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Gumo9

By Gumo9
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Vodunius Battle-Brother

Vodunius

Posted
Posted
Change the land raider as follows:

 

Each sponson instead of being a twin-linked weapon would be two weapons that fire at the same target.

 

Personally I wouldn't make that a specific Blood Angel/Land Raider rule. I wouldn't stop them being twin-linked, but they should revert twin linked rule to its original incarnation: one attack roll, if it hits both barrels hit, if not both miss.

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Zeller Venerable Brother

Zeller

Posted
Posted
Change the land raider as follows:

 

Each sponson instead of being a twin-linked weapon would be two weapons that fire at the same target.

 

Personally I wouldn't make that a specific Blood Angel/Land Raider rule. I wouldn't stop them being twin-linked, but they should revert twin linked rule to its original incarnation: one attack roll, if it hits both barrels hit, if not both miss.

 

Though I didn't say specifcally I did intend for it to mean for all marines.

 

Open topped makes little sense. Either you're an ork or you're insane. Besides, do you mean to tell me that our boys are better drilled at jettisoning from a rhino hatch that other marines? Is there a cannon inside launching marines? You seem me rollin in my AV11 box with the top hatch open taking a swig of ale. We drive by, pull hard left causing the tank to lift onto one track. 10 marines are thrown from the top hatch and into assault. *raises hands in the I don't know gesture* Word.

 

Also, our PA would have to make our rhinos not count as open topped for shooting like our speeders.

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Wildfire Veteran

Wildfire

Posted
Posted
If I could only make one (small) change, I'd insert the bikes-as-troops option into captains. BA are still a codex army, so the 6th company should still be trained in the use of bikes, right? Plus I drool at the thought of being able to take bikes with fast tanks!
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Crynn Veteran

Crynn

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So I've been playing Blood Angels for over 12 years and like playing competitively but really love what makes the BA's Ba's, their fluff. I figured because I would make lots of little tweaks as a competitive player to see units that don’t get use in games as much used more often and change a few things to fit the fluff better, I'd list the changes id make in their force org categories. Not all the changes I'm listing here are going to be for the positive more around what I think is fair and fits with the BA history. Hope you enjoy.

 

From the top

 

Dante

1200+ year veteran (he is actually over 1300 if you use lysnader as a reference who disappeared 1000 years ago and dante was master then) He has always been 'inspiring' in rules and in his fluff, one of his greatest attributes and a tactical genius. So changes

 

- Eternal Warrior, he needs to loose 1 wound 4 is unnecessary he isnt as tough as the fridge lysander who is T4 W4 eternal warrior.

- Death mask functions as normal wargear death mask but grants -2 or 3 ld modifier on the test

His mask is rediculous this curse is moronic other players hate versing it and it makes little sense.

- WS 7 Dante and Meph were the first marines to have WS 6 dante because he is so experienced and thus skilled, it would help make up for the axe mortilis being very average. His axe should stay the same, it has always been a master crafted power weapon no need to make it powerful for the sake of it.

- Sang Guard as troops dopped, other than being chapter master they have no specific tie to him, they are 27 in the entire chapter they arent for point taking, he should make vang vets troops or honor guard.

- His pistol was special now isnt, should count as a meltagun and a pistol like in previous additions

- needs an inspiring rule, has had it since before 3rd addition, reroll hits to powerful, +1WS bubble, perfect, 6"

- +15 - 25 points with these changes. After all he is the greatest chapter master alive, Calgar listens to him and I think these changes should come at a cost

 

Meph

First char to receive on of the marines high stats WS 6 str 5 toughness 5 yadda yadda a combat monster. I love Meph but he has rediculous stats even for him.

- -1str -1 toughness -1 wound. He should have eternal warrior trygons and tyranid biggens dont kill the bugger. Also he has beaten the black rage he should get back his fnp roll which would be rather redundant with priests but makes sense.

- Knows all powers. He is a chief librarian, and the only one who doesnt know all the powers, again makes no sense.

- IC status. He, in story has his own personal bodyguard he should have the ability to fight as such. (unleash rage would effect his squad too and him casting shield in players turn would be fantastic) this makes up for stats easily

- He should not have an invuln there is no reason why he should have one other than to make him broken

- + 15 - 25 points, IC new spells even with reduced toughness warrant a cost increase, then again he has always rivaled the big boys here (also remember his fleet wuld become useless in squads if he joined them as an IC unless he was with DC)

 

Sanguinor

Matt Wards wet dream, funny how he was never in any fluff and beats blood thirsters that Sanguinius himself once lost too. I would have not put him in the book and instead included a new character within the BA's, A high ranking captain or a chapter master to another successor. Scratch that bring back moriar the chosen. How ever we've got him so here's the changes.

