2 x 5 man scout pack (tooled up) or a grey hunter pack?

[matt01price]

At present i have a rune priest, 4 x 10 man GH packs and 3 long fang packs (1500pts list). Not overly keen on painting a 4th pack of grey hunters and would really like a little variation in game terms. This leads to questions about other units fluff etc.

 

Erik morkai's company supposedly relies alot on scouts and i am one for fluff so if i were to put in a pair of scout packs, 5 men each, mark of the wulven, melta bomb and melta. 105pts each i think, to range ahead of the mech advance using infiltrate and scout or to hit the back of the board with behind enemy lines..... question is do you think it'd work, or would they just get cut down?

 

any replies would be great :D

 

all the best

 

matt

[Massawyrm]

The thing to remember about Wolf Scouts is that the only difference statwise between them and standard codex marines is that 16% more die every shooting phase. So ask yourself: would my style of play benefit from two groups of melta armed marines popping out from behind an enemy? That's not a rhetorical question, btw. Some people would not benefit much from them.

[Valerian]

At present i have a rune priest, 4 x 10 man GH packs and 3 long fang packs (1500pts list). Not overly keen on painting a 4th pack of grey hunters and would really like a little variation in game terms. This leads to questions about other units fluff etc.

 

Erik morkai's company supposedly relies alot on scouts and i am one for fluff so if i were to put in a pair of scout packs, 5 men each, mark of the wulven, melta bomb and melta. 105pts each i think, to range ahead of the mech advance using infiltrate and scout or to hit the back of the board with behind enemy lines..... question is do you think it'd work, or would they just get cut down?

 

any replies would be great :)

 

all the best

 

matt

 

I say absolutely yes. Scouts are a great unit for almost any list, and are one of my favorite units in the codex. 9 times out of 10, you'll want to use BEL to bring them onto the enemy's board edge to threaten, tie-up, or destroy his vulnerable support units in his back lines. Every once in a while you'll play an army (Tyranids and Daemons come to mind) that this deployment won't be of much use, so in that case just integrate them into your own lines. They make pretty decent interdiction forces, and can set up enemy units for a good countercharge. They are really cheap for what they can do for your army. In several games I have had my Wolf Scouts beat the tar out of Blood Angels Assault Marines; it is so funny to watch an opponent's smile turn upsidedown when he seriously underestimates what the can do. "But, but, they are scouts!?!?" he will exclaim.

 

Valerian

[matt01price]

'use BEL to bring them onto the enemy's board edge to threaten, tie-up, or destroy his vulnerable support units in his back lines.' & 'can set up enemy units for a good countercharge.' this really is the plan :). That and trying to mess with mech players heads..... who wants to role through terrain in which BS4 melta, and melta bomb armed troops are hiding? no didn't think so.

 

Then again, if you meet an infantry advance, you're stuffed and are really going to feel '16% more die every shooting phase.' unless you can pick off straggler units/other scouts/outflank to hit the support.

 

FINAL QUESTION - 2 above scout packs OR GH squad podding in with melta, 2 wulvens (1 wg & 1 gh) wolf standard and a combi flamer on the wolf guard. This other pack to my mind would be a little more effective in combat and with bolters but lack the move though cover.... inflitrate and outflanking rules of the scouts are equalled by the notion of podding... BUT would YOU take it over the scouts?

 

Thanks for the replies, they've helped alot :P

 

cheers

 

matt

[Valerian]

FINAL QUESTION - 2 above scout packs OR GH squad podding in with melta, 2 wulvens (1 wg & 1 gh) wolf standard and a combi flamer on the wolf guard. This other pack to my mind would be a little more effective in combat and with bolters but lack the move though cover.... inflitrate and outflanking rules of the scouts are equalled by the notion of podding... BUT would YOU take it over the scouts?

 

Well, you've already got 40 Grey Hunters in your 1,500 point list, so yeah, I would go with the Scouts.

 

V

[Wysten]

Scouts would probably definately work for your army.

