minigun762 Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Ok I'd like to base my Defiler, mostly for cosmetic reasons but also to make the whole thing more stable. Its not normally something that is based so... Can I base it at all? What would be the smallest possible base I could use that would still be legal? Are there any major tactical advantage or disadvantage to doing this that I haven't thought of? Should I even bother? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Basing it won't make it illegal unless you somehow reduce the size of it (effectively decreasing the number of models who can close with it in BtB or make it harder to see around stuff)...if anything it'll make it slightly taller, which "hurts you", so I think you'll be fine. =) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2542129 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Ok I'd like to base my Defiler, mostly for cosmetic reasons but also to make the whole thing more stable. Its not normally something that is based so... Can I base it at all? What would be the smallest possible base I could use that would still be legal? Are there any major tactical advantage or disadvantage to doing this that I haven't thought of? Should I even bother? Can you base it - you can do whatever you want with your model. Some players like to mount their models on impressive scenic bases. As mounting your models on different sized bases might affect the way they interact w ith the rules, make sure before the game that your opponent does not mind this. This being said, most players I know wouldn't mind so long as you don't go overboard with a base modeled purely for advantage. Tactical advantages/disadvantages - I tend to base my stuff using either the smallest round base which is big enough for the entire hull to fit on or a regular shape which closely follows the hulls "shadow outline". In the case of some of my bigger, odder shaped models (like your aforementioned defiler) I would aim for a base which generally follows the "shadow" outline of the units hull/main body. Any blast markers which fall over the base will now be able to claim a hit, a disadvantage to irregularly shaped models, and it increases the close combat "footprint" of the model. It also helps standardize my odd-shaped models, making it very clear if an enemy has managed to make base-to-base contact and keeping two oddball shaped units from making a mess of base contact for HTH. Should you bother - I've been happy with my basing efforts so far. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2542132 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 I am not super aware of the size of a defiler, but the monsterous creature base would be the absolute smallest conceivable base, though you may have to search for a trygon base (which I think is larger), if even that is too small, try converting one of the vehicle flying bases. I don't really know. For tactical changes, it will likely increase the surface area that can be charged/charge with for reaching BtB. May also make it harder to manuver between obsticles (though it would not likely come up often). As for legality, I can't think of any huge problems, but it would likely depend more on your local scene. I would allow it, but I am personaly fairly permisive with modeling changes so long as its not obviously and malicously for tactical advantages. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2542258 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 I would just make a custom base for it- cut out some pressboard just large enough to place the defilers legs on in a normal position, and use that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2542283 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinyRhino Posted October 22, 2010 Share Posted October 22, 2010 Yeah, you're going to want to go with a custom-cut base. If anything, simply allow your opponent to place his models on the Defiler's base when measuring B2B contact and such. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2542709 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted October 22, 2010 Share Posted October 22, 2010 Yeah, you're going to want to go with a custom-cut base. If anything, simply allow your opponent to place his models on the Defiler's base when measuring B2B contact and such. This is a good idea; it actually happens in Fantasy all the time, so it's not unheard of for certain. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2542716 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 22, 2010 Author Share Posted October 22, 2010 As far as the base size, I was thinking of making it just large enough to cover all the legs but allow the arms and such to hang over. This feels reasonable but then again I'm not sure if someone would have an issue with that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2543075 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted October 23, 2010 Share Posted October 23, 2010 As far as the base size, I was thinking of making it just large enough to cover all the legs but allow the arms and such to hang over. This feels reasonable but then again I'm not sure if someone would have an issue with that. So long as you accept that the base is what matters for terrain, templates and HtH, I don't think anyone would argue. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2543118 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koremu Posted October 23, 2010 Share Posted October 23, 2010 As far as the base size, I was thinking of making it just large enough to cover all the legs but allow the arms and such to hang over. This feels reasonable but then again I'm not sure if someone would have an issue with that. So long as you accept that the base is what matters for terrain, templates and HtH, I don't think anyone would argue. The Arms will still count for LOS, templates and HtH contact Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2543309 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted October 23, 2010 Share Posted October 23, 2010 As far as the base size, I was thinking of making it just large enough to cover all the legs but allow the arms and such to hang over. This feels reasonable but then again I'm not sure if someone would have an issue with that. So long as you accept that the base is what matters for terrain, templates and HtH, I don't think anyone would argue. The Arms will still count for LOS, templates and HtH contact Yes, and no. -LOS : yes, they count for LOS - that's why I didn't mention it. -templates : partially - I was unclear in that I meant blast templates specifically, I apologize. Flamer templates will, of course, count the arms but blasts specifically state in their description that the base is what counts for determining hits. -HtH : no. Close combat rules are pretty specific about only models in base contact counting for determining who is engaged. Models only get a pass on the base contact if it has no base. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2543567 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted October 23, 2010 Share Posted October 23, 2010 Then we get into the realm of opponents permission, I would state he should make the base and then ignore it for everything, thus keeping the model in its original conditions for rules purposes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2543593 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakobus Posted October 25, 2010 Share Posted October 25, 2010 I would do something along the line of make a base for it and look at magnetising it so if who ever you play does have a problem it will be easy to remove it. If you plan on going to tournements check with the TO before hand, the guys that I know would most likely say yes especially if it looks cool. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2544409 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted October 26, 2010 Share Posted October 26, 2010 Then we get into the realm of opponents permission, I would state he should make the base and then ignore it for everything, thus keeping the model in its original conditions for rules purposes. Talk it over with opponent before each game to determine the appropriate treatment for the model. Assuming you haven't come to an agreement, however, then the easiest/fairest way to deal with it is exactly as GM has stated: the base is there to keep the model stable, but is ignored for all rules purposes, as the model normally doesn't have a base at all. Valerian Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/213633-basing-models-without-bases-normally/#findComment-2545914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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