Legion Of The Damned

[traxter]

Wondering if any of you use these guys and for what purpose? They seem very expensive for any list. Are there any real reasons to take a squad or 2 of these is a 2000pt list?

[ShinyRhino]

The general concensus is that no, they're not worth taking because they're so expensive.

They're relegated to the "fun only" section.

[Ming]

My only issue is that these models are freaking expensive to buy. I'd love to actually proxy them in for a game or two. On 3++'s blog, I saw his recent (ongoing) dex review and rated the Legion as one of the most useless (3++ highly favors rhinos, sternguard, dreads, captains, and librarians as the best units to have).

 

On the other hand...if you run a list with pods and beacons, where you are going for a short range game, the legion might be really cool, dropping down and using multimeltas or heavy flamers as their weapon of choice. The beacons mean no scatter when nearby , so you get to drop right down in the thick of the action and get to work. The 3++ invulnerable save is pretty cool, and these guys cost as much as assault terminators or regular terms with similar weapons. I'd only use them where you know the opponent is short on power weapons and not hordes, so their 3+ save is not overwhelmed by amazing amounts of fire.

 

Tactically they are hard to use effectively, but you might be able to use them in interesting ways and freak out your opponent with them.

 

I'd give them a try. I would not use them as a mainstay in your routine list.

[Brother_Fatiswon]

at 220 pts, you get a WS5 power fist, a melta gun, which can fire out of deep striking, and a missile launcher than can fire while on the move, Plus by it's fearless/3++ stat line, can hog tie/tar pit pretty much anything in the game for at least 2, if not 4 turns. But needs to be supported like any other "Anvil" unit

It never makes the final cut, but it's always considered...

[ShinyRhino]

Meltaguns can always be fired out of a deepstrike, so the Legion don't really "help" there. However, I'm racking my brain to think of another infantry unit in the standard Marine codex that can carry a meltagun, and deepstrike independently (without the use of a drop pod). I'm really failing. Anyone else think of one?

[Brother Xeones]

That's the only one really. You could get a Combi-melta on an SC with Termie armor, but that's about the closest equivalent that I can think of.

[Chengar Qordath]

Meltaguns can always be fired out of a deepstrike, so the Legion don't really "help" there. However, I'm racking my brain to think of another infantry unit in the standard Marine codex that can carry a meltagun, and deepstrike independently (without the use of a drop pod). I'm really failing. Anyone else think of one?

Of course, there's also the fact that Legion can deepstrike and shoot not just a meltgun, but a multi-melta as well.

[Xeonic]

I have no idea why you'd give them a meltagun when you could give them a multi-melta for 10 pts more that they could relentless-fire on deepstrike(would give you vastly more play on the scatter). The only special weapon that's remotely points cost efficient for LoTD is the plasma gun since GW in all their infinite wisdom decided all the specials should cost the same for them(the amazing 20 pt. flamer is my case in point to stupidity here, and it doesn't even benefit from relentless).

I'd run them only for fun because the unit entry is poorly written and you easily inflate their cost by over 50% once you give them standard kit...

 

In a fun list I'd pair them with Tigurius for his reserves shenanigans, not bother with locator beacons or other silliness(they reroll scatter anyways and have a 3+ invuln for dangerous tests). I'd equip them either with a plasma cannon and plasma gun(possibly combi-plas as well, points permitting) or just a multi-melta(maybe a combi-melta/meltagun as well, points permitting) and possibly powerfist(they are fearless afterall).

 

As infantry hunters you could have a little latitude to get them early with the reserves rerolls, and as suicidal tank hunters, you have that, and a little more latitude to get them where you want them with their scatter rerolls.

 

My issue with them is that they're 30 pt marine models that die like a marine to bolter fire, but have that resilient 3++ to low AP fire(and according to their entry they have no armor save so psycannons/incinerators and nullzone can tear them up easily). In addition their unit entry is written in a silly manner with regards to special and heavy weapon costs. By GW's own trend, the weapon cost tierings used everywhere else in the codex are totally ignored in favor of more useful=more expensive, except in the case of the specials which all just cost the same(woohoo!?), which is more than a little silly IMO.