 

Though that being said, if you don't have a Rhino for your boys yet, worth considering that to get around quicker and shave off some of the heavy fire.

[matt01price]

the plan is to get the grey hunters in rhinos, but initially i'm using ferrero rocher boxes as a proxy, normally i don't even field a unit unless it's painted, but with transports... 5th being a mech game and all that.... need transports

 

cheers

 

matt

[Wysten]

the plan is to get the grey hunters in rhinos, but initially i'm using ferrero rocher boxes as a proxy, normally i don't even field a unit unless it's painted, but with transports... 5th being a mech game and all that.... need transports

 

cheers

 

matt

 

Heheh, fair enough, just checking.

 

Considered wolf guard to some of your guys? They can join the scouts and allow your Grey Hunters for more counter charges? Though you lose the special weapon.

[matt01price]

ok i admit it i was lazy when writing the list but didn't want to get called out for not putting this in the 'list' section :P so here is the list in all it's.... well not glory but you get the point

 

1500pts

 

Rune priest

 

GH pack 1 - (wolf guard - power fist and combi melta)

9 men

melta

wolf standard

powerfist

rhino

 

GH pack 2 - (wolf guard - thunder hammer and combi melta)

9 men

melta

wolf standard

powerfist

rhino

 

GH pack 3 - (wolf guard - storm bolter and powerfist) --> joined by RP

8 men

melta

wolf standard

wulven

rhino

 

long fang pack 1 & 2

2x missile launcher

2x lascannon

 

long fang pack 3

2x heavy bolter

2x plasma cannon

 

wolf scout pack 1 & 2

5 men

melta

melta bomb

wulven

 

i'm tight on points so didn't have the space for the extra WG on the scout packs although i can already see the great conversion opportunities :D and before someone says it i know plasma cannons can kill you own men, that lascannons aren't as versatile as missile launchers, wolf guard should have combi-melta and power fists only and that the list isn't fully optimised ;) but the codex states that the wolves are highly individual and hence i'm not the biggest fan of identical packs, i'll flex on the long fangs and the scouts because of points and models in boxes so on but i've written fluff for the individual packs and backgrounds based on kit loadouts etc

 

but to cut a long story short yeah i've got wolfguard in the GH packs but couldn't fit 'em in the scout packs

 

cheers

 

matt

[Jonas Stromclaw]

Yay!!! You used my favorite long fang loadouts! Don't let anyone tell you not to use plasma cannons, those things are amazing and nearly as versatile as missile launchers. Good looking list, but in my personal experience the scouts benefit from a wolfguard more than grey hunters do, so my only suggestion would be to take the wolfguard and attach them to the scouts instead of the hunters. Then you can squeeze that free second special weapon into the rhinos!

[Valerian]

Yay!!! You used my favorite long fang loadouts! Don't let anyone tell you not to use plasma cannons, those things are amazing and nearly as versatile as missile launchers. Good looking list, but in my personal experience the scouts benefit from a wolfguard more than grey hunters do, so my only suggestion would be to take the wolfguard and attach them to the scouts instead of the hunters. Then you can squeeze that free second special weapon into the rhinos!

 

Concur with Jonas here. What's better than a Wolf Scout showing up right behind the enemy lines? A Scout Pack with a Wolf Guard toting a Combi-Melta and Thunderhammer, that's what.

 

 

Valerian

[Barbarian]

IMO i would make one scout pack with a melta, meltabombs, MOTW, PW a wolf guard with them w a combimelta power weapon if i was to take scouts and upg my long fang squads to 6 (5ML and a squad leader) for each pack instead of different weapons it just makes them more versatile.

 

the way i would run it tho is to ditch the scouts all together and ditch one of the grey hunter squads buff the other one to a 10 so you have 3 decked out squads of grey hunters w a rune priest in it so you can get in close to have a psych hood and to deploy the grey hunters and leave the rune priest to shoot out the back and move around freely once they get into combat. I would also give the fangs some razorbacks to ride in w TLLC on them.

