin]

I think your tactical squad make up should reflect the role you want them to play in your army. My current army ("gun line") uses a flamer, heavy bolter, and a power fist with the goal to protect my devastator squads from assaults and hold any nearby objectives. Obviously I worry about swarms of units, extra tough or monstrous creatures, and speedy foes with this make up. I leave taking the more distant objectives to my sniper scouts... if they aren't too busy helping the devastators with monster killing.