 

- Choose the sargeant who gets the blessing.

- No IC status makes sense

I actually think he's a very balanced char for the points and with little fluff its hard to change things that dont need fixing

 

Tycho, and Psycho, our old famed captain, true in old rules he was horrible but is mildly improved now.

Tycho

- his stats make perfect sense as so do his rules in most cases.

- the dead mans hand should not be a power weapon it has no power field this is ridiculous. This is a quick fix to a bigger problem.

- He was a tactical genious secondary to dante lets play on that. sternguard as troops? this I threw around I will leave you guys to decide weather this would be appropriate. Allows you to move all BA units within 12 inches (his command radius well say) to make a normal move, 12 for jump 6 for infantry up to 18 for fast vehicles etc, after deployment and infiltrators but before scout moves as long as the move does not take the BA unit out of their deployment zone) This shows stratagy and allows effetivly a way of redeploying to counter enemies. We'll call this tactical precision for the sake of this post

- I stress his hand isnt a power weapon, I would make his digilasers count him as rending and give him a bolt pistol for an extra attack and shot while running in as well, all marines have one who just have bolters or a single combi weapon.

- -15 to 20 points, he needs To be cheaper he is very over priced.

 

Psycho

- joins the DC unit and can be equipped with jump pack for 10 pts as per codex wargear for my changed DC.

- Not an IC like lemartes

- Same as above changes

- loses tactical precision.

- gains an additional attack, weapon skill fc, fleet, fnp and relentless

- rends on a 4+

- loses his ld 10 army wide ability

- -15 to 20 points

 

 

Chaplain Lemartes, Our fav old chaplain

- Like all chaplains can control the DC

- Can loose his jump pack for -10 points (at -25 he would be too good for 145 points and 10 points should be jump pack cost for DC too)

+10 points, he is a hidden char which makes him hard to kill and ability to control DC warrants price hike with the slight change I'd make to dc being -5 pts off jp's and chaplain control

-No other changes here he is well costed for his abilities and fits fluffy really nicely I think, the changes that need to be made are to his unit the DC which I will cover latter

 

 

Astorath.

His ability which makes more people fall to the red thirst makes little sense, I understand what they are trying to say, he goes where the flaw is taking the most victims but actually having him come to kill your dc and that making more dc is a bit silly I think, "please astorath stay away and stop giving us more dc!" This ability is better left to Seth as it fits flesh tearers perfectly.

- remove his 1-3 red thirst ability

- any roll to hit of 6 with his weapon causes instant death (he fights dc and tries to decapitate them in fluff, and his weapon forcing invuln rerolls isn't enough to represent this)

- fleet, he has a prettier jump pack and should be able to go with the dc and their fleet

- - 25 points he is to expensive and doesn’t see comp play that much andl loosing his buff is a bit of a neg

 

Seth

- gains Astoraths ability to cause red thirst on 1-3

he was over costed before, with this ability he wont be

 

Moriar the chosen

- Our famous lovely rampaging monster why is he not here?

 

Furioso Dread (AV 13 on front) with blood talons melta gun and heavy flamer.

has the dc rule of none can stay my wrath, fleet and rage.

Venerable

- tear attack +d3 attacks on the charge instead of 1

around 210 points. why? because none can stay my wrath + Ven and AV 13 make him extremely tough and with fleet not to slow! also d3 additional attacks on the charge will be compounded with blood talons so this can be a big deal.

 

Captains.

Supposedly we have some of the best artificers of all the chapters, lets make that known and also bring back the usefulness of a captain

- New wargear, artificer armor, relic blades, master crafted weapons, glaive encarmine (which i would change to a two handed weapon with str 5 and a reroll to hit, mathematically not as good as a relic blade in some circumstance and slightly better in others, so not broken) deathmasks 10 points.

 

Librarians.

wargear options similar to captains

 

Psychic power changes

Blood boil - always pick target of wound (still an everage ability)

 

Chaplains

wargear options similar to captains - weapon options. should always have his chaplain power weapon (crozius arcnum, mind spelling), it is a mark of office. can change bolt pistol to other weapons as normal.

Can control DC.

+10 points

 

HG

-perfect well balanced and costed, sang novitive should be able to replace combat weapon or bolt pistol with normal equipment, does not have both a bolt pistol and combat weapon due to holding the chalice, drawback - advantage, you cant have everything and a hidden priest is amazing. Dante Makes troops?

 

 

 

So there are my changes for the HQ section of the codex, I think they are fair and fit fluff nicely without just wish listing for things to become over powered. So what do we think? Any votes to take Matt Wards position?

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Crynn Veteran

Crynn

Posted
Posted
Why so many asking for Dante to be T6? How can that be justified?

