Wolf Guard Terminator army squad size...

[LPetersson]

I'm currently trying to get some WG TDA lists together (I have my 1000, 1500, 1750 & 2000 points lists ready), but I can't really decide on whether to increase squad size or add land raiders at this point.

 

I'm keeping it purely TDA and as fluffy as I feel it can be.

 

At 1500 I have 5 squads of 5 TDA (5 CML)

At 1750 I have 5 squads of 5 TDA (5 CML) + 2 Rune priests

At 2000 I have 6 squads of 5 TDA (6 CML) + 2 Rune priests

At 2500 I have 6 squads of 5 TDA (4 CML/1 AC/1 HF) + 2 Rune priests + 2 Land Raiders

 

But... My dilemma is that I'm tempted to skip the landraiders, and maybe get 3 Dreadnoughts and add more termies.

I could possibly squeeze in another Rune Priest or put a Wolf Priest in my assault oriented squad (Most squads are good at shooting and assaulting, but one is slightly more assaulty...

 

I am vexed by the cost/performance ratio of AssCannons now, so I'm not happy about taking them these days... Terribly distressing as I loved them in our old codex...

 

But anyway, what are those of you who are fielding fluffy TDA armies at 2000+ points doing at that point?

Adding more termies? Adding Landraiders (I like the idea of fielding 4)? Adding Dreadnoughts?

 

I don't feel that predators/Vindicators/Land Speeders are particularly fluffy, but each to his own...

 

I am also tempted to cut two squads down a bit, to 3 models, so they can hold objectives (Having said that, in my area we use the Battle missions book, so you really never have any idea what the mission will be...) and add those models to a squad or two to have a really nice and big unit as the centre piece...

[Karack Blackstone]

Are you taking Logan Grimnar? If so, then fine.

 

If not, where are your troop choices...?

 

Otherwise, just remember even Termies can die to the right kind of weapons: A full squad plus Ragnar could be interesting if you protect him and toss in a Wolf Priest. Otherwise I'd limit it to units that can fit into the Land Raider Variants, and get up to four. One Dedicated, three Heavy Support if that is what you intend to do.

 

Play your army how you want, just keep a lookout for anti-termy units and have a plan for them.

[slmellon]

I am confused, you can take a landraider as a dedicated transport? I thought they were heavy support only? Is it a terminator dedicated transport? Not looking at the dex as of this second. So confused...going to check the book now

[LPetersson]

Are you taking Logan Grimnar? If so, then fine.

 

Of course, otherwise I couldn't do a WG TDA army, I figured it would be understood, hence why I didn't mention him...

 

If not, where are your troop choices...?

 

Otherwise, just remember even Termies can die to the right kind of weapons: A full squad plus Ragnar could be interesting if you protect him and toss in a Wolf Priest. Otherwise I'd limit it to units that can fit into the Land Raider Variants, and get up to four. One Dedicated, three Heavy Support if that is what you intend to do.

 

Play your army how you want, just keep a lookout for anti-termy units and have a plan for them.

 

Absolutely, Eldar with their huge amount of AP2 weaponry are my bane, and I have learned the hard way not to Drop pod into the middle of an eldar list. And their Bladestorms are no fun either...

 

I'd love to take Ragnar, but he's not in TDA :-/

 

I'll probably pick up a few Land raiders + Njal in TDA soonish to see how they do...

But I was hoping to hear from others what they have been doing at higher points values :)

 

I am confused, you can take a landraider as a dedicated transport? I thought they were heavy support only? Is it a terminator dedicated transport? Not looking at the dex as of this second. So confused...going to check the book now

 

1 (one) Wolf Guard unit can take a Land Raider as a dedicated transport and you can take 3 as heavy supprt, hence 4 in total...

[slmellon]

Ya i just read that...I dont use WG as much as I probably should, probably win more games if I did

[Anpu42]

Space Wolf 13 Model 1500 Point List

 

Here is a list I came up with for a 1500 point game. Like some others I just want to see what a low model count Space Wolf Army would do. For another 500 points I can add 2 Land Raiders.

