Units that Word Bearers WOULDN'T have....

[Skirax]

Basically my mind is torn over the following units:

 

Obliterators

Defilers

Spawn

Chaos Dreadnought

 

I'll try and give my reasoning as to my hesitation, if you will:

 

Obliterators; Not fully dedicated to the cause of Chaos and tend to war for their own gain rather than that of the Greater Glory of Chaos. However they are Mercenaries, but this can be said about Cult troops.

Defilers; A crude and inaccurate representation of the Chaos Gods warmachines, and therefore a detriment to their Glory.

Spawn; As the Word Bearer's leaders do not go for personal glory over that of Chaos, they do not run the risk of becoming Spawn. But there is a chance that some may still turn to Spawn by dishonouring the Gods.

Chaos Dreadnought; Word Bearers tend to honour their dead, and let their souls pass into the Realm of Chaos. But then, there are some that have dishonoured the Legion/Chaos so much that they do not deserve the after life...

 

So, what would your stances be? Take some, but in moderation (ie. 0-1 etc.) or just be pure and leave them at home?

 

Thank you.

Skirax.

[Magnus Thane]

Actually there are 'sane Chaos Dreads' in the fluff/novels.

And the Wordbearer novels has a wise old Dread, a previous leader who is at times awoken to consult his wisdom.

[Prot]

Personally I think you're taking the definition of these units too strictly.

 

Over the years I've seen a huge pile of shift between what's fluffy and what's not. Trust me on this one... people will often say, "Oh, you can't take unit "X", it's too unfluffy."

 

Then it appears in a novel, or even a paragraph in a White Dwarf article and all of the sudden it is law.

 

If you must justify this to yourself, then use your imagination. There is all kinds of motivation to justify those units... and they are legal units.

 

Do the Legions possess acumen with certain specializations in warfare? Sure. But don't make it disabling to your army. The way the current codex is written it is very hard to be unit restrictive on yourself. The codex just doesn't have allowances for Legion specific builds like it used to.

 

You can do a mild version of this.... I know in the old days, a defining idea would be daemon summoning of some form, and a Dark Apostle. The Dark Apostle doesn't exist in Gav-dex but you can try something similar.

[Lay]

Imo, all four should be fine, since I don't recall any WB related fluff saying anything against them.

Well, maybe Obliterators, since they've only recently turned into a separate cult. Then again, they've always been rare.

 

Spawn; As the Word Bearer's leaders do not go for personal glory over that of Chaos, they do not run the risk of becoming Spawn.

There's no real pattern to spawndom, so that won't really protect them.

[Brother Nihm]

An Obliterator accompanied a WB kill-team in the novel Daemon World iirc.

 

+1 for precedence.

[Debauchery101]

the only restriction i think that word bearers have on themselves is that they wont ever side with just one god they are completely devoted to chaos undivided.

 

yes obliterator cults are somewhat independent of legions but im sure just about any legion will "employ" them for their own purposes

 

as for spawns it can happen to anyone

 

dreads are pretty rare in most chaos legions most that get destroyed will likely not be repaired to have another marine put in them later. but im sure there are still surviving dreads left in all of the legions

 

defilers are pretty much what chaos is about. demons in teh material realm killing stuff! i cant see why word bearers would think defilers are not good enough for them. compare them to say nurglings or plague beasts. those arent glorious units either.

[Brother Nathan]

obliterators, they may well now be a cult but wernt they the techmarines? just got bored with fixing veichles and making them selves a mixture of machine and other technological stuff. as i see it i dont see why they wouldnt have them appart from the hideous models....

[Rik Riorik]

I wouldn't have a problem fielding any of those. The only ones I have actual problems with for me are the cult troops. But everything is legal, and everything is plausible from a lore perspective irrespective if is is featured precedent or not. Novels and whatnae are things that are made up by quite normal people such as you and I. I see no reason why you should be disallowed to be imaginative and making stuff work for you with a plausible bit of fluff just because you don't get paid money by Games Workshop like they do though.

[The_son_of_Dorn]

basically dont be a blind fluff folower, im pretty sure GW get pretty miffed at the thought of their customers and tt players taking the fluf far too seriously (don't get me wrong at times im exactly the same) but remember its a multi choice game, even if i played as night lords id still field tanks and defliers regardless of the fluff "BECAUSE IT'S FUN!"