 

Anti-personnel:

LoTD gives you 5 bodies with 2a, a WS5 sergeant, supar awesome deep strike, plasma cannon, plasma gun for 195

For 185 you can have a 10 man tac squad with PC/PG, or 220 with the mandatory rhino. that 25 pts buys you 5 more(admittedly not relentless) bolter bodies, plus a transport once they're on the table.

Suicide AT:

For 215 you can field a damned squad with a multi-melta, combi-melta, and meltagun

For 185 you can have a 5 man sternguard squad with 5 combi melta in a drop pod

LoTD would have greater flexability of range and be more useful after one shot, as well as giving only one KP away.

For reference, chaos termicide only costs 105 pts for 3 termies with combi-melta, and that's considered a "viable" suicide unit.

 

Not as bad as all that, but when they compare unfavorably to the basic troops and other elites of the army you know something is off-kilter.

I still think the unit entry looks like it was written without enough testing by a person who was suffering from a severe sleep disorder. :lol:

[Brother_Fatiswon]

Well, i'm sorry you don't see the use of being able to put out Str 8 hits, in CC/ up to 12"+ movement, or 48"+ movement. or remember that you can't "Fired on" if locked in close combat, which is where the USR of fearless comes into play.

[Xeonic]

I have a plethora of armored vehicles and walkers that cost less points than fielding a LoTD squad and are more durable(vs some types of firepower) and more(far more in the case of speeders) or less as mobile, while bringing more high S shots to the table. I'm not arguing that high S shots on the (slow and purposeful)move are a bad thing, just that LoTD are a pretty poorly written entry. They dull in comparison to the other Elite fire support entries(sternguard and even tac termies), and the only real unique thing they bring to the table is a 3++. I'm really having trouble seeing why a firesupport entry being locked into combat is a good thing, even if they are a superb tarpit for some elite unit with loads of power weapons, vs most units they'll fail 3++s just like tac marines fail their 3+.

[Brother_Fatiswon]

yeah, but a single Lotd squad, could tie up (insert SC/MC here) for 3 turns, easy, be it that Great unclean one, God'fex, or say the almighty lysander or Calgar. or the stupid but overpowered 3/2 Th/ss|LC TDA assault squad AnD if i can keep your wrecking ball out of my line for 3 turns, well, pretty much earns it's points back.

hell, a pair of x5m Lotd could corner and hog tie a keeper of secrets for an entire game..but hey it's not a pretty or shiny blade, but it still cuts, and used properly, could cut deeper than expected.

[Xeonic]

Or for 20 pts more than a lotd squad with a powerfist you could just use TH/SS termies and actually kill something.

[ShinyRhino]

Or for 20 pts more than a lotd squad with a powerfist you could just use TH/SS termies and actually kill something.

 

But can that Hammernator squad shoot melta weaponry on deepstrike arrival, or reroll a bad scatter? Deepstruck Assault Terminators do jack on the turn they arrive, and can be outrun by a target vehicle, or simply charged with a numerous or sturdy unit to lock them down for a turn or three.

[Xeonic]

You do have a point, however the comment about using LoTD as a tarpit unit seems a bit silly when they fail their 3++ just like marines vs normal attacks. Plus they have to roll for slow and purposeful so they're also slower on foot than most things you'd want to tarpit.

 

My point was that if you're taking them as a deepstrike tarpit they are not the best option by a long shot. :)

 

As to if or not you consider teleporting TH/SS termies a valid tarpit unit, that's not really the point, using LoTD will have essentially all of the same drawbacks(though rerollable scatter may help), and with any sort of reasonable setup they cost about the same to more.

Of course, as I said, the TH/SS termies have the drawback that they may actually kill their target, where the LoTD just hold them there. The LoTD as you point out, counterpoint this by being able to pack potent fire support weapons, all of whom are totally useless in CC(the postulated role for them).

[Brother_Fatiswon]

But being relentless, adds 1-6 inches to the attack bubble that the Lotd bring, Plus, the POINT is, that the Lotd is a Jack of all trade unit. or Water per say. so your comparing fire vs water, or oranges and onions.. and in terms of Tar pitting, extra Lotd bodies, are 30pt compared to, and they bring the Ws 5 sgt, who, married into death, with his power fist, is HOW Lotd can stand toe to toe w/take your pick of HQ Commander/gods/monsters.