 

Bjorn the Fell-Handed [Assault Cannon]

Logan Grimnar, The Great Wolf

Logan’s Wolf Guard

-Arjac Rockfist, The Anvil of Fenris

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Thunder Hammer, Storm Shield]

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Storm Bolter, Frost Axe, Melta-Bombs]

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Frost Axe Storm Shield, Melta Bombs]

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Assault Cannon, Chain Fist]

 

Njal Stormcaller, Lord of Tempests [Runic Terminator Amour]

-Wolf Guard x4 [Paired Wolf Claws]

-Wolf Guard [Heavy Flamer, Chain Fist]

 

Roster Statistics

Model Count: 13

% Elite: 0.0

% Fast: 0.0

% Heavy: 0.0

% HQ: 54.3

% Troops: 45.7

[Kassill]

Space Wolf 13 Model 1500 Point List

 

Here is a list I came up with for a 1500 point game. Like some others I just want to see what a low model count Space Wolf Army would do. For another 500 points I can add 2 Land Raiders.

 

Bjorn the Fell-Handed [Assault Cannon]

Logan Grimnar, The Great Wolf

Logan’s Wolf Guard

-Arjac Rockfist, The Anvil of Fenris

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Thunder Hammer, Storm Shield]

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Storm Bolter, Frost Axe, Melta-Bombs]

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Frost Axe Storm Shield, Melta Bombs]

-Wolf Guard [Terminator Armor, Assault Cannon, Chain Fist]

 

Njal Stormcaller, Lord of Tempests [Runic Terminator Amour]

-Wolf Guard x4 [Paired Wolf Claws]

-Wolf Guard [Heavy Flamer, Chain Fist]

 

Roster Statistics

Model Count: 13

% Elite: 0.0

% Fast: 0.0

% Heavy: 0.0

% HQ: 54.3

% Troops: 45.7

 

 

Wow, I may base my future WG-wing on that!

[Anpu42]

My Current Recors is W-2/L-1/T-0

I tecnicaly have not lost, but the one loss was vs a new player and I did not go full out and lost only becouse Bjorn got Wreked in the final turn and nothing was near him.

[Spazmonkey]

My Current Recors is W-2/L-1/T-0

I tecnicaly have not lost, but the one loss was vs a new player and I did not go full out and lost only becouse Bjorn got Wreked in the final turn and nothing was near him.

 

 

What are you basic tatics for this list?

[Anpu42]

My Current Recors is W-2/L-1/T-0

I tecnicaly have not lost, but the one loss was vs a new player and I did not go full out and lost only becouse Bjorn got Wreked in the final turn and nothing was near him.

 

 

What are you basic tatics for this list?

WAAAAAAG!!!!

 

Basicaly I usaly go Strong Right or Left Depending on Terain and Just Get Close. I usualy spend the fight going from one Melee to another while Bjorn and the Redemer takes out that Armor. I use the Crusader for basic Anit-Infantry Work.

[CainTheHunter]

My Current Recors is W-2/L-1/T-0

I tecnicaly have not lost, but the one loss was vs a new player and I did not go full out and lost only becouse Bjorn got Wreked in the final turn and nothing was near him.

 

 

What are you basic tatics for this list?

WAAAAAAG!!!!

 

Basicaly I usaly go Strong Right or Left Depending on Terain and Just Get Close. I usualy spend the fight going from one Melee to another while Bjorn and the Redemer takes out that Armor. I use the Crusader for basic Anit-Infantry Work.

 

I am working on a bit similar list, which involved both Logan (obviously) and Njal. I was inspired by the blog of our forum member here and deliberations made by Krewl, who is an experienced DW player. I am following towards the non-pure terminator list, which includes at least one pack of Long Fangs with Logan and CML WG dropping down and extensive use of combi-weapons on dropping WG terminators. The list so far consists of 3 DP, one with Logan and Fangs and two other with the loadout of CM-WC, CP-PW, TH/CFist-SS, WC-WC + HF/AC upgrades. These are both anti-vehicle/monsters and close combat oriented.