 

Either way i don't think there is anything the word bearers wouldnt field, just i wouldnt put an emphasis on their armies being technologically gifted (as per say the iron warriors with their fluff)

[Zeller]

Word Bearers use demon engines. Defilers are demon engines. Demons are tools in all of their forms.

 

Dreadnoughts are quite prevalent in the WB, atleast in Marduk's group.

 

Oblits would be out.

 

Spawn could go either way. Again, tools of the trade. Though since WB distrust psykers it's fair to say there would be nobody in their army capable of turning individuals into spawn and the CSM aren't fools when it comes to asking for demonic gifts.

[David the Despoiler]

Basically my mind is torn over the following units:

 

Obliterators

Defilers

Spawn

Chaos Dreadnought

 

So, what would your stances be? Take some, but in moderation (ie. 0-1 etc.) or just be pure and leave them at home?

 

Thank you.

Skirax.

 

 

You can take any unit in the Codex, they all have their use-as conventions. You don't feel like using a Defiler as a crab-like monstrosity? build it into a scorpion-like artillery piece, build it into a mobile turret, build it into a bipedal titan-like Warmachine, the possibilities are nigh impossible to count!

 

Obliterators are living embodiments of Chaos' nature. They are infused with Chaos just as a possessed Chaos Space Marine is. Except instead of really shiny swords and wings, they sprout guns. Lots and lots of 'em!

 

For Spawn, I'm going to go by the rather zealous approach the Fantasy Marauders have: Even spawns are looked upon for reverence, for it is better to be gifted by the Gods to the extent of madness then be ignored by them completely.

 

Chaos Dreads are also viable. If you read the novel Battle for the Abyss (Horus Heresy) you'll see that the Word Bearers have an extensive number of Dreadnaughts.

[Chengar Qordath]

Word Bearers use demon engines. Defilers are demon engines. Demons are tools in all of their forms.

 

Dreadnoughts are quite prevalent in the WB, atleast in Marduk's group.

 

Oblits would be out.

 

Spawn could go either way. Again, tools of the trade. Though since WB distrust psykers it's fair to say there would be nobody in their army capable of turning individuals into spawn and the CSM aren't fools when it comes to asking for demonic gifts.

Since when did Word Bearers distrust people who use the Warp? After all, their primarch literally wrote the how-to guide for Daemon-summoning and sorcery.

[Khestra the Unbeheld]

Since when did Word Bearers distrust people who use the Warp? After all, their primarch literally wrote the how-to guide for Daemon-summoning and sorcery.

 

It's a difference of methodology, as noted in Dark Creed. Word Bearers use faith; sorcerer/psykers use "magic". To a practitioner who believes that their Warp deity answers their prayers because of devotion and reverence, psykers and sorcerers who just "tap the Warp" to make things happen have to seem like the worst sort of abusers.

[Skirax]

The only reason I'm asking for these is because I'm making a Word Bearer codex, and I'm not sure as to what include.

 

Defilers

Oblits

Dreadnoughts

Spawn

 

Advice in terms of availability for the Spawn and Oblits, what do you guys think?

[the jeske]

Since when did Word Bearers distrust people who use the Warp?

as a legion or as a single dudes. because if the question is about single dudes then aside for 1ksons chaos sm sorc dont get much love from their brothers , at best they are distrusted.

[TheDarkApostle]

An Obliterator accompanied a WB kill-team in the novel Daemon World iirc.

 

+1 for precedence.

There are also those Blood Angel books, Deus Sanguinius and Deus Encarmine or something, where the Word Bearer host had like a dozen or so Obliterators at least.

 

Also technically spawns are not just created from Astartes or by the means of witch-powers. Spawns can just as easily be created from other living beings, or cultists, as well, and throughout the Warhammer multiverses there are many mentions of Daemonweapons who will turn whoever they harm into a spawn simply by exposing or injecting them with a far to strong dose warp-energy.

 

Not to mention that often spawns can be found in the hellish nightmare of the empyrean and gets picked up by other warbands and used as shock troops or meat fodder. And as beings filled with the pure power of Chaos I could certainly see Word Bearers pick up stray spawns from all over the galaxy to unite them in war against their enemies.