 

Dante is 1000 years old...

 

He is definately at least as tough after all that time and experience as Meph

 

Dude dante shouldnt be toughness 5 or 6 being old doesnt make you tough. meph isnt tough because he's old. he should be an eternal warrior so he can tbe one hit but thats it. even 4 wounds in rediculous, his i6 is actualy in some ways a defensive measure too. Some of the chaos chars are 10,000 years old and they dont sport toughness 5 and 6 because of it.

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Ozybonza Battle-Brother

Ozybonza

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Posted

I disagree about things like improving captains, giving other HQ choices more options etc... there needs to be a gameplay reason to use coodex:SM over codex:BA - the BA can't just be "SM but better" - there needs to be disadvantages.

 

Dante should definitely have eternal warrior though :P

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Crynn Veteran

Crynn

Posted
Posted
I disagree about things like improving captains, giving other HQ choices more options etc... there needs to be a gameplay reason to use coodex:SM over codex:BA - the BA can't just be "SM but better" - there needs to be disadvantages.

 

Dante should definitely have eternal warrior though :P

 

Improving captians to have the proper wargear makes sense in fluff and in game. Considering most competitive gamers would still not use captains as the chaplains and libs are better for cost it would not change the game play at all. Not only that why should the why be worse? your arguement has little merrit. People dont play marines so they can have artificer on captains. It's their special character captains that are the difference in the HQ slot.

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Redo Battle-Brother

Redo

Posted
Posted
While I want the Chaplain to control the Deathcompany, I wouldn't want it to be simply Rage doesn't effect a unit that has a Chappy. So something like a Leadership test to control them for that movement phase with some kind of modifier depending on the size of the squad i.e. -1 to Ld to control them for every 3 DC after the first 3, 6DC= -1, 9DC = -2 etc. Exclude Lemartes from this since he has the Black Rage so he is not able to control the DC like a sane Chappy could.

With this rule I would accept the cost of the DC jumppack as a calculated risk

 

I like this idea that if the Chaplin is with the DC that they take a LD test to see if they rage or not. I would even make it a LD 8 to make it a bit more interesting.

 

More stuff;

 

-DC Jump Packs 15 points; Why not 5 like back in the day. Hell I even think Veterans should get them for 5 points. Characters for 20 points. We are after all the BA.

-Deep striking Landraiders...do not like it.

-I think that all BA should get Furious Charge but every turn shuold have to take a LD test to see if they Rage for the turn. Good representation of the Red Thirst. I really liked it in 3rd when my Devastators went for a rage. Just adds some BA flavour.

-Points cost for storm shields and dual lightning claws.

-DOA also includes skilled flyers. I think that this suits the BA. Makes for a more JP army.

-Take out Stern Guard. Do not like them just have VVeterans

-BA Captains suck. Many have written it, they are right. Captains should have better options and artificier armour. All Captains should have 'Rites of battle' cool rule. SHame it is gone.

-Blade Encarmine. Just a dumb idea. Sang.Guard shuold just have Power weapons and pistols with the options for some upgrades.

-Better rules for Death Masks. Not really worth taking at the moment.

-All marines; the tactical set up is crap. Should be 15 points. At 5 marines you have to buy a special and at 10 you buy a heavy.

-Find the Stats for Librarians and Chaplins too reduced. WS5, BS5 I5 and A2 would be acceptible. Would be nice to be able to get an invulnerable save for a Jump Pack Libby too!

-Tech Marines deserve veteran stats to make them cooler

-Give Servitors relentless. A reason to take them outside of Devastators

 

Could go on but the whinge factor is spent!

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JamesI Venerable Brother

JamesI

Posted
Posted
Why so many asking for Dante to be T6? How can that be justified?

 

Dante is 1000 years old...

 

He is definately at least as tough after all that time and experience as Meph

That might justify eternal warrior, but being as tough as a Nurgle Demon Prince?

 

And Mephiston has unusual circumstances for his enhanced stats.

 

Personally, I think Dante is fine, though it would be better if his axe gave +1 strength or something.

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Kunanaki Battle-Brother

Kunanaki

Posted
Posted

I've went on a rant about DC before, but they need basic fixing.

 

1. Chaplain Control, needs to come back.

 

2. Rending? What happened to ya buddy? You're telling me that in one edition, I lost rending and control on DC?

 

3. Relentless, Remove this or give it more cool options, like fallen Devastators one handing a Heavy Bolter or the like.

 

4. Cheaper JP.

 

5. The "Special" HQ and Chaplain for DC able to modify. Tycho is an upgrade to DC like Lemartes, and Lemartes can remove his JP.

 

Those would fix one thing, but there is just so much more that's already been mentioned, especially about our poor Captains.

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