The main chunk is a unit of 10 strong WG, with several storm-shields and 2 CML upgrades, which accompanies Njal slogging across the table, whil Njal unleashed his powers and Lord of Tempests abilities,

I've been thinking about including one or two Lone wolves with Chainfists-shields and Fen-wolves, as well as probably 1-2 Typhoon Land speeders.

[Anpu42]

Was thinking of Adding Canis and TWC to bring me up to 3k

 

Loganwing 3000

 

Logan Grimnar, The Great Wolf @ 275 pts

Logan’s Wolf Guard Pack @ 455 pts

-1x Arjac Rockfist, The Anvil of Fenris

-2x Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Thunder Hammer x2; Storm Shield x2)

-1x Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Storm Bolter x1; Thunder Hammer x1)

-1x Marked Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Storm Shield x1; Assault Cannon x1)

 

Njal Stormcaller, Lord of Tempests @ 270 pts (Terminator Armor)

Njal’s Wolf Guard Pack @ 220 pts

-1x Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Storm Bolter x1; Frost Weapon x1)

-3x Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Power Weapon x3; Storm Bolter x3)

-1x Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Chain Fist x1; Assault Cannon x1)

 

Bjorn the Fell-Handed @ 270 pts (Assault Cannon)

 

Land Raider Redeemer @ 260 pts (Multi-Melta; Pintle-mounted Storm Bolter; 2x Flamestorm Cannons; Twin Linked Assault Cannon)

 

Land Raider Crusader @ 270 pts (Multi-Melta; Pintle-mounted Storm Bolter; 2x Hurricane Bolters; Twin Linked Assault Cannon)

 

Canis Wolfborn @ 205 pts

-2x Fenrisian Wolf

 

Thunderwolf Cavalry @ 435 pts

-1x Thunderwolf Cavalry (Storm Shield x1; Thunder Hammer x1)

-1x Thunderwolf w/ Mark of the Wulfen (Close Combat Weapon x1; Storm Shield x1)

-3x Thunderwolf Cavalry (Close Combat Weapon x3; Storm Shield x3)

 

Iron Priest @ 170 pts (Thunderwolf Mount; Wolf Tail Talisman; Wolftooth Necklace; Thunder Hammer x1; Bolt Pistol x1)

-4x Cyberwolf

 

Lone Wolf w/ Mark of the Wulfen (Power Armor; Close Combat Weapon x1; Storm Shield x1)

-2x Fenrisian Wolf

 

Lone Wolf w/ Mark of the Wulfen (Power Armor; Close Combat Weapon x1; Storm Shield x1)

-2x Fenrisian Wolf

 

Total Roster Cost: 3000

[LPetersson]

I was actually hoping for suggestions/experience with regards to pure WG TDA armies...

 

It's really a shame that any attempts at discussing that gets railroaded...

[CainTheHunter]

I was actually hoping for suggestions/experience with regards to pure WG TDA armies...

 

It's really a shame that any attempts at discussing that gets railroaded...

 

I stand to be corrected here, but my opinion is that pure WG TDA armies under Codex;SW are difficult/impossible to create in terms of competitiveness.

[Anpu42]

Mechanized: Space Wolf Terminators play like Assault Terminators out of Land Raiders. You need the Land Raiders to get across the Field.

My Experience it you want Standard and Crusaders. Redeemers are nice, but they don’t have the Tactical Mobility you need.

-Standard Model Land Raider: You can fit 5 Terminators on board. With out the Frag Launchers you might as well take the Thunder Hammers and Power fist. You might as well put on the Multi-Melta, and Storm Bolter and the Missile, because after you drop off your load your job is going to be Tank Hunting. The other way to use the “God-Hammer” Part out one of your Cyclones to a Long Fang Pack and use it as a Fire Support Vehicle.