 

but thats just my input

[Barn]

I dont think scouts are a bad plan at all. But for me, i would rather lose with a fluffy list than win with a power list :)

[Wysten]

I dont think scouts are a bad plan at all. But for me, i would rather lose with a fluffy list than win with a power list :D

 

Fluffy is such a subjective term though, the main reason that Space Wolves differs for ultramarines is because their tactics work for them. If it kills them and the boys love it, why not? The only thing I find stretched is the numbers of Thunder Wolf, but then I guess once other boys start getting the wind of some of their brothers riding thunderwolf, they start joining in, resulting in many an annoying callout when Blood Claws try and do the same thing. XD

 

While they favour one tactic, it does not mean a complete absence of the other, unless your wolf lord hates scouts or something. Scouts are just another tool in the great companys command.

 

Besides, it beats the hell out of Grey Hunter Spam, while they are great, even I would start getting tired of them after the 4th lot. XD

[Valerian]

just another tool in the .... assinal.

 

That really sounds like it would be uncomfortable.

 

V

[Wysten]

just another tool in the .... assinal.

 

That really sounds like it would be uncomfortable.

 

V

 

XD Bad typo is bad. Sorry about that.

[WG Vrox]

Rune priest Chooser of the Slain - Tempest Wrath / Living Lightning

 

GH pack 1 - (wolf guard - power fist and combi melta)

9 men

melta

wolf standard

rhino

 

GH pack 2 -

10 men

2 - Plasma Gun

MotW

wolf standard

rhino

 

GH pack 3 - (wolf guard - storm bolter and powerfist) --> joined by RP

7 men GH

melta

wolf standard

rhino

 

long fang pack 1 & 2

2x missile launcher

2x lascannon

 

 

long fang pack 3

2x heavy bolter

2x plasma cannon

(Razor Back)

 

wolf scout pack 1

(wolf guard - thunder hammer and combi melta )

5 men

melta

wulven

 

Wolf scout pack 2

5 men

melta

Melta Bombs

 

Here is my suggested changes to your list. Having a Razor Back for your 36" range Long Fangs in a small list is a nice boost in both protection and mobility. I moved one of the Wolf Guard to a Wolf Scout unit and increased the GH squad to 10 man to get the extra plasma weapon for more of a take and hold unit. Dropped the MB for the assault oriented Wolf scout unit as you should not need them as much with the WG holding a Thunder Hammer. . I also dropped the PF from your GH as they are covered by their guard leader or like the 10 man unit should be held at range. If you don't have a RB model the PF should go back into the 10 man GH unit.

 

Your RP and the unit it joins should be held back securing the back lines, holding a home/close objective and casting LL or TW out of the fire port of his rhino. Your long fangs will be targeted by fast units and they will need the extra protection your RP and his unit can offer.

 

The changes should give you a better overall chance of winning against all comers while still keeping the fluff your looking for. Don't forget to name your RP Erik the wise.

 

Just some thoughts for you to consider. Looks good either way.

 

Vrox

[Wysten]

Would it not be better to give the Long Fangs a Rhino? That way if it's not safe to set down, they can just shoot out of the top hatch. If they get stunned, then they get out to clamber in a better condiction.

[Kalidane]

If you're happy to ignore Lone Wolves and Dreads then scouts it is for entertainment and hopefully good carnage too

[WG Vrox]

Would it not be better to give the Long Fangs a Rhino? That way if it's not safe to set down, they can just shoot out of the top hatch. If they get stunned, then they get out to clamber in a better condiction.

 

I prefer to take my chances and and put my long fangs in cover using the RB as an initial LoS flank blocker. When in a rhino if stunned or wrecked you can get out, but you can't fire your weapons and thats usually the time you really need to. In addition if its not safe for your long fangs to get out, then its not safe to keep in the rhino in the same spot to allow the heavy weapons to fire.

 

Vrox