 

TDA

[Chengar Qordath]

Since when did Word Bearers distrust people who use the Warp?

as a legion or as a single dudes. because if the question is about single dudes then aside for 1ksons chaos sm sorc dont get much love from their brothers , at best they are distrusted.

As a legion. I've always taken it as a given that Chaos Marines distrust each other, but as far as I am aware, the Word Bearers do not distrust sorcerers any more than they would another battle brother of a similar potential threat level. Considering the fact that their Primarch wrote the book on how to become a sorcerer and summon Daemons, the suggestion that the Word Bearers disapprove of sorcery strikes me as rather implausible.

[the jeske]

well problem is sorcery is manipulation of the warp . forcing stuff to happen and learning how to get the proper resoults . that is a lot like science . WB are like priests , they have faith . maniupulating demons is like trying to manipulate chaos gods. Now that of course does mean they wouldnt use demons or defilers etc But just imagin here is an apostol starting up a pre battle prayer to summon demons and sorc X just tell "no dont , you dont have to do it like that , just let make this magic circle " . Of course here we are runing in to the wall of fluff vs rules . We know that WB have actual priests or dead speakers [dudes who can summon souls and animate them] , they have sorc too , but I think those arent many and are under close watch . Because a chaos sorc is like normal guy guarding the biggest police storage with crack in your country . sure he is a police man [ a sorc is csm too] , he technicly goes by the same rules[technicly a WB sorc is just as "pure" as any WB] , but If I start to do crack I at most be a local dealer , I he starts to do crack he can supply a few cities [same with sorc , normal guys get small buffs from chaos , chaos sorc get huge buffs from enslaving demons etc]. And this is customs offiecers working on the border hate the guys working inside the country . I mean WB dislike WB sorc.

[Gree]

Since when did Word Bearers distrust people who use the Warp?

as a legion or as a single dudes. because if the question is about single dudes then aside for 1ksons chaos sm sorc dont get much love from their brothers , at best they are distrusted.

As a legion. I've always taken it as a given that Chaos Marines distrust each other, but as far as I am aware, the Word Bearers do not distrust sorcerers any more than they would another battle brother of a similar potential threat level. Considering the fact that their Primarch wrote the book on how to become a sorcerer and summon Daemons, the suggestion that the Word Bearers disapprove of sorcery strikes me as rather implausible.

 

Marduk in Dark Creed makes a disparaging comment about psykers and sorcery. Of course in the very same book he summons daemons and is implied to have some sort of psychic/warp ability in an earlier book.

 

I guess it depends on how each Dark Apostle interprets Lorgar's word.

[TheDarkApostle]

Since when did Word Bearers distrust people who use the Warp?

as a legion or as a single dudes. because if the question is about single dudes then aside for 1ksons chaos sm sorc dont get much love from their brothers , at best they are distrusted.

As a legion. I've always taken it as a given that Chaos Marines distrust each other, but as far as I am aware, the Word Bearers do not distrust sorcerers any more than they would another battle brother of a similar potential threat level. Considering the fact that their Primarch wrote the book on how to become a sorcerer and summon Daemons, the suggestion that the Word Bearers disapprove of sorcery strikes me as rather implausible.

 

Marduk in Dark Creed makes a disparaging comment about psykers and sorcery. Of course in the very same book he summons daemons and is implied to have some sort of psychic/warp ability in an earlier book.

 

I guess it depends on how each Dark Apostle interprets Lorgar's word.

A Psyker is someone who has a strong link with the empyrean.

 

As missionaries of Chaos it's quite obvious that over time all Chaos Marines will develop strong ties with the warp as well. A Dark Apostle even more so as he as the one who bargains with the daemon packs to secure their loyalty for an upcoming battle.

 

TDA

[Gree]

As missionaries of Chaos it's quite obvious that over time all Chaos Marines will develop strong ties with the warp as well. A Dark Apostle even more so as he as the one who bargains with the daemon packs to secure their loyalty for an upcoming battle.

 

TDA

 

No, not all Chaos Marines will develop strong ties with the Warp. Even in the Word Bearers books themselves only the possesed and the Apostles showed heavy ties to the warp. Amoung warbands like the Iron Warriors and Night Lords is even less.