 

-Crusaders: This give you the Capacity you need, you can get 8 in one and with the Frag Launchers you can assault of them nicely. Loaded up with the Multi-Melta and a Storm Bolter you can still move 6” and Fire Everything.

 

Redeemer: This one is giving me Problems trying to use, I have only used it twice. What I did the first game was load it up with Njal and 5 Wolf Guard, get it to the Middle of the Field and use it as a Semi-Mobile Fire Base. In the second game I put Logan and his Wolf Guard and ran strait up the middle. After unloading Logan it spent the rest of the game as a pill box having nothing better to do. This is also one I load up with the Multi-Melta, and Storm Bolter. The way the fight turned out I was able to use most of the weapons on the surrounding infantry and used the Multi-Melta in a Long Range Duel with a Vindicator.

 

Drop Pods: This is a Good way to get 5 in their backfield, but with all of the inherent problems. I do use the Deathwind Launcher. If they ignore it to kill the Terminators [and they will] next turn you will have Large Blast Weapon in their back field limiting their mobility until they take the time to kill it.

 

As far as the Terminators themselves, I tend to use them as either Assault Terminators or Tactical Terminators.

 

Assault Terminators: Both Load out and you Tactical use it what makes them this. Logan and Arjac are two of the best to put with them. The trick is to gat as many Storm Shields as you can and it becomes a tough nut to crack with 2 Eternal Warriors in the Crowd. I also find that a Wolf Priest in Terminator Armor is a Good choice. If you are going to give them Guns, go with Combi-Weapons, after you one shot is done you still have a “12 inch” Storm Bolter, this is not bad you want to be that close anyways. All of the Special Weapons are good, nothing is as fun as the Thunder Hammer/Storm Shield/Cyclone Terminator that just wont Die.

 

Tactical Terminators: Just March them across the field like a Grey Hunters in full 10 man units. Give them Combi-Weapons if you want, but not necessary. Just going with the standard load out of Storm Bolter and Power Weapon can deal with most threats, the Occasional Thunder Hammer or Chain Fist is good to have. You want either the Assault Cannon or Cyclone Launcher. For Tactical Work I prefer the Cyclone for this, it has a good range and you still have your Storm Bolter.

 

Hybrid Terminators: These can be fun as it is part of the modeling process, just start building them and loading them up with all of the cool bits. You end up with an expensive unit, but it will still be effective.

 

Ranged Weapons

Storm Bolter: This is hard to beat, 20 range 24” shots can even impress Imperial Guard.

Combi-Weapons: Nice and Relatively Cheep. Once you fire off the Special Weapon you are still holding a Relentless Bolt Gun.

-Combi-Flamer: Is ok for Wolf Guard, mostly as an Anti-Horde Weapon, great for soft HQs

-Combi-Melta: Great Anti-Armor, MC Weapon, but has as Limited Range

-Combi-Plasma: To me this is the Ideal Weapon for Wolf Guard Terminators. Coming out of a Pod I can not think of much it can’t take out, nothing says I love you like 8 S7 AP2 and 4 S6 Rending Shots. As a Tactical weapon you can feed those Chaos Marines like 16 S7 AP2 and 8 S6 Rending Attack followed up by and Assault.

Assault Cannon: 4 Shot S6 AP4 24” Rending Storm Bolter of death, totally worth it, but I think Over used.

Heavy Flamer: Good for fighting Swarms and in a pinch Anti-Transport. A S5 Attack against a AV-10 Open Top Transport with no roll to hit [Dark Eldar] or Cover Saves. Tack on Logan running you on Tank Hunter and you can pop Chimeras.

Cyclone Launcher: Twin Missile Launchers, put two in the Pack and you have your own mobile Long Fang Pack.

 

Close Combat Weapons

Power Sword: It’s a Power Sword and it’s Free

Frost Blade: S5 Power Weapon that cost a few points, but Killing MEQs on a 3+ is worth it, or for Monster Hunting, besides they are Cool.

Lighting Claws: I just gab them in Pairs for the extra attack and the chance of rerolls [Mix them with Logan or a Wolf Priest and Re-Rolls for everything]

Power Fist: Take them in Pairs and start Yelling “It’s Clobbering Time”

Chain Fist: Take them in Pairs and start Yelling “Hulk Smash”

Thunder Hammer: Why take a Power Fist when you can use one of these.

Storm Shield: 3++ worth loosing the Ranged Attack

Melta-Bombs: A good choice to mix with the basic Power/Frost Weapon

Mark of the Wolfen: 1d6+1 S4 Rending Attacks, and you can take it with a Ranged Weapon and a Storm Shield. I like to have at least one per Pack.

 

Leaders

Logan: He gives you Terminators as Troop, but that’s why you took him.

-Living Legend: This give you +1 Attack in a 18” radius, don’t hold it back it hit a unit that is larger than yourself, just use it and crush it quickly.

-Stubborn: If you have a Saga of Majesty nearby it becomes really hard to fail a Moral.

-High King: Don’t be like me and keep forgetting about it.

>Fearless: Great for running across open terrain in a Sniper Filled Environment.

>Preferred Enemy: Best Used vs. Monstrous Creatures and Infantry

>Relentless: Useless for this purpose

>Tank Hunters: If you are going for Armor Use this, It make Bolter S5, Assault Cannons S7, Heavy Flamers S6 and Cyclones S9

 

Njal: Put him in his Runic Terminator Armor [He still has his Bolt Pistol so he has the Extra Attack]. He can be used for both Range Fighting and Close Combat. The thing that has made the difference most of my games is his Lord of the Tempest Power. During the Middle part of the game he keeps a lot of units from wanting to get close to you. His Saga of Majesty Power is also a powerful Tool.

 

Bjorn: He may not be able to “Lead” a Wolf Guard, but his Saga of Majesty can make all of the difference. He is also a powerful Fire Support Vehicle and draws a lot of fire.

 

Wolf Lord/Wolf Guard Battle Leader: He can add much Punch you your Wolf Guard.

 

Rune Priest: Relatively Cheep Leader with some good Powers

 

Wolf Priest: He can give your Wolf Guard the Preferred Enemy, what more do you need, but he does make you fearless.

 

Arjac: He can only be described as one thing, THOR, just read your Mythology or the Comic and you will have the idea. He is also you primary Monster/Tank Hunter.

 

This might be a little long winded, but this mostly based on my experiences

[LPetersson]

I was actually hoping for suggestions/experience with regards to pure WG TDA armies...

 

It's really a shame that any attempts at discussing that gets railroaded...

 

I stand to be corrected here, but my opinion is that pure WG TDA armies under Codex;SW are difficult/impossible to create in terms of competitiveness.

 

Given that I wrote:

I'm keeping it purely TDA and as fluffy as I feel it can be.

 

And:

But anyway, what are those of you who are fielding fluffy TDA armies at 2000+ points doing at that point?

 

I don't feel that predators/Vindicators/Land Speeders are particularly fluffy, but each to his own...

 

I thought it would be reasonably clear that I was looking at a fluffy WG TDA army beyond 2000...

 

I.e. What do the others who build fluffy TDA armies do when they get above 2000ish points?

 

Make bigger squads? Pimp out their squads with more fancy weapons of doom? Add some venerable ancients(Dreadnoughts)? Lone Wolves perhaps? Or Land Raiders?

 

Apologies for perhaps seeming affronted, but it bugs me a little that ever attempt at discussing Pure WG TDA armies get railroaded by people who want to bring PA models.

Which I'm fine with in principle, but I was after pure and fluffy suggestions here...

[Anpu42]

I stand to be corrected here, but my opinion is that pure WG TDA armies under Codex;SW are difficult/impossible to create in terms of competitiveness.

Difficult: Yes

Impossible: No

 

The thing to remeber is that it is like running a Deathwing. You are a Small army, so what you need to do is contol the Battle. You have got to fight like you are Isolated and you are. this is part of the Reason I bring Bjorn. If you get an Objective Mission you are Screwed unless you can clear the table. You have to play every Mission as iff it is an Anilation Mission.

 

The Basic

1] In you mind Break the Table into Quaters.

2] Put you entire list in one Quarter opisite the one you want to fight in.

3] Quickly try to take the Quarter of the Table. {Drive those Land Raider like an Ork that just Stole It]

4] Don't Hold Back anything, you are going to get "Stuck-In" so Use your Once per Game items in the opening turns, they may not be thier to use later.

5] Stay in Close Combat, He can't Shoot at you if you are in Close Combat.

6] The main Reson for taking his Quarter is if you break a Unit it is going to run off the Table [unless they are Marines or Mabye Guard]

7] Use Crusaders with Storm Bolters and Multi-Meltas, This gives you Anti-Tank and Anti-Infantry at the Same time.

[Karack Blackstone]

I was actually hoping for suggestions/experience with regards to pure WG TDA armies...

 

It's really a shame that any attempts at discussing that gets railroaded...

 

I stand to be corrected here, but my opinion is that pure WG TDA armies under Codex;SW are difficult/impossible to create in terms of competitiveness.

 

Given that I wrote:

I'm keeping it purely TDA and as fluffy as I feel it can be.

 

And:

But anyway, what are those of you who are fielding fluffy TDA armies at 2000+ points doing at that point?

 

I don't feel that predators/Vindicators/Land Speeders are particularly fluffy, but each to his own...

 

I thought it would be reasonably clear that I was looking at a fluffy WG TDA army beyond 2000...

 

I.e. What do the others who build fluffy TDA armies do when they get above 2000ish points?

 

Make bigger squads? Pimp out their squads with more fancy weapons of doom? Add some venerable ancients(Dreadnoughts)? Lone Wolves perhaps? Or Land Raiders?

 

Apologies for perhaps seeming affronted, but it bugs me a little that ever attempt at discussing Pure WG TDA armies get railroaded by people who want to bring PA models.

Which I'm fine with in principle, but I was after pure and fluffy suggestions here...

 

Bigger Squads/Packs, and More of them. Just don't forget the up to four Land Raider types that can be purchased to carry them around, or work independently as needed fire support platforms.

 

Keeping purely TDA is not easy, as it is a points sink and what not, but doable.

 

Maybe this would be more your speed? (Going to have to check points later)

 

HQ:

 

Logan

 

Njal in Term armor

 

WG x (choose) - ___ pts (Again, by choice)

 

WG x (choose) - ___ pts (Again, by choice)

 

WG x (choose) - ___ pts (Again, by choice)

 

WG x (choose) - ___ pts (Again, by choice)

 

LR (Variant) - Dedicated Transport

 

Heavy Support:

 

LR(Variant) x 3

 

What you do individually with your army is up to you. I have a good many WC's WG, but only five with TH/SS. This is because I don't really see a normal need to do the heavy weapons on Termies, but in your case it varies.

 

Just keep in mind everyone here in this thread means well; it's the loss of communication that's getting to you. What I was trying to inform you of is that it's largely what you can add in. Do you want big transports, or big squads with dual heavy weapons? Kinda limited at this point. And if points are an issue, a few Redeemers at 255 each after adding EA might prove workable if you keep 20 to spare out of the rest of the list.

 

Edit: Not to give you ideas or anything, but here's my take on a WG unit you can modify:

 

Wolf Priest, Runic Armor (Can clearly be put in termy), WTN, MB

WG x 8, Twin Wolf Claws, TDA

WG x 2, AC, PF, TDA

 

560 pts without the Wolf Priest. And deadly to most things they run into.